How much drag above 15.5 mph on your crank drive ebike?

[Eagle]

I am interested to know how much drag (none, a small amount, quite a lot, like towing an adult hippo?) pedelecers experience above 15.5 mph with various motors such as Bosch Active Line Plus, Yamaha PW-X, Yamaha PW-SE, Giant SyncDrive Sport (Yamaha) on various ebikes such as Crossfuse, Cube, Haibike, Giant etc.

Basically, what is your experience pedalling your bike unaided on a flat road above the cut-off limit with one of the above motors?
PS Not including dongles.

 

[soundwave]

none i have a dongle

 

[Deleted member 128]

I am interested to know how much drag (none, a small amount, quite a lot, like towing an adult hippo?) pedelecers experience above 15.5 mph with various motors such as Bosch Active Line Plus, Yamaha PW-X, Yamaha PW-SE, Giant SyncDrive Sport (Yamaha) on various ebikes such as Crossfuse, Cube, Haibike, Giant etc.

Basically, what is your experience pedalling your bike unaided on a flat road above the cut-off limit with one of the above motors?
PS Not including dongles.

Above 15 mph my Bosch Performance CX gives a small but noticeable amount of drag when I'm cycling on the flat. Gravity assists going downhill and uphill I'm doing less than 15 mph. This doesn't bother me in the slightest because I use my ebike for touring and I'm never in a hurry, I prefer to cycle along at a leisurely rate having a good look around.
If I need to go fast my car would do 193 mph.

 

[Andy McNish]

I am interested to know how much drag (none, a small amount, quite a lot, like towing an adult hippo?) pedelecers experience above 15.5 mph with various motors such as Bosch Active Line Plus, Yamaha PW-X, Yamaha PW-SE, Giant SyncDrive Sport (Yamaha) on various ebikes such as Crossfuse, Cube, Haibike, Giant etc.

Basically, what is your experience pedalling your bike unaided on a flat road above the cut-off limit with one of the above motors?
PS Not including dongles.

I have done it but don't usually get much above 28km/hr or so, It is a heavy bike (with all the stuff in my panniers probably 26kg+) and I rarely bother to try to cane it as I'm not a commuter or regular road rider.

The real benefit of the zero resist Activeline Plus on my Cube Touring bike for me is that I can simply treat the bike as a normal one and only use the power assist as a HR moderator.

I don't use the assist unless my HR gets over 150 and then make sure it never gets above 160.
If HR drops back into the 140's I turn off the assist.

Two hours into a club ride last weekend someone asked me about my range.
I replied that, as I'd at that point used the assist for about 90 seconds so far, daylight would run out long before my battery.

The only sort of rides that need any real battery use are ones with signifiicant hills.

As for drag on the Activeline Plus there is absolutely none. 1:1 gearing, No resist at all.
Obviously as the motor cuts off at about 26kph you will sometimes notice the loss of boost if you have been relying on it to get up to that speed, but quite often I look down and see that I'm travelling above the cut-off and hadn't noticed a thing.

 

[soundwave]

 

[Eagle]

The real benefit of the zero resist Activeline Plus on my Cube Touring bike for me is that I can simply treat the bike as a normal one and only use the power assist as a HR moderator.

Andy, that is exactly the sort of information I require. Many thanks.

Haibike and Giant ebike owners, I am still interested to know how the various Yamaha motors perform on your bikes.
Does your bike behave like Andy's Cube with the Active Line Plus motor, having zero drag, or differently?

 

[Artstu]

Two hours into a club ride last weekend someone asked me about my range.
I replied that, as I'd at that point used the assist for about 90 seconds so far, daylight would run out long before my battery.

Two hours ! I know if I tried to join a club ride I'd be off the back and wouldn't see them again after less than two minutes. What sort of club is yours?

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My Bosch classic is hard work above 16 mph, a combination of slight motor drag the weight and drag from the hub gears.

 

[anotherkiwi]

Motors with normal sized chainwheels have the least amount of perceived drag, my speedo is often at 32 km/h without me noticing. I ride without the motor on and you do notice the weight of the bike but there is no noise from the motor freewheel or bearings so a minimal amount of drag.

