Maybe the Bosch bike for me.....

[eddieo]

Sold our pair of Wispers last week to a couple that I am sure will enjoy them as much as we have sorry to see them go...sob,sob...

DaaHub kit for new Specialised (Crosstrail Ltd disk) being picked up tomorrow! I cant wait! The bike is superb enough on its own, lovely and light, with excellent suspension and smooth XT gears. I feel confident that the wisper magic will transform it to the kind of E bike I have always desired. Light weight (approx 19kg) short wheelbase and battery in frame and easily lifted on to motorhome bike rack.

I am going to try a Bosch powered bike as I think this will give more enjoyment having two very different systems, and I think the Bosch is quickly establishing itself as the crank drive system of choice in Europe, if the German e bike chatter is anything to go by.

I have 2 bikes in mind both from KTM. I can get them from Belgian KTM dealer probably not until September.

My question is which one? I think the cheaper Trekking with 8 gear hub (£1700) looks more comfortable to me, and will probably be up to the job...

KTM BIKE INDUSTRIES

Or the Macina 29 with 11 gear Alfina hub, better spec (£2150) but more of an off road style?

KTM BIKE INDUSTRIES

These bikes are a lot cheaper then the only available Bosch bikes available here right now, there are some nice bikes from the likes of Stevens etc.... but these are probably even more difficult to source as the interest in these Bosch bikes is very strong in Germany.....

anyway i would like your opinions on these 2 bikes please

 

[trex]

hello eddieo, can the Bosch system be adapted to have a twist and go throttle? and do the cranks always move when the motor is engaged?

 

[eddieo]

hello eddieo, can the Bosch system be adapted to have a twist and go throttle? and do the cranks always move when the motor is engaged?

No its a crank drive system a bit like the Panasonic? So not twist and go throttle im afraid, but you need to try a crank drive bike to fully apprecuiate what a wondeful system it is......I would have a Swiss flyer X series tommorow (if I could afford one) and not give a toss about a throttle!

as for second part of your question I would think so, or else you aint going to get anywhere are you? if I have misunderstood your qusetion (easily done) please forgive me

 

[tillson]

Both nice looking bikes eddio. The only things that I can comment on from personal experience are the brakes and gears.

Brakes: I see that the lower spec bike has Magura HS11 rim brakes. Whilst these are much easier to set up and perform better than cable operated brakes, they have an annoying and fundamental flaw. By Magura's own admission, a minute differential in friction in the slave cylinders will throw them out of adjustment. You will find that as you try to adjust them for pad wear, all of the adjustment will be on one slave cylinder, not both as it should be. The net result of this will be one pad skimming the rim, the other a good distance away as the pads wear. It only takes a microscopic difference in cylinder friction to cause this and it has happens on my bike, first the front wheel, now the rear is starting to do it.

The pads last well though and they seem to be kind on the rims.

Gears: I find the Shimano Alfine 8 Speed hub gear totally reliable with an adequate range of ratios for just about anything. It complements a crank drive very well and is virtually maintenance free. Just ride and forget about it. I dont know about the 11 speed hub.

Bosch? I never buy or fly a Mk 1 anything. It could turn out to be the power system of choice though, who knows.

 

[eddieo]

many jumping of their BionX and Flyers on to these bikes, so the trend is already there...... Not in the UK unfortunately as we are the last to get anything! I think there is enough info out there to make a decision and I need a second bike.....

Thanks for tha advice on the brakes, I will have to learn I guess or thankfully very good bike shop 1 mile from my house! There is over £500 difference in these 2 bikes, so costs have to be cut somewhere. The cheaper bike has Shimano Nexus 8 Premium not the Alfina...But with the Premium I dont think there is much difference between that and the Alfina?

but do you think cheaper Trekking would be more comfortable? That is my main concern (I can afford either bike)

 

[eddieo]

Oop's double post.....

 

[tillson]

The Nexus Premium and Alfine are virtually identical, so I am lead to believe.

It's hard to say much about comfort, but as I'm sure you already know, best to try them out.

 

[eddieo]

The Nexus Premium and Alfine are virtually identical, so I am lead to believe.

