Go to work on a Pineapple! Wisper Folder sneak preview.

[oyster]

With a limited range (I assume, otherwise it would be more chunky and you would not be offering a second battery), it might be very helpful if the charger could be clipped onto the bike somewhere. It is likely to be needed at both ends of a journey more often than on bikes with longer ranges.

Obviously, any clipping mechanism should leave the charger attached when folded and ensure the cables are catered for.

There might be untold reasons to stick with spokes, but I'd really like to see what non-spoke wheels would look like.

 

[soundwave]

 

[oyster]

Those wheels, suitably scaled, could look very nice.

 

[soundwave]

the only problem is they cost 3k a set

 

[oyster]

the only problem is they cost 3k a set

We don't know how much the Pineapple will cost - yet!

Mostly, things that look good are more expensive...

 

[jwm]

Looks good,

the ability to take a rack is a must, though most producers put a pointless rounded one on the bike which is difficult to get a pannier to clip on without fouling the pedal motion (and I only have small feet). So something sat towards the back of the wheel with straight rails.

There will be a lot of stress on the joint and though the locking mechanisms are much better than they were, most still creak with use (I currently have a ten - lock is good and solid but still creaks when dirt gets in). I don't know if a gasket or coating can be added.

Whilst the front cog looks like it will offer a decent turn of speed with a folder it's quite open to bangs and general dirt when handling. Ideally an option for hub gears would be great, combined with a chainglider it would reduce all the mess from a city or canal path type grime.

If the target market is for city city integrated lights would be useful to reduce loss from theft, however any longer distant users would wan't something with a bit more umph.

Stick some Big Apple Plus' on as standard!

John

 

[PeterCo]

I have used folding e bikes on boats now for the last decade. When you lift them in and out it's most annoying if they begin to unfold as you lift them. The Brompton has solved this whilst the Volt needs a tight bungee. Maybe yours has some sort of device. Mudguards and maybe lights are useful too. An obvious carrying point at the balance point is helpful. Protection for the derailleur is useful as has been mentioned already.
Side stand too.
Maybe market two models. Fully dressed Pineapple and the stripped down Pineapple Lite.

 

[Wisper Bikes]

I like the clean, cantilevered style a lot.
Is there a particular reason to go 18in wheels? A quick look on Halfords (for example) shows only kids BMX replacement tyres. 406 has wider range available? (as long as you don't ask for 20x2.125. Yes Woosh, eh? ;-) )
Mikel

Hi Mike we went for 18” to keep the bike as ahort as possible for stowing away. We first looked at 16 3/8 like Brompton but the tyres were a real pain. We sold the Birdy from RM for a few years and really liked the way if ride. The Pineapple has similar geometry. Through our experience with the Birdy we found a good range of tyres available esp from Schwalbe.

All the best, David

 

[Wisper Bikes]

Absolutely love the utilitarian, understated funky look of this.

I think slight changing of colour scheme would make a big difference. The saddle should definitely be black whatever happens.

Either the chainring, seat post and saddle should be black, so that you are left with a few chrome accents amongst the stealthy black. Or perhaps a more reasonable suggestion would be to change the saddle to black, with the upright of the handlebars in chrome to match the seatpost.

The design has great lines but I think the 'flow' is broken up. Check out the quick Photoshop below for one suggestion. In this scheme, looking across the bike you have the chrome brake discs in a row with the chainring, the black saddle and bars are aligned, as are the seat post and handlebar upright. (The happy side effect is that the handlebars which will inevitable get bashed when folding will be more cosmetically durable.)

View attachment 23600

Thanks for you input Wheel E, all great points.

 

[Wisper Bikes]

Why do you call it Pineapple?

Pull a pin and it explodes?

Ahhh hadn’t thought of that! I hope not.

Just a cool name, full of juice!

 

[Wisper Bikes]

I have just thought of something else. The colour.

Whilst black is easily my favourite bike colour, a matt finish as shown, is going to be a nightmare to keep clean. If you are going to be making the bike finish black, I'd lean towards a satin finish. Gloss black might cheapen the look of the bike.

edit... The chainring and seat post also need to be black.

And also, after riding the Raleigh Twenty that I picked up the other day for my daughter to use whilst at university, I'm not sure that I'd fancy a wheel size any smaller than 20". Obviously, I understand the practical reasons of transport purposes and possibly final drive gearing for choosing 18"
Only guessing, but I assume that an 18" wheel size will allow for a smaller size (higher ratio) cassette, and possibly a smaller size of motor to be used for the same gain?

.

Colour is going to be critcal, currently there are three on our list, all gloss. Pineapple yellow...... of course, mint green and black.

 

[Wisper Bikes]

Looks good,

the ability to take a rack is a must, though most producers put a pointless rounded one on the bike which is difficult to get a pannier to clip on without fouling the pedal motion (and I only have small feet). So something sat towards the back of the wheel with straight rails.

