Furo X

[Rinansay]

Does anyone have any knowledge of the Furo X? It's said to be "the first full carbon electric folding bicycle".

See https://www.furosystems.com/fx/

I recently bought a Raleigh Stow-E-Way electric folding bike but I haven't fallen in love with it, though perhaps I haven't yet used it enough to give it a fair trial. However, the idea of a lightweight electric folder appeals to me, but I'd like to know a bit more before spending around £2000.

Any opinions or information?

 

[John Fleet]

I have one. Had it since September 2018. In short, I love it. It's the best electric bike which I've owned in terms of usability and riding pleasure. In truth I've never folded it - as it lives in my garage. I sold a previous Kalkhoff because due to a hip condition I was struggling to mount it and thought that was the end of my biking career. Then I saw the ads for the Furo. After emailing the company I took the plunge. What do I like about the bike? - its build quality, comfort, handling and performance. On full assist I can breeze along into any headwind at 15 mph which is what I want from a bike. Most of the time I ride on either no assist or on the lowest setting. Some of the features are a bit gimmicky - esp the indicators which may be useful at night but are unlikely to be noticed by motorists in the day time.

Surprisingly the bike comes with neither a bell or a rear light. Both of which can be purchased separately for probably about a tenner but you do wonder why they are not included.

Range (with the bigger battery) feels like it's probably somewhere between 20 - 30 miles.

Happy to answer any more questions. Photos show a few accessories which I've fitted.

 

[Rinansay]

Thanks for the reply, John.

I did in fact order a Furo X MAX back in January. Supposedly delivery was to be in February, but it was then postponed to some time in mid-March. However, the postponements made me nervous about the financial security of the Furo Systems company, and so I cancelled my order. Another thing that had worried me was that payment for my order had been taken immediately, whereas I would have expected it to be taken when the bike was dispatched to me.

Despite my misgivings the refund was made to my credit card very promptly and without any quibble, which reassured me and oddly enough made me feel that I shouldn't have cancelled the order. Too late now, though!

Apart from the unfortunate delivery delays, I did receive excellent service from the company. Eliott Wertheimer, one of its founders, always replied to any email queries quickly and courteously.

I'm pleased to hear that you're enjoying the bike. I might even buy one myself at some point in the future if delivery times improve! However, I see that the company website now says "Expected Delivery 5/2019" so clearly anyone ordering now would need to be patient.

 

[vfr400]

Fake Trustpilot reviews. Ask yourself why a company needs to do that!

Regardless of whether a company's products are good or bad, if they cheat in some areas, they'll probably cheat you in others.

 

[Rinansay]

So how do you know that the Trustpilot reviews are fake?

Incidentally, you'll see that the company recently acquired its first negative review: https://uk.trustpilot.com/review/www.furosystems.com?utm_medium=trustbox&utm_source=List

That review claims that, "There are other brand name versions of the same uniquely designed bike, same cost 7 day delivery by UPS, no mudguards or fancy lights." Does anyone know what they are (if they do actually exist)?

 

[vfr400]

Take a brand like Juicy that's relatively well known and established for more than a decade. Ask yourself how another brand that's hardly been heard of and with a very limited product range can get the same number of reviews as Juicy in less than a year.

There are various websites that can review reviews and figure out if they're fake. Try one on the Furo reviews.

 

[Rinansay]

"There are various websites that can review reviews and figure out if they're fake. Try one on the Furo reviews ."

So presumably you've tried this yourself? Which website(s) did you use?

 

[vfr400]

I didn’t try one of the websites. I use my mk1 review system that I keep behind my eyes for things like that.

 

[Rinansay]

Well, I had my doubts about Furo Systems, which is why I cancelled my order. However, I have no reason to think that their reviews on Trustpilot are fake, though of course that's a possibility.

I'm unfamiliar with Juicy Bikes but I did have a look at their website. Their range of bikes may be worthy enough but it's a pretty run-of-the-mill selection with nothing (to me at least) particularly exciting. On the other hand the Furo X is different: an electric folding bike with a carbon frame thus making it (presumably) light and easy to load into a car or to take on public transport, unlike my Raleigh Stow-E-Way which is both heavy and clumsy when folded.

John Fleet, who's a well established member of this forum, posted enthusiastically about the bike earlier in this thread. I trust that you wouldn't insult him by regarding his comments as fake.

 

[vfr400]

I have nothing against Furo bikes, and I'm in no way comparing them with Juicy bikes. What I am comparing is the behaviour of their owners. Why would ten times as many Furo owners leave reviews on Trustpilot than Juicy owners. Why are there no reviews at all for other long-established brands, like Oxygen? Nearly all owners are delighted with their ebike purchases - apparantly more Juicy ones than Furo ones, so that can't bethe reason.

