My Cargo bike build.

[Nealh]

I was going to put this under the 'Conversion kits heading' but decided this heading as it is a cargo bike.
My Kona Ute has been waiting for conversion and still is.

The Ute in Burgundy finish.


This arrived today well packaged up, 10 days from ordering.


Opened up to find!!!
Supposedly 48v 250w no 250w marking , only a 48v sticker.
Will have to add an authentic 250w sticker.


Now waiting for AliExp conductive heat pads to arrive.

 

[egroover]

She's a beaut, good luck with the build. Have you decided on battery location, a few options I guess.

 

[Nealh]

My planned 48v new bottle style battery case won't fit in the diamond, it is far larger then I envisaged. My 12s diy bottle battery with HG2's which I use with the Cotic fits in the diamond so will see how the tsdz2 works with that and the lvc.
I could mount the 48v battery on the rear flat board tight up against the seat post but prefer not to as the CofG is a bit high, the other option is in the space behind the seat tube.

 

[Nealh]

If I decide on a new battery build I'm undecided on cells, it all depends on battery placement.
There's not much in a price of cells 3p12s of 15/20a China brand good cells for £90 - £110 or 2p13s of 30a top notch 21700's for < £118.

 

[AndyBike]

 

[Bikes4two]

• Nice one @Nealh - I've been waiting to see how the build goes since you first mentioned it.
• Your observations of the TSDZ2 will I know, be credible observations rather than some of the flimflammery that abounds in some quarters.
• Will you be venturing into the realms of Open Source Firmware? I've got OSF on my own motor but it's still stock on the 3 other motors and one thing is for sure, the OSF motor is quieter than the stock firmware ones.
• The 250w sticker - I had a right old debate on the Cycling UK forum with some geezer who thought that because his TSDZ2 had the said sticker that it meant his motor would not exceed 250w - he clearly had not looked in the mysteries of this particular topic, let alone what over voltage and open source software could achieve
• I know you have strong views on cooling the motor and I look forward to seeing what you do with the cooling pads etc.
• Oh yes - - nice bike - I don't think I've ever seen a UTE in the flesh - it's quite a machine by the looks of things.

 

[Nealh]

The pic was in late eve westerly sun aspect so a it of a glean from it also taken on my rubbish phone cam, in the flesh it looks nice.

• Yes osf I shall try and venture into, IF I can upload the programmes to my w10 laptop.
• I have swizz's thread saved. I'm quite interested in some of the PAS settings and the hybrid PAS mode looks like it might be worth a try.
• Going to stick with vlcd5 and have a few extra screen details like voltage, internal motor temp and watts.
• Initially I will go with internal motor temp on a small external led screen.

The pliable heat conduction pads arrived to day only 15 days from China so pretty good, how reliable the 17 Wm/K rating is who knows ?
Though am still waiting on some other its like copper heat sinks and some copper wire balls/pads.

 

[Nealh]

I ordered some copper sheet , 2p nickel plated steel H strip and 21700 insulator rings to day as have decided for the extra cost in total of £7 or so to go with 21700 cells.

For 2p 13s the stand out cell is the moli p42 and out performs the Sam 40T by a bit.
With 2p of moli's at 8.4ah, I can get a very usable 7.2ah/320wh at 14a discharge which is way over my needs with a lvc of 3.3v

Mooches comparison graph at 10a per cell, my prediction is the tsdz2 will draw about 7/8a per cell max.

The lygte graph shows 12.3wh per cell at a 7a draw so a pair will be 24.6wh and 13s will be approx. 320wh to 3.3v.

 

[Nealh]

The use of pure nickel is no longer needed for spot welding over copper for interconnectors, a lot of the guys on ES have had great results using nickel plated steel in the copper sandwich method of welding and are producing stronger better welds requiring less joules and heating of the cells.

 

[Nealh]

A waiting for items from China/AliExp to arrive some heat mod bits for the motor and some battery build items such as ring insulators, 0.08mm copper sheet and some Ni plate steel for the interconnectors.
With copper one doesn't need to use pure Ni in the copper sandwich as the plated Ni offers up better spot welds with less welder current and amps/temp needed.

Cell wise I am now being steered towards the BAK 21700CG probably in 12s 2p guise , with a 3c rating a a pair can supply 30a which is way over the current a tsdzs2 requires and doubt I will need to ask for more then 250/300w max.
At approx. 300w that is a draw of 6.8a at 44v nominal. The 3c rating isn't recommended for cell life cycle but it is way over my needs but one gets a nice usable 8k mah from the 10k mah battery capacity with a good reserve so not to go to deep, my needs are a for 0.5c - <1c discharge per cell.
With the Cotic, g370 hub and towing I only ask for occasional max of 228w/6.3a at 36v for my undulating off road trail I use, so for 44v I only need 4.2a for trailer towing.

Notice how after the first 500mah the BAK starts to hold up against the 50e3 & M50a, the 50s cell has a much higher current rating & is better but also some 4x dearer and scarce. Initial reports also seem to say the 50S life cycle may not be too great.

 

[Nealh]

I made up the ST Link programming dongle today for pc to motor download.
One has to double check the pin out colours with a simple continuity check as some of the colours differ from lead to lead.

Pin out diagram.



