Krieger vs Zephyr-B

Hi all,

Sorry, long post. if the issue has been discussed before, please guide me with links, thanks!

I am a total noob. Yesterday I went to try a couple of e-bikes in a park, got so excited that did not notice I was about to collide with people. Squeezed the brakes really hard, overdid on the front brake and went flying over the wheel. That is how noobish I am. Landing on the ground at 15+mph is not pleasant at all. Yet still I am not discouraged. :-)

Ok, I am deciding between the two woosh bikes: Krieger vs Zephyr-B.

Zephyr-B seems more modern - better suspension (no rear suspension on Krieger, which is kinda mitigated by seat upgrade), disk brakes on both wheels powered by hydraulics (only front disk brake on Krieger an no hydraulics), it's foldable and its 3 kilo less heavy than Krieger.

Krieger has a crank drive motor, which is more efficient with those 8 gears (Zephyr-B though also has a decent geared hub motor and I don't have extreme hills to cover). Krieger has a 1.5x capacity battery compared to Zephyr-B (my commute both ways is 6.6 miles, but bigger battery allows to travel elsewhere occasionally (to neighboring villages), charge it less frequently and, as capacity deteriorates with usage, Krieger will still offer plenty of juice, while Zephyr-B might be reduced to every day charge).

Krieger has much better mudguards, has a rack on the back. has a new, apparently even more powerful crank motor with upgraded 20A controller.

Foldability of Zephyr-B could be handy as I live in a small flat on the second floor. However, it seems like there is space to store Krieger, though in a much less convenient way. A foldable bike is perhaps easier to bring upstairs, and Zephyr-B is lighter. However I have read online, that one could use gentle throttling when on the stairs, so the bike takes itself up with apparently no effort from the owner (just guidance). I don't have a car, so no need of foldability for that.

So lighter weight of Zephyr-B becomes less of an advantage.

Basically, it seems like Krieger with it's efficient motor, beefy battery an controller is rather an electric scooter, with not so nice brakes and with a prospect of aukward and inconvenient storage at home.

Zephyr-B appears as a modern bike, but with limited range, that could become an issue as the battery deteriorates.

decisions, decisions...

any thoughts, dear forum dwellers?

_VWV_

the zephyr-B is slightly better.

zephyr-B has better shocks, better brakes, better weight distribution and can fold. The rear BPM hub motor is very forgiving and gives better comfort too.

the zephyr-B is slightly better.

zephyr-B has better shocks, better brakes, better weight distribution and can fold. The rear BPM hub motor is very forgiving and gives better comfort too.

Thank you for your thoughts. Perhaps for a noob, messing with gear shift on a crank drive motor is a yet another distraction point. My commute is mostly flat according to google, so no real need for a crank drive.

oh, one more question on Zephyr-B though. The battery inserts inside the frame, so perhaps it's a custom battery sort of. I was wondering, would I be able to buy a spare one in 4-5 years? How widespread is the Zephyrs battery form factor? Any ideas?

_VWV_

The Krieger has standard downtube battery, you can always replace it by any 36V downtube battery, so that's an advantage.

The zephyr-B battery case is less often seen but still a very popular case for folding bikes with in-frame battery.

https://www.google.co.uk/search?q=folding+e-bike+with+in-frame+battery&source=lnms&tbm=isch&biw=1200&bih=648

Just scroll down the page a bit, you'll see other bikes with same battery. You'll recognize them by the black handle that you use to pull out the battery. This case format is currently specific to 36V 10AH. By next year, that would be 11.6AH.

http://i.ebayimg.com/00/s/MTYwMFgxMDY2/z/8ggAAOSw0vBUjGIV/$_1.JPG

http://wooshbikes.co.uk/2014/zephyr-b/zephyr-b-battery-380.jpg

Just scroll down the page a bit, you'll see other bikes with same battery. You'll recognize them by the black handle that you use to pull out the battery. This case format is currently specific to 36V 10AH. By next year, that would be 11.6AH.

Great, thanks a lot for the links. I now see that Zephyrs form factor is pretty common indeed. Chances are that in 4-5 years I will be able to find a replacement. Maybe the choice would be limited, maybe for that reason I would have to pay a bit more in comparison with a similar downtube battery, but the key thing is I will be able to replace it.

Thanks!

_VWV_

Hi all,

 

Sorry, long post. if the issue has been discussed before, please guide me with links, thanks!

 

I am a total noob. Yesterday I went to try a couple of e-bikes in a park, got so excited that did not notice I was about to collide with people. Squeezed the brakes really hard, overdid on the front brake and went flying over the wheel. That is how noobish I am. Landing on the ground at 15+mph is not pleasant at all. Yet still I am not discouraged.

 

Ok, I am deciding between the two woosh bikes: Krieger vs Zephyr-B.

