License for bikes ?

[danielrlee]

How have fines, and even prison sentences, stopped uninsured and unlicenced drivers?
Until there is a generally accepted movement that personal responsibility is cool, nothing will change.
Rather than a punitive approach (which demonstrably doesn't work) an encouragement of self elected communal wish for things to be better. Instead of, "THEY should do something about it", this is what I do. In other words, lead by example.
Shout, rant and make as many knee jerk laws as you like, a bad/sociopathic attitude is still exactly that, and the perveyor of such will carry on, even to his/her own detriment.

You draw a good parallel to drink driving. Laws did little to stop it, but changes in social attitude brought about the reductions we have seen throughout the last decade.

 

[soundwave]

https://www.gloucestershirelive.co.uk/news/gloucester-news/my-friend-died-doing-this-2701731

Reports of young people lying down in the road as a joke have been coming in.

 

[flecc]

Rather than a punitive approach (which demonstrably doesn't work) an encouragement of self elected communal wish for things to be better. Instead of, "THEY should do something about it", this is what I do. In other words, lead by example.

Absolutely, change the language and attitudes, it always annoys when I see or hear comments about "battling through traffic" or "fighting for road space". Likewise I dislike the unqualified mantra "speed kills". That sort of language shows wrong attitudes.

In my world and language we share road space. Implicit in that is that we give way to others as a matter of common courtesy, just as we give way as pedestrians when meeting in doorways etc.

The emphasis on correct road usage should not be one of only laws, but one of courtesy and consideration being the norm and not the exception as it so often is presently.
.

 

[vfr400]

The peer's suggestion is reasonable in theory, but as pointed out, would be difficult -- if not impossible -- to enforce in reality. I carry insurance; it's £20 a month, but it's cheaper than losing my home if I injure or kill someone by accident -- a 26kg bike (and 98kg rider) traveling at 15mph can do some damage to a human body if they suddenly occupy the same physical space. If the government mandated license plates on bikes I would go along. It would be a minor imposition.

£20 a month is £120 a year. I only pay £90 a year for my three motorcycles!

 

[trevor brooker]

If every vehicle on the road was subject to a number plate, an "irresponsible idiot" caught on video, and subjected to £1000 fine (employed, student, on benefits, etc), would surely have their attitude changed.

The idea behind ANPR & the concept of number plates are to allow collection of taxation, not catching of law breaking.

Think about it, you need traffic police to enforce road legislation.

A licence plate is just a bit of plastic with some numbers on it, any criminal can easily find a way around it, all that happens is an image of that vehicle & plate is recorded, but no action can be taken until someone is able to physically restrain the user (who could easily have multiple sets of licence plates).

Government data shows that road surveys showed unlicensed vehicles on the road increasing from 0.6% (2013) 1.4% (2015) to 1.8% (2017) https://assets.publishing.service.gov.uk/government/uploads/system/uploads/attachment_data/file/659918/vehicle-excise-duty-evasion-statistics-2017.pdf

So about 2% of road vehicles are unlicensed & probably uninsured/ no valid driving licence. That actually feels about right if I consider the number of really inconsiderate/bad drivers who are dangerous when I am cycling.

Enforcement of existing laws is all that is required, not an opportunity for government to increase bureaucracy & introduce additional taxation to pay for this supposed safety enhancement.

 

[Fat Rat]

£20 a month is £120 a year. I only pay £90 a year for my three motorcycles!

Try again

 

[vfr400]

Try again

Woosh was right about my maths then. £240 is unbeleivable for a bike that can only do 15.5 mph and wouldn't even put a dent in a car if it hit one. How can that be acceptable when I can get fully comprehensive insurance for three motorbikes that can all go well over 100 mph, and includes cover for any passengers that I damage when doing so?

 

[RossG]

Pity you can't come shopping with me down Tesco's vrf, I'd get an even bigger discount than I already get.

 

[flecc]

Woosh was right about my maths then. £240 is unbeleivable for a bike that can only do 15.5 mph and wouldn't even put a dent in a car if it hit one. How can that be acceptable when I can get fully comprehensive insurance for three motorbikes that can all go well over 100 mph, and includes cover for any passengers that I damage when doing so?

The insurance companies don't like anything that isn't in the DVLA lists of type approved motor vehicles and always charge high in those cases in case of any unknown risks.

Silly of course in this case, but it's just an insurance precaution.
.

 

[Steve Bowles]

I don't know how you can stop bad cyclists, or drivers, without putting them down. People break the law with impunity in this country. There is no criminal justice system. The 19-year old punk who killed the mother of three because he had no breaks on the front wheel of his bike showed no remorse whatsoever, and was out of jail in six months. He had to be prosecuted under a 19th century horse & buggy law. Until dangerous cyclists and drivers are punished -- really punished, we're all going to be eyed by the public as public dangers. Think like a Roman general; act like a Roman general.

 

[vfr400]

Pity you can't come shopping with me down Tesco's vrf, I'd get an even bigger discount than I already get.

I'll be at Pitsea Tesco mid morning tomorrow if it helps.

 

[soundwave]

but what about the Kamikaze dog walkers and phone zombies lol

 

[RossG]

I'll be at Pitsea Tesco mid morning tomorrow if it helps.

Pity you're not closer I'd take you up on that and get you 10% off your shopping as well.
I'm on the coast in Hampshire, I don't think my battery would get me to Essex.

 

[anotherkiwi]

Yesterday coming home on the bridge I had a close encounter with a phone zombie. She was walking alongside a couple so three abreast I had no way of passing so I stopped. She almost walked into the front wheel before she noticed me (both headlights were on!) and almost jumped out of her skin. The lady alongside her split herself laughing and I got the look that kills...

A licence for pedestrians with phones might be a good idea?

Time in jail for drivers who squeeze past where there is no space is high on my list, had a few over the weekend.

France has also had a cut back in the number of police doing the beat like they did back in the day. Since there are automatic speed cameras there are no traffic patrols and drivers are constantly breaking the law: stop signs not respected, 30 km/h speed limit in my neighbourhood where the streets are narrow and twisty with little visibility, solid white line not respected (WTF are you doing on my side of the road you...), etc. etc, the list goes on and on. Over the length of a day all these tiny misdemeanours add up and make walking, riding or even driving really tiresome. I am not perfect but I do make an effort to respect others - that generally involves respecting traffic law.

11 km from here everything changes, Spain has kept a police presence on the streets for various reasons and getting about is so restful!