Maintenance Advised...

[PatH]

This is a bugbear of mine, why is it necessary for this nagging message to appear on the screen from now on until I take it to the dealer to get it cleared?

It's not like some modern cars which can be driven until a service indicator appears based on multiple engine sensors and then it needs an oil change and things.

I take care of the bike mechanicals, it's running well, last time the message appeared (1800 miles ago) I had to take it in for a warranty fix and clearing the message was free but now it's out of warranty it won't be. A £30 charge to 'update' the firmware, not to mention hacking it from the South Coast to North London (forty quid rail ticket thanks British Rail).

Just seems like a manufacturer tie in to keep you spending a bit of cash, it was already bloody expensive to buy.

 

[soundwave]

id call it extortion my lbs wants 45 quid to plug in a usb plug and press enter

 

[Nealh]

A couple of options comes to mind.
1. Don't join the merry go round by buying a Bosch, Yamaha, Steps bike.
2. Do what Eddie does move the bikes on out of warranty and start again.

 

[flecc]

A Sparta problem, the earlier Ion M-gear had to have a reset at a dealers even if only the rear wheel was removed for a tube change etc.

I won't buy anything with this sort of nuisance software, rules out a number of cars for me.
.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

It's only a message put there by the dealer. You can just ignore it. If you do go to a dealer to have it removed, tell them that you don't want it to come back.

 

[soundwave]

eService:

Bike clean

Gear and brake adjustment and alignment

Headset adjust

Full bolt check

Chain clean and lube

Tyre pressure and inspection

£35


Ebike servicing
SERVICING


ebike diagnostics:


Bosch - updates and diagnostic - £45

Steps - updates and diagnostic - £35

Yamaha - updates and diagnostic - £35

they want more to sit on there ass and plug a wire in and look at a lap top pmsl

 

[mike killay]

A Sparta problem, the earlier Ion M-gear had to have a reset at a dealers even if only the rear wheel was removed for a tube change etc.

I won't buy anything with this sort of nuisance software, rules out a number of cars for me.
.

If we had decent politicians they would protect us from this sort of rip off.
But they are far more interested in squabbling amongst themselves, they really are like children.

 

[georgehenry]

I have never got messages like that on the Yamaha display in over 8000 miles. Maybe it is a Bosch thing. Very Germanic.

 

[anotherkiwi]

This is a bugbear of mine, why is it necessary for this nagging message to appear on the screen from now on until I take it to the dealer to get it cleared?

It's not like some modern cars which can be driven until a service indicator appears based on multiple engine sensors and then it needs an oil change and things.

I take care of the bike mechanicals, it's running well, last time the message appeared (1800 miles ago) I had to take it in for a warranty fix and clearing the message was free but now it's out of warranty it won't be. A £30 charge to 'update' the firmware, not to mention hacking it from the South Coast to North London (forty quid rail ticket thanks British Rail).

Just seems like a manufacturer tie in to keep you spending a bit of cash, it was already bloody expensive to buy.

I have been using open source since 1997, no way was I going to buy a closed e-bike system I couldn't muck about with in my shed... (virtual shed, real bedroom )

 

[mike killay]

I have been using open source since 1997, no way was I going to buy a closed e-bike system I couldn't muck about with in my shed... (virtual shed, real bedroom )

I really like the idea of an indoor shed!

 

[anotherkiwi]

3rd floor without a lift? A-ha! not so keen now eh Mike?

 

[flecc]

I have never got messages like that on the Yamaha display in over 8000 miles. Maybe it is a Bosch thing. Very Germanic.

The OP has a Sparta, their models from the Ion onwards have had what I'd call restrictive software, it being part of their own design direct drive rear hub motor.

The same applies to their other brand, Koga, which uses the same motor.
.

 

[Nealh]

I often use the indoor shed for working on bikes esp in the cold and wet.

 

[cyclebuddy]

eService:
ebike diagnostics:

Bosch - updates and diagnostic - £45
Steps - updates and diagnostic - £35
Yamaha - updates and diagnostic - £35

they want more to sit on there ass and plug a wire in and look at a lap top pmsl

You missed one:

Bafang MaxDrive - £ sod-all. No updates required. It's perfect as it is. If you want to fiddle, advanced fiddling = a £20 cable (a one-off purchase for life) and free software.

Max speed assist/current/power - User settable - no stupid £200 dongle required. The MaxDrive "service" announcement on the LCD? Entirely user settable - turn it on if you want a service reminder, or turn it off if it bugs you.

 

[PatH]

I can live with the message but sooner or later the back wheel will need to come off for a tyre replacement and according to the instructions this also can only be done by an authorised dealer.

Well, when that time comes we will see about that.

If the motor maintains integrity without the battery common sense dictates that there is no reason why carefully removing the wheel can in any way upset the electrics, there's no hidden electrical magic just a fuse where the battery power meets the motor.

I've also had intermittent handlebar button issues and rang the dealer about that, I was told that it is also a return to dealer replacement because of the bike security.

Really?

Get real.

The part itself is about £30 and I have taken it off the handlebars to have a look and it is a simple cable connecting to the display.