 

Zephyr-B seems more modern - better suspension (no rear suspension on Krieger, which is kinda mitigated by seat upgrade), disk brakes on both wheels powered by hydraulics (only front disk brake on Krieger an no hydraulics), it's foldable and its 3 kilo less heavy than Krieger.

 

Krieger has a crank drive motor, which is more efficient with those 8 gears (Zephyr-B though also has a decent geared hub motor and I don't have extreme hills to cover). Krieger has a 1.5x capacity battery compared to Zephyr-B (my commute both ways is 6.6 miles, but bigger battery allows to travel elsewhere occasionally (to neighboring villages), charge it less frequently and, as capacity deteriorates with usage, Krieger will still offer plenty of juice, while Zephyr-B might be reduced to every day charge).

 

Krieger has much better mudguards, has a rack on the back. has a new, apparently even more powerful crank motor with upgraded 20A controller.

 

Foldability of Zephyr-B could be handy as I live in a small flat on the second floor. However, it seems like there is space to store Krieger, though in a much less convenient way. A foldable bike is perhaps easier to bring upstairs, and Zephyr-B is lighter. However I have read online, that one could use gentle throttling when on the stairs, so the bike takes itself up with apparently no effort from the owner (just guidance). I don't have a car, so no need of foldability for that.

 

So lighter weight of Zephyr-B becomes less of an advantage.

 

Basically, it seems like Krieger with it's efficient motor, beefy battery an controller is rather an electric scooter, with not so nice brakes and with a prospect of aukward and inconvenient storage at home.

Zephyr-B appears as a modern bike, but with limited range, that could become an issue as the battery deteriorates.

 

decisions, decisions...

 

any thoughts, dear forum dwellers?

 

_VWV_

Looks like you are the world expert on Woosh bikes,surprised that anyone could make a much better job of detailing them....you wouldn't care to add a website,address and phone No to complete the job.

And all done on 3 postings,hehe.

Hatti is normally more subtle,hehe.

KudosDave

Dear KudosDave,

Would you be so kind and confirm the following:

Are you trying to say that I am in some way affiliated with woosh, and hence my posts do not contain my noob questions, but were rather written with marketing/advertisement purpose, and hence everybody trying to help me are wasting there time?

Do I understand it right that you are affiliated with kudoscycles and your post reflects the corporate view on the matter and is not your private opinion?

Thank you in advance,

_VWV_

when i was in their Southend store i didnt even bother trying the folding bikes, they really dont appeal to me one bit but i guess that comes down to how much storage space you have at home for your bike.

If you have the space for a full size bike then no real need to compromise on a folding one unless you plan on taking it away in a car, personally i tried the Big Bear and the Krieger and ended up falling in love with the Krieger with its nicer looks and crank drive motor

Right, acm2000, thanks for your input.

Actually, after talking to my GF, we came to conclusion that 42 sq meters flat does not allow storage of a bike, unless it's folded. So I went for Zephyr. The motor is not great, the battery is smaller, but my commute is mot hilly and is short... But I admit, I would have probably gone for a foldable Krieger, if it were available.

Well... I guess I will sometimes have to pedal a bit, it's ok

Thanks everyone for your suggestions.

_VWV_

P.S. it is sad though that sometimes people come, sh@t in a forum thread, and when pressed against the wall with a few easy questions they sh@t in their pans. "An amazing" advertisement for the companies they represent!

VWV....The foregoing rude posting invited a response ,having thrown down a gauntlet you should not be surprised that I should pick it up,however you risk a response that you may not wish to hear. You describe yourself as a 'noob',my urban dictionary defines a noob as 'a newbie,especially a person who is new to an online community and whose online presentation and interactions display a lack of skill and knowledge,to the annoyance of the rest of the community',I have no argument with your description of yourself.

I stand by all my posting , if you glance you will see that I have contributed 2000 plus postings,with 300 plus likes to this forum some of that has been controversial but I have never resorted to swear words, I think it undermines the credibility of a conversation.

You are on posting 5...it is not unusual for a newbie to come onto the forum and be definite on one e-bike marque,to 'die' once the message has been achieved,rarely to be heard from again. Normally a genuine enquiry looks at alternatives before settling on a particular marque.

I think my name says all with regard to my position at Kudos and I am proud to put you clear on that point,trust that answers your questions.

Enjoy your bike choice.

Kudos 'not quaking in his boots' Dave. Hehe

Edited October 11, 201510 yr by Kudoscycles

Dear KudosDave,

Thank you for your copy/paste from urban dic. I stand corrected, English is not my native language. I should have written newbie. Thank you for confirming your affiliation.

Could you please find some courage, stop hiding behind general "I stand by all my words" and confirm that: "I am in some way affiliated with woosh, and hence my posts do not contain my newbie questions, but were rather written with marketing/advertisement purpose, and hence everybody trying to help me are wasting there time?" And since your original post in this thread was from an account clearly associated with kudoscycles, could you please confirm that: "your post reflects the corporate view on the matter and is not your private opinion".