There will be a lot of stress on the joint and though the locking mechanisms are much better than they were, most still creak with use (I currently have a ten - lock is good and solid but still creaks when dirt gets in). I don't know if a gasket or coating can be added.

Whilst the front cog looks like it will offer a decent turn of speed with a folder it's quite open to bangs and general dirt when handling. Ideally an option for hub gears would be great, combined with a chainglider it would reduce all the mess from a city or canal path type grime.

If the target market is for city city integrated lights would be useful to reduce loss from theft, however any longer distant users would wan't something with a bit more umph.

Stick some Big Apple Plus' on as standard!

John

Thanks John.

The rack should be ready when I get out there, I’ll post images.
I like the idea of integral lights.
The lock is based on our current Folding bike lock. We have managed to get rid of any creaks.
We will be discussing the chain drive in detail and I’ll post details.

All the best, David

 

[Wisper Bikes]

I have used folding e bikes on boats now for the last decade. When you lift them in and out it's most annoying if they begin to unfold as you lift them. The Brompton has solved this whilst the Volt needs a tight bungee. Maybe yours has some sort of device. Mudguards and maybe lights are useful too. An obvious carrying point at the balance point is helpful. Protection for the derailleur is useful as has been mentioned already.
Side stand too.
Maybe market two models. Fully dressed Pineapple and the stripped down Pineapple Lite.

Hi Peter, All excellent points. We are currently using an earth magnet to lock the wheels together.
The way we will sell the bike is much like the Brompton method. There will be the basic stripped down model as a starting point then customers can add accessories, disc brakes, mudguards, rack, lights, extra battery to fit in rack. Then carbon parts, including we hope a carbon cased motor, which is being tested at the moment.

All the best, David

 

[jhruk]

If, like most folders, this will be a one size fits all frame you need to offer as much adjustment for fit as possible. On the Birdy R&M offer a choice two angles plus adjustable height for the stem (handlepost), Brompton offer a choice of handlebars with different heights, and many cheaper folders have a telescopic stem.

At the least you need to offer a telescopic stem option. It may add weight, cost, and arguably spoil the aesthetic, but would make it a better fit for a much larger range of customer.

 

[Crockers]

What %of ebikes sold are folders? What price point are you looking at?'Is feedback good from dealers or are you looking at direct to consumer marketing?'Who do you see as your main competitors? What differentiates your offering over theirs? How big a capacity is the inframe battery? Weight for transportation?

I think your bike looks good and I wish you success.

 

[EddiePJ]

As much as I hate to say this given my bad experience of the brand, I always felt that the BH Neo Volt had alot going for it. It was quite ahead of it's time with it's integrated/removable battery, and I guess sleek looks for a folder.

Not posted to distract from the thread, just to give you a little more to think about.

From looking at Google images, it certainly didn't appear to fold down very well though.

 

[anotherkiwi]

On my short list of bikes to build is the Tern Link B7:

Tiny Xiongda rear hub motor (sensored version) with DNP 11-32 freewheel, controller behind seatpost, Magura HS11 on the front, mudguards, battery powered b+m lights, Big Apple Plus and the Tern basket on the front with a softshell battery. For moving more stuff around town I would use a trailer.

 

[Wisper Bikes]

If, like most folders, this will be a one size fits all frame you need to offer as much adjustment for fit as possible. On the Birdy R&M offer a choice two angles plus adjustable height for the stem (handlepost), Brompton offer a choice of handlebars with different heights, and many cheaper folders have a telescopic stem.

At the least you need to offer a telescopic stem option. It may add weight, cost, and arguably spoil the aesthetic, but would make it a better fit for a much larger range of customer.

Excellent point! We were only going to offer one telescopic stem but the Birdy optional Angles makes serious sense.

All the best, David

 

[Wisper Bikes]

What %of ebikes sold are folders? What price point are you looking at?'Is feedback good from dealers or are you looking at direct to consumer marketing?'Who do you see as your main competitors? What differentiates your offering over theirs? How big a capacity is the inframe battery? Weight for transportation?

I think your bike looks good and I wish you success.

Thanks Crockers, we are going for higher end components and we see prices between £1,000 and £2,000 depending on options chosen by the customer, but they may be higher. Currently 35% of or sales are folders and this is increasing, this is a very different bike, much lighter at a projected 12-14kg, and a shorter range. This bike is specifically aimed at the commuter and marine markets. I will upload full specs soon.

All the best, David

 

[Wisper Bikes]

As much as I hate to say this given my bad experience of the brand, I always felt that the BH Neo Volt had alot going for it. It was quite ahead of it's time with it's integrated/removable battery, and I guess sleek looks for a folder.

Not posted to distract from the thread, just to give you a little more to think about.

From looking at Google images, it certainly didn't appear to fold down very well though.

Thanks Eddie, as Battery energy density has moved on since the Volt was first produced we are able to get away with a much smaller battery.