As an electronics design engineer in my time I cannot believe that the handlebar buttons have persistent, storage, and to what point.

It's just a bluff by the bike shop to justify some sort of expensive aftercare.

...They also want half an hour labour at £45p/h to 'install' this complicated piece of electronics.

They said they wouldn't send out the part because the whole bike really needs to be plugged in.

Enough said.

 

[flecc]

I can live with the message but sooner or later the back wheel will need to come off for a tyre replacement and according to the instructions this also can only be done by an authorised dealer.

Here's the official way of dealing with the wheel removal and replacement, originally posted by James at Sparta agents Just e-bikes:

There is no need for anyone competent in cycle maintenance to visit a Sparta dealer to fix a puncture: Disconnect the power feed; Remove the wheel; mend the puncture; put it back together.

The wheel nuts should be tightened to 35Nm then 50Nm. The latter happens to be about the same torque most cyclists would tighten a manual bike wheel nut to.

In the rare event that the e-bike does not perform as it did prior to mending the puncture, recalibrate the torque sensor by pressing and holding the light switch until “RECALIBRATED” appears on the Sparta’s display. That’s all there is to it.

The same applies to Kogas fitted with Accell 22Nm, 33Nm 40Nm or 45Nm series motors.
,

 

[wheeliepete]

I can live with the message but sooner or later the back wheel will need to come off for a tyre replacement and according to the instructions this also can only be done by an authorised dealer.

Well, when that time comes we will see about that.

If the motor maintains integrity without the battery common sense dictates that there is no reason why carefully removing the wheel can in any way upset the electrics, there's no hidden electrical magic just a fuse where the battery power meets the motor.

I've also had intermittent handlebar button issues and rang the dealer about that, I was told that it is also a return to dealer replacement because of the bike security.

Really?

Get real.

The part itself is about £30 and I have taken it off the handlebars to have a look and it is a simple cable connecting to the display.

As an electronics design engineer in my time I cannot believe that the handlebar buttons have persistent, storage, and to what point.

It's just a bluff by the bike shop to justify some sort of expensive aftercare.

...They also want half an hour labour at £45p/h to 'install' this complicated piece of electronics.

They said they wouldn't send out the part because the whole bike really needs to be plugged in.

Enough said.

I can understand your frustration with what appears to be blatant "money for nothing" behaviour, but you have bought a bike with a completely closed system designed to make the manufacture and dealers lots of after sales money in as many ways as they can think of.

 

[PatH]

Here's the official way of dealing with the wheel removal and replacement, originally posted by James at Sparta agents Just e-bikes:

There is no need for anyone competent in cycle maintenance to visit a Sparta dealer to fix a puncture: Disconnect the power feed; Remove the wheel; mend the puncture; put it back together.

The wheel nuts should be tightened to 35Nm then 50Nm. The latter happens to be about the same torque most cyclists would tighten a manual bike wheel nut to.

In the rare event that the e-bike does not perform as it did prior to mending the puncture, recalibrate the torque sensor by pressing and holding the light switch until “RECALIBRATED” appears on the Sparta’s display. That’s all there is to it.

The same applies to Kogas fitted with Accell 22Nm, 33Nm 40Nm or 45Nm series motors.
,

Thanks for that, it's as I thought, the fear about removing the wheel is just feeding paranoia and should never have been described as a 'DO NOT DO THIS'.

 

[PatH]

I'm going to order the handlebar buttons and do a tear down, the bike shop cannot refuse to sell me something that is in stock. Can they?

It will probably have one or 2 FPGA chips or an ASIC (more expensive), some surface mount components to smooth voltage regulation and the bubble switch buttons.

All read-only devices which are completely off the shelf, to think that Sparta have some special relationship with component manufactures is a step too far.

It's a £30 item, most of the money will be going on the overall design using decent plastics and bubble switches, and a weatherproof cable.


The circuit will be a standard design using components that cost about 2p in bulk.

 

[flecc]

Thanks for that, it's as I thought, the fear about removing the wheel is just feeding paranoia and should never have been described as a 'DO NOT DO THIS'.

This started with a botched launch of the Sparta Ion in the UK. When introduced in the Netherlands it had no gears and a 22 NM torque rating, ok in that flat country.

But they then sent it over here and reviewers lambasted it since single speed and minimal torque would never cut it in Britain. Sparta immediately withdrew it, added a derailleur and started sending that, calling it the Ion M-gear. Unfortunately it still only had 22 NM torque, leading to comments that the M stood for Dutch mountains!

And it did have a dealer only reset problem, since removing the rear wheel could upset the torque sensor and that model did not have the user recalibration feature. One unfortunate member bought a pair of those for him and his wife and suffered the wheel removal problem on his one, but the agent he bought from had dropped the agency and returned the software resetting item, leaving him stuck.

Eventually Sparta introduced the user recalibration feature and also increased the torque rating of the motor twice, finally making that model what it should have been in the first place.

All old history now and not affecting later models like yours, but of course the memories persist and not all keep up to date on the changes.
.