Full Throttle ebike legal again!

At last, after a long wait and loads of jumping through hoops we can legally offer full throttle bikes again!

Congratualations. Thanks so much.

It’s absolutely our pleasure!

All the best, David

Why is the unladen weight incorrect?

I'm guessing that's with the battery off, it's 22 kg with the smallest battery. So at 19 kg literally unladen weight, rather like an i.c. vehicle with no fuel in the tank.

N.B. Crossed with Wisper's post.

.

For some reason it’s ex battery.

Probably as I posted above David, examined without fuel source.

.

One assumes that this SVA approval is for one particular bike only?

Jim

One assumes that this SVA approval is for one particular bike only?

 

Jim

For all of this model rather than one bike only.

Individual owners can submit their own bikes for one off approval if they meet the requirements.

.

Yes that’s correct, the first bike is a bit of a rigmarole and takes a while. They need to see test house certification and then satisfy themselves the bike conforms to the relevant EN standards and is safe and roadworthy.

There is currently only one testing house in the country where we can get an appointment and they had not done one before. It took six weeks from paying the fee to testing the bike.

Each bike has to be certified individually.

All the best, David

At last, after a long wait and loads of jumping through hoops we can legally offer full throttle bikes again!

For us thickies, could you give an explination why this is so great? I understand the desire or need for a trottle and that an L1E bike is the next step up from a 'standard' ebike, but does that step up also mean you need a licence, tax & insurance etc.

an L1E bike is the next step up from a 'standard' ebike, but does that step up also mean you need a licence, tax & insurance etc.

No, this is a measure the DfT are allowing for mainland UK pedelecs that meet the necessary standards, without that additional bureaucracy.

Such a throttle equipped bike cannot be legally taken into the mainland EU or Northern Ireland as a pedelec.

.

For anyone that's interested, here is the detail...

Anyone can apply for the Type Approval certificate by filling in an online application and paying a fee of £55.00. They must then take the bike to a designated MoT centre for testing and approval.

We will offer this service for £199.00 RRP including VAT.

Please note: There may be a wait of up to 8 weeks until we have enough bikes sold with an open throttle to make the trip to Southampton worthwhile.

For those interested in the detail, everything can be found in the 200+ page Motorcycle Single Vehicle Approval (MSVA) Inspection Manual Amendment 5 2019. And the new category L1e category 250W LPM

The Motorcycle Single Vehicle Approval Scheme applies to: Mopeds Low powered moped (L1e)

· a 2, 3 or 4 wheeled moped with pedals

· with auxiliary propulsion not exceeding 1kW

· with a maximum design speed not exceeding 25km/h (16mph)

· includes sub-category 250W LPM (see definition below)

250W LPM 250 Watt Low Powered Moped.

This is a sub-group of Low Powered Moped that meets the criteria laid down in the Electrically Assisted Pedal Cycle Regulations 1983 (SI 1983 No. 1168) as amended by SI 2015 No. 24. The requirements are that the vehicle:

· Be fitted with pedals by means of which it is capable of being propelled.

· Be fitted with no motor other than an electric motor, which has a maximum continuous rated power, which does not exceed 250 watts and cannot propel the vehicle when it is travelling at more than 15.5 mph. (Note: the official speed is 25 km/h, MSVA will accept declarations up to and including 16 mph as per low powered mopeds).

These vehicles will be required to meet the standards applied to Low Powered Mopeds except where specified.

To find all the allowances for 250W LPM you will need to trawl through all 200 pages of the above-mentioned document.

There you will find such information as below which applies to stands

Stands January 2019 1/1 1 Application

This examination applies to all 2 wheeled vehicles. Requirements 2b, 2c and 3b do not apply to any vehicle which is designed in such a way that it cannot be propelled by its engine when the stand is extended i.e. an inhibitor (interlock) is fitted.

Requirements 2b, 2c and 4a and 4b do not apply to a 250W LPM with a mass in running order of less than 35 kg

2. Check that the prop stand;

b) is able to swing back automatically into the retracted or travelling position when the vehicle returns to its normal (vertical) position, or

c) is able to swing back automatically into the retracted or travelling position following the first contact with the ground when the vehicle moves forward as a deliberate action of the rider

4. Where required, check an inhibitor is; Motorcycle Single Vehicle Approval Manual Stands January 2019, 1/2 1

a) fitted

So……, the above rules DO NOT apply to the new 250W LPM category.

It goes on and on like this!

IN SUMMARY

The DfT have kindly informed us through the BAGB that they have

**"Updated the Motorcycle Single Vehicle Approval test to include a sub-category for "Twist and go" electric bikes, which require type approval before sale but which can otherwise be used like other 'normal' e-bikes.

Fewer modifications will now be needed for these machines to pass the test and gain type approval. The MSVA test costs £55 per individual vehicle.

It can be then used essentially as a normal bicycle (although the

rider must be aged 14 or over). But if such a bike has a motor which

can be operated without the rider pedalling, it has since Jan 2016

required type approval before sale (in accordance with EU regulation 168/2013) and is known as a Twist & Go (T&G) EAPC."

FOR MORE DETAIL

See

https://www.gov.uk/electric-bike-rules

http://tinyurl.com/ycl3zz4l

http://tinyurl.com/y94cpfo8

** Peter Elland BAGB

All the best, David

Well done to Wisper for keeping on top of the regulatory changes.

But it's worth pointing out that throttles - for many users - are not the benefit they think they are going to be.