 

[Eagle]

Motors with normal sized chainwheels have the least amount of perceived drag, my speedo is often at 32 km/h without me noticing. I ride without the motor on and you do notice the weight of the bike but there is no noise from the motor freewheel or bearings so a minimal amount of drag.

anotherkiwi,
I am not sure what you mean by "motors with normal sized chainwheels".
Do you mean motors with direct drive (like the Active Line Plus), as opposed to the Bosch CX motor which has internal gearing?

 

[Nefarious]

far less on my Shimano E8000 powered bike than the ones I tried with Yamaha/Bosch MTB motors. I'd probably call it negligible. Apparently the new Brose is even less but when it's so little it stops being a deciding factor

 

[anotherkiwi]

anotherkiwi,
I am not sure what you mean by "motors with normal sized chainwheels".
Do you mean motors with direct drive (like the Active Line Plus), as opposed to the Bosch CX motor which has internal gearing?

Yes the Active line and the Yamaha have normal sized chainwheels - more teeth on the front than on the back

 

[georgehenry]

I ride my 2015 Yamaha PW motor hard tail Haibike with the motor off a far bit and do not notice any drag from the motor, just the weight of the bike as I am heavy and carry two loaded panniers. Once moving on the level ground I do not notice any drag maintain speed easily. Once an uphill gradient of any significance arrives however the motor is required.

 

[Andy-Mat]

I am interested to know how much drag (none, a small amount, quite a lot, like towing an adult hippo?) pedelecers experience above 15.5 mph with various motors such as Bosch Active Line Plus, Yamaha PW-X, Yamaha PW-SE, Giant SyncDrive Sport (Yamaha) on various ebikes such as Crossfuse, Cube, Haibike, Giant etc.

Basically, what is your experience pedalling your bike unaided on a flat road above the cut-off limit with one of the above motors?
PS Not including dongles.

You will need a wind tunnel, as outside, there are simply too many variables, ones that change minute by minute, to hour by hour......Even your stance (sitting up, or not), your type of clothing will make significant changes.....
About the only (slightly) useful formula to know about (not easily use in real life!), is that under identical conditions, to double your speed, you need 4 times the power.
So to increase speed by 50% to 23.25 MPH, would need double the power input.
I hope this helps you somewhat.
regards
Andy

 

[E-Wheels]

I am interested to know how much drag (none, a small amount, quite a lot, like towing an adult hippo?) pedelecers experience above 15.5 mph with various motors such as Bosch Active Line Plus, Yamaha PW-X, Yamaha PW-SE, Giant SyncDrive Sport (Yamaha) on various ebikes such as Crossfuse, Cube, Haibike, Giant etc.

Basically, what is your experience pedalling your bike unaided on a flat road above the cut-off limit with one of the above motors?
PS Not including dongles.

With my Shimano E8000 it is not noticeable

 

[Eagle]

Thanks to all who have responded so far.
Would more Haibike and Giant ebike owners care to comment on their personal experiences with Yamaha motors ?
Thanks again.

 

[Slartibartfast]

My Haibike Trekking suddenly feels heavy when I go over 15.5 mph. I do regularly cruise at 20/25 or so mph, but going faster and keeping that speed up means changing down a gear. Nothing to do with drag, it feels more like I am peddling over wet grass instead of tarmac. I struggle to get to 30mph on the flat. My bike has the Yamaha motor.

 

[sjpt]

'suddenly feels heavy' is more likely to be the motor reducing power fairly abruptly than drag from the motor

 

[Danidl]

There is virtually no drag with the Bosch Active Line on the Motus , . This can be shown by just switching to the off position at any speed. But it is a heavy bike and the cycling position is more for comfort than speed.

 

[Eagle]

Slartiblartfast,
Is this your machine with the Yamaha PW motor:
https://ebiketips.road.cc/content/reviews/electric-city-bikes/haibike-sduro-trekking-40-1698 ?

 

[Andy McNish]

Two hours ! I know if I tried to join a club ride I'd be off the back and wouldn't see them again after less than two minutes. What sort of club is yours?

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My Bosch classic is hard work above 16 mph, a combination of slight motor drag the weight and drag from the hub gears.

Ah - not a lycra clad roadbike one! I potter around with a community cycling club a couple of times a year - if they look like they can teach me a new off-road route or it looks like a nice ride.

http://www.sccc.co.uk/

As it's an all-abilities club and the ride last weekend turned out to be a very flat 35 miles and almost all on tarmac, there was no real need to use the motor.