 

[Rinansay]

You know nothing about the behaviour of the owners of FuroSystems and all you're doing is speculating. Criticising their behaviour would be fine if you had solid evidence for doing so. However, since you don't, this little wrangle is pointless and so I'll leave you to it.

It would still be interesting to hear from someone else who has actual experience of the bike, though.

 

[RossG]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/technology-43907695

I feel I'm cheating just posting a link so I'll say hello as well.

 

[Rinansay]

Of course that piece makes no mention of FuroSystems, so it isn't particularly helpful.

 

[vfr400]

You know nothing about the behaviour of the owners of FuroSystems and all you're doing is speculating. Criticising their behaviour would be fine if you had solid evidence for doing so. However, since you don't, this little wrangle is pointless and so I'll leave you to it.

It would still be interesting to hear from someone else who has actual experience of the bike, though.

You seem to bevery defensive of these Furo reviews. Are you linked to Furo in any way.

All I've done is apply some basic logic and point out some anomolies. You haven't made any attemt to explain away these anomolies. Why is it that say Oxygen, established 11 years ago, well respected and well known, has no trustpilot reviews and Furo, a company that I had never heard of before despite me being an electric bike enthusiast who spends much of his life working with and researching electric bikes, has more than 50 reviews?

 

[Rinansay]

I have no connection at all to FuroSystems, or to any other brand of bike or any retailer.

I've had three ebikes (one Kalkhoff, one Ghost and one Raleigh) but I now have no intention of buying a Furo X.

As to what you call anomalies, I have no idea.

 

[Rinansay]

However, having thought about the matter a little more, here are a couple of points.

1. Many of the FuroSystems reviews are from those who have also submitted reviews for other companies. Fake reviews are generally from those who submit just a single review (either gushingly enthusiastic or harshly critical) and then vanish.

2. It's clear that FuroSystems asks its clients to submit Trustpilot reviews. Next to the number of green stars on a review there are the words "Verified order", and if one points one's mouse at that something comes up along the lines of, "Fred Smith was invited to write this review by FuroSystems." That doesn't mean that he was bribed to do so. Juicy Bikes was mentioned earlier and it was said that it didn't have many Trustpilot reviews. Indeed it doesn't, but it would seem that at least in the past it has asked some clients to write them: https://uk.trustpilot.com/review/juicybike.co.uk Only a couple of "Verified orders" there, but they lead to a similar slogan of "Carol Surname was invited to write this review by Juicy Bikes."

3. I guess that FuroSystems places more importance on Trustpilot reviews than does Juicy Bikes, which is hardly surprising for a newish company that's trying to build a reputation.

4. I'm not sure of this, but I suspect that if a company wants to link to Trustpilot reviews on its website then it has to pay Trustpilot for the right to do so. FuroSystems obviously thinks that's worthwhile, whereas other companies may not. For example, Raleigh UK doesn't seem to have any Trustpilot reviews at all, but presumably it's sufficiently long-established to feel that it doesn't need them. On the other hand, even a well established business like Richer Sounds obviously does want Trustpilot reviews: https://uk.trustpilot.com/review/richersounds.com/london-swiss-cottage?utm_medium=trustbox&utm_source=Carousel

To sum up, FuroSystems gets Trustpilot reviews because it asks its customers to provide them, and that seems to be a common business practice and nothing sinister.

 

[pbrab]

Another point to consider. There are lots of investors in Furo Systems (Indiegogo) who likely bought a bike and are well incented to give it a positive review.

 

[Woosh]

many people do not realise that a folding e-bike weighs just as much as a full size bike.
While it's easy to find and cheap to buy a 10kg road bike, most folding bikes weigh more than that, even if you pay over £500 for them. Consequently, if you need a lightweight e-bike, it is better to get a full size road e-bike.

E-folders present extra challenge to designers. If you convert a folding bike, you will have difficulty finding space for the battery. If you design an e-folder, you will inevitably be tempted to put the battery in the main beam, the folding mechanism will limit how much space you have for the in-frame battery.
The limited space for the battery constrains how much pulling power and range you can have. You can pull at most roughly 1 and a half time the capacity of the battery. If you have a 400WH battery, you can pull at most 600W when climbing a steep hill. That's plenty for most people, but if you are heavy or disabled, you may need more. Keep that in mind.

 

[Rinansay]

As far as I can see the Furosystems campaign on Indiegogo finished more than a year ago, and rather than "lots of investors" it attracted only eleven and didn't achieve its financial target: https://www.indiegogo.com/projects/furo-x-series-the-ultimate-full-carbon-ebikes#/

 

[MikelBikel]

They seem to pop up from time to time, but don't always make it. Now the EU tariff will discourage them further.

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Cheers. Mikel