Hub or Mid Drive? Any views?

[soundwave]

anything with a few hundred amps will do

 

[Wisper Bikes]

I would expect the centre drive to have the edge when used with large sprockets, not small ones. Did you do that comparison when cycling uphill with a large sprocket?

No that's a good point, we will try as soon as it stops raining!

 

[Wisper Bikes]

Let me apologise to David firstly, this is not the place to talk about what we do .

No worries at all, your contributions are excellent and unbiased.

 

[Deleted member 25121]

No worries at all, your contributions are excellent and unbiased.

It's great to see companies working with each other like this rather then taking snipes at each other all the time, like some companies and our politicians seem to do.

 

[RobF]

It's great to see companies working with each other like this rather then taking snipes at each other all the time, like some companies and our politicians seem to do.

It is, although the companies on here have had their moments.

Anyone remember the Wisper bike with the Union Jack on the seat tube?

 

[Wisper Bikes]

I'm in a burying the hatchet kind of mood Rob. As for the flag, it's on it's way back!

All the best, David

 

[Nealh]

Wasn't the flag denoting a British company rather then a bike built in Britain ?

 

[Wisper Bikes]

It was Neal. We loved it, and so it seems did our customers.

 

[BazP]

anything with a few hundred amps will do

Perhaps I should put my CX motor into a pillow case next time I put it in the washer.

 

[Jimod]

Wasn't the flag denoting a British company rather then a bike built in Britain ?

In that case, every company in Britain could simply import their stuff and stick a British flag on it. They wouldn't need to make anything in UK.

 

[Woosh]

In that case, every company in Britain could simply import their stuff and stick a British flag on it. They wouldn't need to make anything in UK.

the support is. Since anti-dumping on Chinese e-bikes, I have to assemble my own bikes in Southend though.

 

[Jayfdee]

Interesting discussion, thanks to all the posters.
I have previously owned a 500W rear hub, and now a 250W bafang crank drive.
The choice is personal, depends on so many factors including particularly hill climbing, gearing and cadence.
For me the Bafang is way better than the rear hub, even though the Bafang is only 250W, it suits my riding profile, plenty of hills, off road, and long distance.The ability to tune the motor parameters is useful, I have upped the limit to 20 amps, so that has definitely improved performance, and for the low levels of assist on the towpaths etc, I can tune it to use very little power.
I ride for fun only 90% offroad, not commute. For commuting on roads then I am sure the cheaper option of hub drive would be absolutely fine.
I have been mountain biking for over 25 years, and often use a non ebike, so perhaps I am putting more human input than other users.
The rear hub was very heavy, with the weight in the wrong place, puncture repair is a pain, the feeling of being pushed is not as natural as a crank drive, and I get much better range on a crank drive.Yes wear and tear on the chain and cassette is a factor, my gear sensor has improved things enormously.
I suppose this is an argument that will run for ever. Personal preference.

 

[Woosh]

The rear hub was very heavy, with the weight in the wrong place, puncture repair is a pain, the feeling of being pushed is not as natural as a crank drive, and I get much better range on a crank drive.

maybe your rear hub motor was a direct drive, which is not suitable for commuting bikes.
My Faro has the Aikema 13.0 rear hub motor which weighs 2kgs on its own and climbs hills well. The whole bike weighs only 17 kgs, with Maxxis Detonator 23x700 tyres, much more suitable for commuting.

 

[Jayfdee]

maybe your rear hub motor was a direct drive, which is not suitable for commuting bikes.
My Faro has the Aikema 13.0 rear hub motor which weighs 2kgs on its own and climbs hills well. The whole bike weighs only 17 kgs, with Maxxis Detonator 23x700 tyres, much more suitable for commuting.

My rear hub was an ebay cheapie, I fitted it on my Orange P7(yes I know a crime), and did over 2000 trouble free miles. It introduced me to ebiking. It was OK on the roads, but off road when the rpm got too low it was no use. So perhaps not really fair to compare with the Bafang, which has also done 2000 trouble free miles.

 

[Woosh]

Your Bafang would do very well on a commuting bike, just a little more expensive.

 

[Jayfdee]

Your Bafang would do very well on a commuting bike, just a little more expensive.

Yes it would commute well, but I do not commute. I purchased the Bafang from you, and it has worked well, yes I know I voided the warranty by messing with the motor parameters. I have punished and abused this unit through rocky trails, deep water, steep long climbs, 18 amps on controller. The motor gets covered in insulating mud and grass and never fails,(Yet).
A good reliable unit, thanks.

 

[Nealh]

The ebay cheapie 500w hub will have been a D/D hub and no comparison to geared hub. Geared hubs are capable for off roading though not so much for technical rides or rough down hilling as spoke damage is more likely.
I have used my hub bikes many times on the N & S Downs without issues and on boggy forest runs, In my case I have found them more reliable then my BBS01 which has suffered two blown controllers.

 

[EddiePJ]

I fitted it on my Orange P7(yes I know a crime)

More of crime to have it sat in a shed unused, like so many mountain bikes.

Using it as you are, is good thing.

 

[Nosweat]

Thinking about the comments on hub motors not being so good for hills where extra torque is needed compared to crank drives, why is it that so few appear to be available at 48V compared to 36V? If 48V is so good why is it not more commonly used? I read a previous thread comparing the TSDZ2 at both voltages and saying 48V was night and day different. Why is say the XF07 or XF08 supplised at 36V if extra voltage would make a big difference to its usability?

 

[Woosh]

Thinking about the comments on hub motors not being so good for hills where extra torque is needed compared to crank drives, why is it that so few appear to be available at 48V compared to 36V? If 48V is so good why is it not more commonly used? I read a previous thread comparing the TSDZ2 at both voltages and saying 48V was night and day different. Why is say the XF07 or XF08 supplised at 36V if extra voltage would make a big difference to its usability?

if you convert using a front hub motor, it needs to be lightweight not to break the fork's jaws through inertia (if and when you hit a pothole). The XF07 weighs 2.8kgs. 48V motors tend to be weightier, you would need to install torque arms.
Torque arms help but are not 100% risk free, plus it's messy to remove the wheel when torque arms are in place.
The rear XF08C gives a decent acceleration for riders up to about 16st. Above that weight, the 48V motors perform better. We have the 48V SWX02 for bikes with freewheel, 48V Shengyi DGW22C for cassettes.