Kalkhoff Battery issue

[rsyme]

Folks -- I have a Kalkhoff Impulse Ergo with a (supposedly) 15Ah battery. Kalkhoff say the range on Eco should be approx 180Kms. Mine when fully charged shows only 122Kms range available on the display. This has been the case since it was new 6 months ago when it was supplied as a replacement under warranty for a battery that would not take a charge.

My dealer (Brilliant people here in Ireland) have checked it on their diagnostics and it seems to show only 13Ah, and have reported this to Kalkhoff and we await their reply.

Has anyone else experienced such an apparently low capacity Kalkhoff Battery??

Cheers


Robbie

 

[derf]

Folks -- I have a Kalkhoff Impulse Ergo with a (supposedly) 15Ah battery. Kalkhoff say the range on Eco should be approx 180Kms. Mine when fully charged shows only 122Kms range available on the display. This has been the case since it was new 6 months ago when it was supplied as a replacement under warranty for a battery that would not take a charge.

My dealer (Brilliant people here in Ireland) have checked it on their diagnostics and it seems to show only 13Ah, and have reported this to Kalkhoff and we await their reply.

Has anyone else experienced such an apparently low capacity Kalkhoff Battery??

Cheers


Robbie

in my experience battery range claims are always wildly overambitious (if I had a pedelec that actually gave 122kms I'd be astonished )

 

[Jimod]

Folks -- I have a Kalkhoff Impulse Ergo with a (supposedly) 15Ah battery. Kalkhoff say the range on Eco should be approx 180Kms. Mine when fully charged shows only 122Kms range available on the display. This has been the case since it was new 6 months ago when it was supplied as a replacement under warranty for a battery that would not take a charge.

My dealer (Brilliant people here in Ireland) have checked it on their diagnostics and it seems to show only 13Ah, and have reported this to Kalkhoff and we await their reply.

Has anyone else experienced such an apparently low capacity Kalkhoff Battery??

Cheers


Robbie

There is no way the battery can know how far you will go since there is no way for it to know the route you will take, what weight you are or how hard you will pedal.
There is only one way for you to know how far the battery lasts is to go out and use the bike. When it goes flat then you know how far you can go.

122km is about 76 miles and that's not a bad distance. My bike has a 10ah battery so 2 batteries would be in effect 20ah. If I used both and got 76 miles, I wouldn't complain.

Did your dealer also test another battery to see if all Kalkhoff batteries read 13ah on his machine?

Just a thought, when you charge it and it shows 122km range, ride it for 30km and see if it then shows 92km range.

 

[Jimod]

in my experience battery range claims are always wildly overambitious (if I had a pedelec that actually gave 122kms I'd be astonished )

If I had one that did that, I'd be on here boasting about it.

 

[Jonah]

I believe that the indicated range to empty is determined by the current charge, the most recent battery usage (last km?) and the assist level set. It will vary according to the assist that has been provided over the current journey.

If you actually genuinely expected to get 180km then you were not well advised by whoever sold you the bike. This is the maximum possible range assuming flat terrain, no wind, low carrying weight etc etc. In other words, not much (if any) assist being used / needed. In the Kalkhoff brochure, they say that the difference between maximum possible range and minimum range can be about 7x. Therefore the minimum range you can expect is about 25km. In real life usage (in my experience of many thousands of miles of mixed terrain cycling) you can expect the range of the 15ah battery to be between 60km and 120km assuming a mix of assist levels is used.

Also, in my experience the Impulse Service Unit which I assume your dealer has used to check the battery charge typically reports an actual charge of around 13ah relative to the 'nominal' charge of 15ah. This is the case with all my batteries so I assume it to be normal. I would be interested to hear if you get a different response from Kalkhoff.

 

[flecc]

The 15 Ah is the cell manufacturers stated maximum capacity for the parallel total in the pack, something I have actually checked on one of these BMZ made batteries. The BMS in the battery has upper and lower charge state cut off points. The upper point is set to cut before the absolute capacity limit is reached to avoid stressing the cells in the interest of long life. Therefore the 13 Ah or so charge indication actually achieved is reasonable and sensible.