It's hard to say much about comfort, but as I'm sure you already know, best to try them out.

if I want one I have to order blind as 2011 batch already sold out (2012 due September fingers crossed) more expensive bike is a 26inch MTB isn't it? while the trekking is more relaxed style frame? (you can adjust the handle bars as well by the look of it)

 

[andyh2]

Just looking at pics and specs, ie no experience of these models......
There's £250 price difference in the forks alone if buying them separately. I suspect the Cross forks will be adequate for the road (actually I suspect you'd be better off with a decent steel rigid fork instead!) whereas the 29er forks should cope well off road. Add in the disc brakes and Alfine 11 and you can see where the price difference is.

The 29er will likely have better tyre clearances so you can choose thinner tyres for road or proper mtb size for off road. Having said that cross size tyres are a good compromise for mixed on / off road riding.

I can't see how the 29er chain is tensioned. Is there an eccentric BB?

I've seen a couple of ride reports of Alfine 11 that are pretty good, but a few question marks especially over how low a gear it will take. (CTC site has one here;
CTC Forum • View topic - Shimano Alfline 11 speed IG - anyone else excited?)

That's a good position for the battery, a bigger capacity one would be good.

What are the battery replacement costs?

I like the look of both of those (though 29er would be out of my budget) do you have any links to reviews of these and Bosch system generally (in English!)? and where would you get it from?

 

[flecc]

do the cranks always move when the motor is engaged?

There's a freewheel on the chainwheel in these crank systems so any momentary overrun on the motor does not snatch at the cranks and pull the pedals away from the feet if pedalling is stopped. Otherwise, since it's necessary to pedal to get power, most of the time both are working together.

 

[NRG]

I wouldn't buy a mark 1 of anything either if possible but putting that aside I don't like the way the motor unit is mounted...slung underneath the frame like that looks odd and vulnerable. Much prefer the inverted mounting of the Haibike, I would wait until more bikes with that mounting appear on the market.

 

[eddieo]

No reviews that I can find, but lots on chatter over on German pedelec forum Google Translate

another bike has raised its not so ugly head and may be available in the UK is a Scott sportster, looks smashing in photos.....but it is more expensive.

SCOTT E Sportster Men - Bike E-Bike

 

[lemmy]

The cheaper bike has Shimano Nexus 8 Premium not the Alfina...But with the Premium I dont think there is much difference between that and the Alfina?

They are identical except for the ability to take a disk brake.

The Bosch looks nice but I use my Pedelec for camera haulage, not sport, so I'd be needing an upright version with panniers, dynamo etc. I shall keep a look out....the trouble(!) is my Tasman looks set to last forever

Out of interest, does the Bosch unit have any USP over the Panasonic or vice versa?

 

[trex]

Made in Germany - add 500 Euros?

 

[eddieo]

Made in Germany - add 500 Euros?

Not sure what you mean, but if its that they are more expensive being European? yes possibly, as they will cost more to produce, but are they any better should be the more important factor...... Kalkhoff/Flyer/Raleigh/ E Motion etc...are all European bikes

Lemmy not sure what USP means? For me I have always wanted an e bike with a normal wheelbase and battery within triangle, and basically up till now only the BionX has managed that. The 36v system is reportedly more powerful with better acceleration then the Panasonic as well....

 

[trex]

If (when) I have an ebike, I would like it to look like a normal bike as much as possible. Sadly, the battery gives the game away, especially when mounted within the triangle (perhaps with the exception of water bottle batteries).

 

[eddieo]

If (when) I have an ebike, I would like it to look like a normal bike as much as possible. Sadly, the battery gives the game away, especially when mounted within the triangle (perhaps with the exception of water bottle batteries).

That make no sense to me but you are not alone in this........I ride an E bike so what?

its simply that low down within the triangle is probably best position for a heavy battery.....

 

[trex]

Mum.. look! that man rides an electric bike!
Why want to attract (possibly unflattering) attention?

 

[flecc]

Lemmy not sure what USP means?

Unique Selling Point, an advantageous physical feature, performance or subjective factor which isn't shared by the competition.

 

[lemmy]

Thanks Flecc.

Sorry, Eddie. So much jargon about these days, I found myself using it without realising.