Thank you once again in advance.

Dear All,

Should I post my review of the bike here or start another thread?

Actually 'noob' is not really English it is urban slang.

With regard to whether my comments are personal or Kudos corporate it makes little difference,I am the owner and MD of Rally Design which is the parent company of Kudoscycles....in direct speak I am the boss and free to speak my mind.

However,one of the refreshing features of the Pedelecs forum is that traders have been free to comment on postings on an equal level to e-bike customers. This feature is invaluable to those who wish to discuss e-bikes and ask questions of the professionals,to curtail that freedom would be detrimental to most enjoyment of the forum.

It has sometimes resulted in heated discussions in the past,lately maybe a little quiet but positives do come out .....the knowledge of throttles,legality,crank v hub are more widely discussed on this forum than anywhere else.

KudosDave

Dear KudosDave,

2438 posts, 394 likes , crank vs hub and the freedom that apparently someone is trying to curtail is all very interesting.

So far on this forum, apart from a few helpful comments I have seen the freedom to insult.

The fact that you are the boss of whatever does not allow you to say whatever you want, and you are still limited by law. Since you have kindly confirmed your affiliation to kudoscycles, it does make a difference if in your post on this thread, precisely this one, you expressed your own private opinion or corporate opinion of kudoscycles.

Hence I shall kindly ask you again if you could confirm that: "I am in some way affiliated with woosh, and hence my posts, precisely the first three of this thread, do not contain my newbie questions, but were rather written with marketing/advertisement purpose, and hence everybody trying to help me are wasting there time?" And since your original post in this thread was from an account clearly associated with kudoscycles, could you please confirm that: "your post reflects the corporate view on the matter and is not your private opinion".

Thank you very much in advance for the courage to clarify these 2 simple but important question.

Kind regards,

_VWV_

Erm, _VWV_, what are you trying to achieve here?

My guess is that he is implying he is going to sue for libel. Although someone saying that they think you are a representative of a company isn't really that defamatory, is it?

All seems very silly to me

Dear mfi197,

My intentions are transparent.

I am trying to clarify the two points in my previous post and we go from there. KudosDave has written a post that is very "suggestive" and can be interpreted in many ways, so I asked for the right interpretation and for the capacity of the speaker. As of now I have heard back lots of things, but not those 2. We compared 200 plus posts with 5, we heard of curtained freedom and we even know the person is not quaking in his boots.

_VWV_

Dudes, both Kudos and woosh make great bikes

Both offer something different, both competitively priced

Moral of the story is always have brown sauce on your bacon roll.

Dudes, both Kudos and woosh make great bikes

 

Both offer something different, both competitively priced

 

Moral of the story is always have brown sauce on your bacon roll.

I'm vegetarian. Are you oppressing me and saying I have to eat bacon?

Dear mfi197,

 

My intentions are transparent.

 

I am trying to clarify the two points in my previous post and we go from there. KudosDave has written a post that is very "suggestive" and can be interpreted in many ways, so I asked for the right interpretation and for the capacity of the speaker. As of now I have heard back lots of things, but not those 2. We compared 200 plus posts with 5, we heard of curtained freedom and we even know the person is not quaking in his boots.

 

_VWV_

Just get over it. So he thought you might be a plant - which does happen - so what?

He definitely doesn't have an English sense of humour does he?

Probably doesn't have sense of humour , full stop.

Probably doesn't have sense of humour , full stop.

He'll sue you for saying that ;-p

As a real newbie its interesting to hear from all, however looking into which bike to buy I find it a bit "one sided" comments from companies. In fact who the hell do I believe can give me true comments on a particular bike. Having been in sales and marketing for over 35 years I know as I was one who did what was needed to get sales.

You experienced members have over time learnt the hard way who is genuine and who is not.

The companies do indeed offer advice on specifics of components which is good.

Sadly for the guys like me who live miles from any shop where we can try we do rely heavily on your feedback as a forum. We have to buy online.

but maybe 6 months in I still dont have a bloody clue or any nearer to my personal goal. A folder preferably, for boat and campervan, good for hills as I live 1000ft up. under 1k, Its my first and reluctant to spend more at this point.

Woosh and kudos you keep saying in posts are members and have good warranty/reliability, which is good for online purchase.

But I`m lost, and to be honest this type of post whether jest or serious just makes me think deeper, Having been vw t4 forum member and mx5 members for years I know as one gets into the forum longer term the banter and jest is great. but at moment I`m struggling.

Not a critism of forum but expressing my present time thoughts.

thanks for all your comments so far to my posts.

Pete

I was two years looking & learning and then some. I had to go miles to test ride the bikes I was interested in and glad I did as I found they were not for me.

Perhaps a forum member near to you can let you try, where about are you?

Quite often, what consider important is less so when you try the different types of bike, other things come to the fore.

Good luck and have patience.