Equally the lower cut off isn't when the battery is empty, it still has some charge, once again to avoid stressing the cells. In consequence the range is that achieved by rather less than the total cell capacity.

Therefore I doubt that you have an actual problem.
.

 

[RobF]

Doesn't make a lot of difference, but - if this is the right bike - the battery is rated at 17ah.

http://www.50cycles.com/electric-bikes/activity/impulse_ergo_xxl_i360.html

 

[Deleted member 4366]

I have a battery tester, which I've used to test many different types of batteries. If the battery says it's a 10ah, 15ah or whatever, they always give that capacity when new. When they're a couple of years old, capacity is often a bit less. If a new battery was sold as a15ah one, that's what it should give regardless of how far you can go on it or how far your bike says you can go.

The warranty cover is normally something like 80% reduction in the period of warranty; however, if you pointed out that anomaly to the dealer when you first had the battery, you should still be covered.

We've seen how useless the warranty is on Bosch bikes. Let's see if Kalkhoff are any better.

I've just tested 20 Kudos 10ah LiFePo4 batteries, which are up to 2 years old. They were accumulated defective ones that Kudos kindly donated to me. They had various defects: Exterior damage, duff cells, faulty BMS, wiring faults, etc. Many, if not all, had been used various amounts. After repair, every one of them did between 10.0ah and 10.5ah. Apart from the weight, they seem to be good batteries.

 

[flecc]

The capacity is the total of the cell makers marked cell capacities, this is what Derby Cycles have to say about two of the Kalkhoff Impulse batteries, the 11 and 15 Ah ones:

50 Cells | Type 18650:

10 Cells serial à 3,6V x 10 = 36 V
5 Cells parallel à 2,25 Ah x 5 = 11,25 Ah
5 Cells parallel à 3,00 Ah x 5 = 15,00Ah

We calculate the energy density:
36 V x 11 Ah = 396 Wh
36 V x 15 Ah = 540 Wh

Therefore the BMS safety margins will deduct from their stated totals.
.

 

[Jonah]

Doesn't make a lot of difference, but - if this is the right bike - the battery is rated at 17ah.

http://www.50cycles.com/electric-bikes/activity/impulse_ergo_xxl_i360.html

The 2014 bike has a 15ah battery.

 

[rsyme]

The 15 Ah is the cell manufacturers stated maximum capacity for the parallel total in the pack, something I have actually checked on one of these BMZ made batteries. The BMS in the battery has upper and lower charge state cut off points. The upper point is set to cut before the absolute capacity limit is reached to avoid stressing the cells in the interest of long life. Therefore the 13 Ah or so charge indication actually achieved is reasonable and sensible.

Equally the lower cut off isn't when the battery is empty, it still has some charge, once again to avoid stressing the cells. In consequence the range is that achieved by rather less than the total cell capacity.

Therefore I doubt that you have an actual problem.
.

Many thanks -- I suspected that it was something like that -- I just thought that 122 was so different to 180 that it might be defective and as these batteries are so expensive, I needed to get it checked at this stage. I do live in a hilly area and I am almost 16 Stone. so the displayed reduced range might also be because of this, I suppose.

thanks for your wisdom!!

 

[Tubamanandy]

"Many, if not all, had been used various amounts. After repair, every one of them did between 10.0ah and 10.5ah. Apart from the weight, they seem to be good batteries."

Selling any of them Dave ??

 

[Deleted member 4366]

"Many, if not all, had been used various amounts. After repair, every one of them did between 10.0ah and 10.5ah. Apart from the weight, they seem to be good batteries."

Selling any of them Dave ??

Maybe!.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

Many thanks -- I suspected that it was something like that -- I just thought that 122 was so different to 180 that it might be defective and as these batteries are so expensive, I needed to get it checked at this stage. I do live in a hilly area and I am almost 16 Stone. so the displayed reduced range might also be because of this, I suppose.

thanks for your wisdom!!

I'm not sure that that's right at all. A 15ah battery should be 15ah of useable capacity. Ask your dealer to compare it to a new one to see if there's a difference.

 

[derf]

Maybe!.

are they 36 or 48V, and,well, how much?

 

[patpatbut]

Maybe!.

Count me in! I am interested as well

Pat