Lafree Twist Battery not Charging Fully

[Calomax]

On Tuesday after refreshing and charging Lafree Twist Comfort battery, for about 20 hours, it only went up to 3 LEDs. So after my 6 miles ride to work and back I put it back on charge overnight and it again only went to 3 leds.

I put it on charge again at lunchtime on Wednesday and as i didn't need it yesterday, I left it on until this morning, by which time it had reached 4 leds. It always charged fully in only a few hours.

The battery was new last year after the original had been replaced under guarantee.

Could this be a charger problem or is this battery also on the way out please?

 

[flecc]

It's the well known charger problem with these Calomax. Replugging the charger into the battery each time it cuts out early will gradually allow it to reach a full charge, but the real answer is a replacement charger. If it's out of guarantee, a new one from Giant will cost roughly £120, but you can avoid that high cost. The details are on my Lafree Twist website here.

The price for the USA supplied 3 amp version has risen slightly since I published that web page, but the 1.8 amp version can also do the job. If Tony Castles hasn't got that charger, don't accept a substitute, the Giant battery is fussy about chargers. Instead use Powerstream in the USA who are a dependable supplier of the version I recommend.
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[Calomax]

Thanks flecc, After looking at your website I went to powerstream.com/ and found 2 choices:

PST-3PN9530-24-1.8A
PST-3PN9530-24-3A

Is it the 3A version I should order?

What about the connector, The Powerstream site says "Output options included 3 pin connector standard, others on request" Do you know if they can supply the Twist connector or would I have to convert it using the connector from my old charger?

Sorry to be asking questions that may be obvious but I know little about these things except I usually just charge it when it's needed and refresh it about once a month.

thanks again

 

[flecc]

No problem, happy to help.

I prefer the 3 amp version and it's worth the little extra. They won't be able to supply the correct plug for the Twist battery though. For some odd reason Panasonic designed in a non-standard 7 pin DIN connector, the standard one doesn't have a centre pin, and I've been unable to find a source anywhere.

So you'll have to re-use the connector from the old charger, and if you go to the User Instructions link on the webpage I gave you, all the connection details are there for various ways of doing it, plus how to use the charger as it doesn't come with instructions.

If anything isn't clear, please just ask.
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[Calomax]

Thank again flecc, I've printed your instructions and will be getting my order off over the weekend.

I'm delighted that I stumbled across this website.

 

[subevo]

yes thanks to flecc for finding the charger.i also had the same problem.i mistakingly bought the 1800ma charger and can confirm it works perfectly if moneys tight.

 

[Calomax]

Thanks for that subevo, and info for flecc, I have ordered the 3 amp version from Powerstream at £49 including postage.

 

[flecc]

yes thanks to flecc for finding the charger.i also had the same problem.i mistakingly bought the 1800ma charger and can confirm it works perfectly if moneys tight.

Glad that helped Subevo. Others have also found the 1.8 amp version works ok, as it's the thermistor sensing circuit that's the critical part and that's the same in both versions.

The 3 amp just has a bit more headroom and if cells over 12 Ah become available eventually, it would handle those as well.
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[Calomax]

Perhaps I was a little premature ordering the new charger. Mine has been working fine again, but I presume that having given trouble once, it could do so again at any time.

 

[flecc]

That's how my own one went originally Calomax, and at first I wasn't sure if it was a fault or just poor connections, but as it gradually became more frequent and the charge getting shorter each time, the fault was obvious.

A search showed this was a known and common problem, but at the time I was happy with Giant's temporary replacement, a superb charger from Metco at £75.

Trouble was, Giant went back to the Panasonic which had supposedly been fixed, but which hadn't. That's when I went looking for a more reliable replacement despite having the Metco, which was no longer available since they only modified a few to suit the Twist.
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[Calomax]

I guessed that was the case, There aren't many mechanical things that put themselves right on their own. What was annoying was that I contacted Giant when I bought the bike because I had heard rumours of problems, and they denied that there were any problems with the chargers. But I have had it 3 years trouble free, except for a battery that was replaced free of charge even though it was out of the very meagre 3 months guarantee. Thanks again for putting me onto the charger so I don't have to buy another Panasonic one.

 

[flecc]

A pleasure Calomax. Suppliers often go into denial when asked about known problems, just hoping they'll go away! But Giant can't hide the rush stopgap order they had to place with Metco of Taiwan to get them out of trouble while Panasonic tried to sort out the problems.

Even A to B Magazine who've tested every Twist series model and owned two of them have suffered the charger failure which they've reported publicly in the magazine.
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[frank9755]

I agree, the denial of the problem is in many ways more infuriating than the actual problem.

My own experience was that I bought an ex-demo Lafree from a dealer (who I won't name here) and asked him specifically if the charger was ok - as I had read about the problem here and in AtoB. He not only assured me the charger he was selling me was ok but went on to say that he had sold many of the bikes and had never heard of anyone having problems with it! I then pointed out to him that, live on eBay at the time, one of his own customers who said he had regularly had his bike serviced by the dealer was selling a Lafree with a charger which he reported as having the cutting out fault!

Foolishly I went ahead with the purchase, got the bike home, discovered the fault and began the tedious process of negotiating to return it.

Frank

 

[oznog]

alternative charger replacement

That's how my own one went originally Calomax, and at first I wasn't sure if it was a fault or just poor connections, but as it gradually became more frequent and the charge getting shorter each time, the fault was obvious.

A search showed this was a known and common problem, but at the time I was happy with Giant's temporary replacement, a superb charger from Metco at £75.

Trouble was, Giant went back to the Panasonic which had supposedly been fixed, but which hadn't. That's when I went looking for a more reliable replacement despite having the Metco, which was no longer available since they only modified a few to suit the Twist.
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Hi just a fyi, when I brought my lite/ (twist) back from NYCE wheels they supplied me with a dual voltage charger for $149(USD) it is a bionix charger adapted with the giant plug on the end so that is another option for folks who don't want the giant charger. However there is no refresh option on this. (I use the panasonic one for this no problems yet

 

[flecc]

Thanks for the information oznog. As you've found, the Panasonic charger's discharge function continues to work ok even after it's charging side has failed.

Where's there's a choice, the best bet for a new one is the Powerstream one though, not only the cheapest option but with fan cooled discharging function as well, something few chargers have.
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[Calomax]

Thanks again for your help flecc. My charger has finally arrived after 6 weeks. It arrived in the UK on 3rd September and was delivered by Parcelforce on 21st September. Sods Law, Powerstream was starting to chase it on that day.

My only worry is that 120 volt is ticked on the end of the box. But Powerstream's online catalogue specifies it as 100 to 260 volt so I guess it's ok to use it on 240 volt. I haven't got round to changing the connectors over yet as my charger is behaving itself again. It's only occasionally failing to charge the battery fully.

 

[flecc]

They are normally 100 to 260 volt, Calomax, so that should be ok if the correct one was chosen as described, either 1.8 or 3 amp.
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[Calomax]

It's the PST-3PN9530-24-3A, so I'm sure that's the right one

 

[flecc]

Yes that's definitely it, and as we know, specified as 100 to 260 volt. The 120 volt suitability marking could be just to satisfy US regulations, like all the stickers etc that we have to have on our electrical equipment.
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[Calomax]

Great, thanks again flecc