Soldered together, where poss I keep the arduino wire colours the same except the White to orange for Gnd. Green and Yellow follow the std colour layout as the Data Rx/Tx for all kits I have seen.


Finally all joints heat shrunk over.

 

[Nealh]

When it comes to tech and downloading files here ,files there etc,etc I am generally very crap at it.
Taken me all afternoon trying to sort out the various downloads needed but think I have managed what is needed to start performing some OSF next week on the tsdz whilst waiting for Aliexp items to arrive.
I went by the guide lines that emmebrusa mentions on the github page and downloaded all that was mentioned on it.

Java runtime.
SDCC full version.
STvp - STM32 programme and the drivers within.
And the latest firmware V20.1C.2 now made available by emmebrusa .

 

[guerney]

Gosh, many parameters. Is the original firmware awful in use? Looks like a lot of hoops to jump through, compared with the bbs01b - the only trouble I had with the programming cable stemmed from using laptops and PCs containing very old USB controllers in their chipsets, which wouldn't connect on any port. No probs on my new PC build.

Home

TSDZ2 Open Source Firmware adapted to VLCD5-VLCD6-XH18 displays - emmebrusa/TSDZ2-Smart-EBike-1

github.com

Tsdz2 firmware open source adapted to vlcd5, vlcd6 and xh18 - Page 42 - Endless Sphere

 

[Nealh]

The original firmware isn't bad just the new OSF ones refines the use a bit better and allows one to enable some elements. For instance with the new firmware added one can add show more data on the stock screens, for me voltage is quite crucial as it motor temp, but one also can add cadence as well and in total six forms of data on screen on a an auto scroll menu.
One can set battery values for a more accurate idea of consumption, lvc, cell count series, wh etc, etc and a slight increase of range by making a few adjustments. Even 10% range increase can be a bonus.

 

[guerney]

The original firmware isn't bad just the new OSF ones refines the use a bit better and allows one to enable some elements. For instance with the new firmware added one can add show more data on the stock screens, for me voltage is quite crucial as it motor temp, but one also can add cadence as well and in total six forms of data on screen on a an auto scroll menu.
One can set battery values for a more accurate idea of consumption, lvc, cell count series, wh etc, etc and a slight increase of range by making a few adjustments. Even 10% range increase can be a bonus.

That sounds much better at the get go, than how my bbs01b arrived set up - it was a horrible ride, unsafe in U-turns, awful all round. But after a thorough brainwashing, now perfect

 

[Nealh]

Every thing has arrived now, the last little bit to do was the lm35 heat sensor.
So I have wired/soldered the pin up as per the Wiki page, read to splice and install on to the pcb.

So bravely I opened the stvp file downloaded and set the page up to read the desired info/files, connected and hooked up the ST v2 dongle to the pc and motor.
And I get the error reading codes when selecting the ' read/current' option on all three files, damn turn off and unplug.

If one has an issue then one gets;
. error cannot communicate with the tool. This mean the STv2 dongle isn't being read.
I double check the connections Gnd, swim, RST & 5v with my meter on continuation mode to ensure the pins outs are correct they are.
The leads are short as indicated by various sources, I check mine against 3 or 4 I find on line and they appear fine.

I reconnect same error codes, so I look and see what I'm doing different. Not a lot by the looks of it, like Eco cycles web site I'm using a usb extender between dongle and motor. I decide may be this connection is bad or the usb lead is way to long so disconnect it and need to plug the dongle direct into the pc by laying the motor on the floor along with the pc and myself.

I gingerly open the program files again, check configuration is correct and then plug the dongle back in. I hold my breath select the 'read tab ' & then 'current' and bingo we have success and the matrix of numbers appear on the screen. At this point the dongle led also goes from red to blue. I save the three stock firmware files to memory which are ' program memory', 'data memory' & 'option byte'.
In each of the three one has to select 'read' & 'current' to display the files.
Simply use the save option on each tab to keep the stock files to record and label them accordingly so one knows what they are.

No pics but will do so tomorrow maybe as I shall venture in to seeing if the OSF loads up.

 

[guerney]

Ah, USB leads too long sometimes do cause data transfer problems! I have to use a 0.25m USB lead to connect with some devices, else nada and zilch. There's no mention of Baud Rate on those screens, which is very low with the Bafang USB connection: 9600 bits per second, copes with that longer cable.

 

[Nealh]

Tomorrow will be an attempt to upload the new emmebrusa firmware v.20.1C. 2 version.
But first I will have to 100% test that the controller is the old version and not the new one. Physically looking at the pcb it looks like the old type, by metering between Gnd & swim one should see 5v. The new versions shows 0v.

 

[guerney]

Tomorrow will be an attempt to upload the new emmebrusa firmware v.20.1C. 2 version.
But first I will have to 100% test that the controller is the old version and not the new one. Physically looking at the pcb it looks like the old type, by metering between Gnd & swim one should see 5v. The new versions shows 0v.

If it's the new controller: will you have a shiny new brick, after overwriting the original firmware with the OSF? Can you backup the original firmware and roll back? If not, are old version controllers available to buy separately?

 

[guerney]

Hmmm... the very last entry on this page by "Simon" on March 6th 2022, looks like a total bricking or some other type of calamity, or as well as:

TongSheng TSDZ2 what Firmware options are there?

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