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Simon in Easton

Finding my (electric) wheels
Feb 1, 2016
15
2
Bristol
Hi folks, after years of enjoying the posts on the CTC forum, I am joining in the Pedelec fun, after reading about this forum on the CTC site. Have used Moultons all my pedalling life but am about to switch to the rare and unusual Radnabel semi recumbent. Dieter (Herr Radnabel) has recently launched an electric version of his long-established Klassik and if anyone has any experience, either of his bikes or else the Bafang equipped model, the BEATL, I'd love to hear your story!
 
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flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
53,157
30,573
Welcome to the forum Simon. I believe the bike in this link may be your new Klassik model in it's unpowered version.
.
 
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Simon in Easton

Finding my (electric) wheels
Feb 1, 2016
15
2
Bristol
That's the one! At first glance, it looks like the wigged-out love child of a Moulton and a Brompton! ;-) The new-to-me example is about a fortnight away from me picking it up from its current location - I haven't even ridden it yet, so it's going to be a bit of a leap of faith.
 
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flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
53,157
30,573
That's the one! At first glance, it looks like the wigged-out love child of a Moulton and a Brompton! ;-)
With a distinct hint of the Birdy folder in that parallelogram front suspension, although the Birdy has a form of swinging link.

 

Simon in Easton

Finding my (electric) wheels
Feb 1, 2016
15
2
Bristol
I don't want to make any assumptions about the abilities of e-bikes... so I'll ask the Q. Assuming I pick a suitable bike/motor/battery combination, is it going to be feasible to use it for multi-day point-to-point cycle touring? I used to be able to do 50-70 miles days, carrying all my camping gear, but fitness and strength-wise, those days are behind me - is an e-bike going to help??
I was particularly fond of trips to Brittany and Normandy - I'd like to carry on going there - can anyone foresee difficulties if I use an e-bike?
 

RobF

Esteemed Pedelecer
Sep 22, 2012
4,732
2,312
Fifty plus miles is two battery territory for most ebikes, seventy definitely so.

Somewhere to charge overnight would be my biggest concern.

You mention camping, which doesn't say 'available power points' to me, but you've done it, so should know.
 

anotherkiwi

Esteemed Pedelecer
Jan 26, 2015
7,845
5,786
The European Union
You mention camping, which doesn't say 'available power points' to me, but you've done it, so should know.
Camping in the wild power point is nearest café. Camping grounds of course have power points.
 

Karl_Sheldon

Pedelecer
Jan 29, 2016
30
6
56
..and I thought my 24 mile commute was stretching it... 50 to 70 miles a day.. Good luck... And welcome fellow newcomer ...
 

Simon in Easton

Finding my (electric) wheels
Feb 1, 2016
15
2
Bristol
Gosh - I must say I'm slightly disappointed by the suggestions that range might be in the region of 20-ish miles before needing a re-charge. I don't know what I was expecting but had formed a vague impression that I might get more... :-( I talked y'day to my neighbour who has a Solexity who tells me much the same - 20-odd miles between top-ups.
There's question that leads on from there. How much of a disadvantage is there to riding an e-bike by pedal-power only? It's all very well me gaining the benefit of a motor for the first 25 miles, but if the next 25 miles involve fighting the drag of a dead motor system as well as lugging the extra weight of the now redundant motor/battery combo, then the game aint' worth a candle...
I'm noticing that e-bikes seem popular with folk who commute, doing up to 20 miles each way, and who can charge the battery before returning home, which I completely get, but I'm wondering if there's folk who tour on an e-bike?
 

Nealh

Esteemed Pedelecer
Aug 7, 2014
20,914
8,529
61
West Sx RH
Simon riding a e bike unassisted is doable on the flat as the added weight is noticeable and downhill is great as momentum takes over otherwise even slight inclines are heavy going more so touring with loaded bike. I don't tour but do try and go on longer bike rides based from home so with 2 batteries on my Boardman and aim for 50 - 80 mile ride, range is better once ambient air temps rise to 14/15 Celsius or above. Touring you can do at a more leisurely pace rather than commuting as fast as possible so range should be better. Quality celled packs ( Samsung, LG, Panasonic etc) are the way to go for plug and play riding when touring though you will need your charger.
I have 2 other Samsung celled batteries that are past their best and they can still manage 45 miles between them.
 