Legal ebikes are not powerful enough to work very well on a throttle, and it's wearing - and deathly boring - sitting on a bike holding one open.

Pedalling helps control and balance and is not a hardship for most riders.

I agree Rob, but for many people it’s the only way of getting out and about on a bicycle. This was always one of the huge advantages of eBiking until the law was changed in 2016.

We are again able to offer those who find a full rotation of the cranks a challenge or those that need a breather occasionally the opportunity to ride a Wisper!... Other brands of ebikes are available!!! :0)

All the best, David

Any bike that has a throttle and is certified by an independent testing house can be Type Approved to have a full working throttle. The bigger questions are 1. Does the supplier want all the hassle of going through the TA process. 2. Will the bike work well with a full throttle?

Normally we void the warranty if the throttle is opened or if the bike is changed from factory settings. An open throttle puts a lot mots pressure on the wiring, connections and other electronic and mechanical parts.

We charge £199.00 plus the £55.00 test fee for an open throttle. This cover the changes we need to make to the programming, keep the Warranty at 2 years and do all the running around to get the bike Type Approved, this currently involves a member of staff taking each bike from Sevenoaks Kent down to Southampton for testing.

All the best, David

Apologies if this is a stupid question but I thought once you get type approval for a bike model, any bikes you sell of that model are automatically type approved? i.e. the 806 torque in your screenshot above (which I assume is the folding bike on your website) is now always type approved for anyone that buys one?

I'm completely new to the ebike scene and am looking to buy a bike to ride to the station and back each day (1.1 miles each way). The problem is that I live at the top of a long hill so getting to the station is all down hill, but getting back is a killer without a throttle. Ideally, I'd like the option to use the throttle without having to pedal (even if I don't really use it).

Apologies if this is a stupid question but I thought once you get type approval for a bike model, any bikes you sell of that model are automatically type approved?

Trouble is this method is not Type Approval, it's SVA, Single Vehicle Approval, each one tested and separately certified and documented.

But of course if it's a model they've certified previously, that should speed up the test.

Type Approval is only available to manufacturers and is a very expensive process, costing around £10,000 a model typically. And once type approved a powered bike becomes a motor vehicle in law, no longer a pedelec with all the regulations that entails

.

Ideally, I'd like the option to use the throttle without having to pedal (even if I don't really use it).

If the bike has pedal rotation sensing the motor will give as much as it can (on a given power setting) as long as the pedals are going round. No need to put any pressure on them; if you are in a low enough gear the motor can pull the bike faster than your (very slow) pedalling. And if it can't pull you up the hill that way on full power, it won't be able to do it with the throttle either.

With torque sensing you do need to put some pedal power in; but on a typical bike the motor will give you 3 parts for every one part you put in.

Even so, it can be nice just to get pulled along without rotating the pedals at all.

Trouble is this method is not Type Approval, it's SVA, Single Vehicle Approval, each one tested and separately certified and documented.

Ahh, I assumed the certificate in the screenshot above was a type approval and not SVA.

So just to make things clear, if you get a type approval, it essentially registers the vehicle as a motorbike subjecting it to tax, registration and insurance requirements but if you do a single vehicle approval, it allows you to continue as if it were a regular pedelec but makes using a full twist and go throttle (without pedalling) legal?

We charge £199.00 plus the £55.00 test fee for an open throttle. This cover the changes we need to make to the programming, keep the Warranty at 2 years and do all the running around to get the bike Type Approved, this currently involves a member of staff taking each bike from Sevenoaks Kent down to Southampton for testing.

Do you have a recommendation for one of your bikes to get an SVA for my situation? (riding 1.1 miles each way to the station almost completely uphill on the way back).

Any bike that has a throttle and is certified by an independent testing house can be Type Approved to have a full working throttle. The bigger questions are 1. Does the supplier want all the hassle of going through the TA process. 2. Will the bike work well with a full throttle?

 

Normally we void the warranty if the throttle is opened or if the bike is changed from factory settings. An open throttle puts a lot mots pressure on the wiring, connections and other electronic and mechanical parts.

 

We charge £199.00 plus the £55.00 test fee for an open throttle. This cover the changes we need to make to the programming, keep the Warranty at 2 years and do all the running around to get the bike Type Approved, this currently involves a member of staff taking each bike from Sevenoaks Kent down to Southampton for testing.

 

All the best, David

Do you have any bikes that you recommend to have an open throttle for my situation? (riding 1.1 miles each way to the station, almost completely uphill on the way back)

Ahh, I assumed the certificate in the screenshot above was a type approval and not SVA.

 

So just to make things clear, if you get a type approval, it essentially registers the vehicle as a motorbike subjecting it to tax, registration and insurance requirements but if you do a single vehicle approval, it allows you to continue as if it were a regular pedelec but makes using a full twist and go throttle (without pedalling) legal?

That's it exactly, it's because the type approval regulations are motor vehicle law, with a specific exemption for compliant pedelecs.

This SVA arrangement to allow throttles is unique to Great Britain, the DfT allowing it here to meet this uniquely British demand. It doesn't seem to worry the continentals, probably because they never had them in the first instance.

.

That's it exactly, it's because the type approval regulations are motor vehicle law, with a specific exemption for compliant pedelecs.

 

This SVA arrangement to allow throttles is unique to Great Britain, the DfT allowing it here to meet this uniquely British demand. It doesn't seem to worry the continentals, probably because they never had them in the first instance.

.

And just to clarify, even if you convert your regular bike to electric with a full throttle, you are required to obtain an SVA prior to it being road legal?