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flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
53,157
30,573
How much of a disadvantage is there to riding an e-bike by pedal-power only? It's all very well me gaining the benefit of a motor for the first 25 miles, but if the next 25 miles involve fighting the drag of a dead motor system as well as lugging the extra weight of the now redundant motor/battery combo, then the game aint' worth a candle. - - - - - - - - - - - - I'm wondering if there's folk who tour on an e-bike?
Choosing the right kind of motor is important. The internally geared hub motors almsot always have an internal freewheel, meaning they are disconnected when cycling without power. Central crank motor systems also have a freewheel and mostly give little added resistance.

Direct Drive hub motors are engaged all the time and do always have a degree of drag.

A few have toured e-bikes or covered long distances on them, mostly falling into two groups. One is those who have facilities to charge every day and sometimes use two batteries. The other is those riding mostly in flat areas who ride much of the time without power.

One member, Frank9755, used to go over to Holland and the like touring his e-bike accompanied by an unpowered cyclist and probably riding at moderate speeds. Wai Won Ching, the owner of the eZee company making the well known e-bikes has ridden very long sections of the Silk Route on his e-bikes, but the photos have generally shown very flat stretches and it's likely that was done riding either without power or using Eco mode much of the time.

I've done many day rides of 55 to 60 miles in very hilly areas using up to three batteries, one in each pannier and one in use. Those were smaller 10 Ah batteries, with today's 14 to 24 Ah batteries I would only have needed two at most.
.
 

OldBob1

Esteemed Pedelecer
Oct 11, 2012
355
117
Staffordshire
I think you need to go and try out a few different E-bike's and then come back and ask questions.
 

cosybike

Pedelecer
Mar 30, 2009
148
74
www.cosybike.co.uk
Range would also depend on terrain but I can see that even touring in Scotland you could still stretch range as 3 or 4 miles up hill which would eat into a range of more than 4 miles is balanced by descents of the same length or even longer using no power whereas on the flat the power is in use all the time.
If I was doing a ridiculous ascents like the Belach na bas or Rest and Be Thankful I would incorporate them into my planning and do them in a day then see what's in that area on the recharge or be flexible and stop for the day when juice runs out. You get loads of range warning and could easily mod plans on the fly.
 
C

Cyclezee

Guest
Choosing the right kind of motor is important. The internally geared hub motors almsot always have an internal freewheel, meaning they are disconnected when cycling without power. Central crank motor systems also have a freewheel and mostly give little added resistance.

Direct Drive hub motors are engaged all the time and do always have a degree of drag.

A few have toured e-bikes or covered long distances on them, mostly falling into two groups. One is those who have facilities to charge every day and sometimes use two batteries. The other is those riding mostly in flat areas who ride much of the time without power.

One member, Frank9755, used to go over to Holland and the like touring his e-bike accompanied by an unpowered cyclist and probably riding at moderate speeds. Wai Won Ching, the owner of the eZee company making the well known e-bikes has ridden very long sections of the Silk Route on his e-bikes, but the photos have generally shown very flat stretches and it's likely that was done riding either without power or using Eco mode much of the time.

I've done many day rides of 55 to 60 miles in very hilly areas using up to three batteries, one in each pannier and one in use. Those were smaller 10 Ah batteries, with today's 14 to 24 Ah batteries I would only have needed two at most.
.
Wai Won Ching's Silk Road ride was completed in several stages over an extended period. His more recent ride from Perth to Sydney on a fully laden eZee Expedir cargo bike was done in one go, on that occasion using 28Ah batteries.

We have couple of eZee customers in the UK who have bikes with a dual battery setup, a 28Ah plus 15Ah rear rack type giving a massive total of 43Ah.
 
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