Freego battery Replacement

[Wisper Bikes]

Importer of just 1 battery can lead to all this???
I had no idea
A downed ship, plane or house destroyed is alarming.
I never gave that a thought when I ordered the 36V 12 Ah battery for SWMBO

That's the problem, very few people understand the issues regarding importing batteries, it's all very tedious and expensive. If an importer does not follow a few simple guide lines and something went seriously wrong, not only could the importer be bankrupted, they could end up in the nick!

"I didn't know the law your honour" wouldn't stick.

I agree these batteries, like a lot of other products should not be sold on Auction sites without proof of certification.

So far I know of one Dreamliner (quite expensive!) and several houses that have been burnt down with Lithium batteries inside them.

As soon as the fire people see a large burnt out lithium battery in the ruins of a house, even if it wan't at fault, they will be after certification.

The few quid we lose by a few people buying directly from unknown factories in China is not my concern. I am simply warning people of the consequences.

It's the same with eBikes in general, they have to conform to EN15194 to be legal in the UK. If there was an accident and the correct certification was not available the insurers would run a mile. The cost of TUV certifying a single eBike is between £3,500 and £5,500 we have six models all with different certificates. The maths is very straight forward. There are many hidden reasons why it costs more to buy bone fide electrical equipment from a reputable company than to buy of an auction site.

All the best, David

 

[289]

It isn't an auction site that the battery is advertised.
it is DHGate.........I'm sure they have rules and proceedures.


What is the Ah rating of your £299 small battery ???

The problem is the price of a new 16Ah Wisper battery......when all that is required is a replacement pack.
SWMBO would not let me spend £555!
that is five hundred and fifty five pounds on 1 battery to get me up 2 wee hills

I'm sure you could make enquiries on behalf of current Wisper owners to your supplier. Perhaps another supplier would be willing to help.
Perhaps there is a business opportunity here for an importer of just battery packs

Well over a £200 saving is more than a few quid to this old pensioner

 

[the_killjoy]

The alternative to a new battery is to have the old one re-celled, I had my 13.5aH re-celled for £250

http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Insat-Li-NMC-eBike-Battery-Electric-Bike-10-15Ah-24V-36V-48V-e-bike-battery-/331485310419

 

[Wisper Bikes]

Hi 289, our small battery is 375Wh.

All the best, David

 

[289]

China for me again......going on price alone

There does seem to be a market for Wisper battery re-cells as others have shown.

Why don't you ask your supplier to help with this request?
A sale is better than no sale at all.

 

[Kudoscycles]

China for me again......going on price alone

There does seem to be a market for Wisper battery re-cells as others have shown.

Why don't you ask your supplier to help with this request?
A sale is better than no sale at all.

Don't air ship batteries from China unless you are sure that the shipper is fully trained in packaging lithium batteries,and has all the correct labeling and certification,the fines from the CAA can be euros 20,000.
Even sea ship is becoming difficult but air ship is just not worth the risk.
KudosDave
ps I dont sell batteries except for servicing Kudos Bikes so this is not trying to be persuasive with an ulterior motive.

 

[Wisper Bikes]

The

Don't air ship batteries from China unless you are sure that the shipper is fully trained in packaging lithium batteries,and has all the correct labeling and certification,the fines from the CAA can be euros 20,000.
Even sea ship is becoming difficult but air ship is just not worth the risk.
KudosDave
ps I dont sell batteries except for servicing Kudos Bikes so this is not trying to be persuasive with an ulterior motive.

These guys always declare batteries as under 100Wh. This is a disaster waiting to happen.

 

[vidtek]

While it does seem expensive at the moment, maybe Brexit will mean less restrictive imports for battery packs, without the TUV and eurocratic rules and regulations. I'm sure it's not beyond the wit of our own parliament to ensure the rules put in place post exit regarding battery packs are sensible and strike the right balance between practicality and a fair go for the consumer and dealer alike. In the meantime check this out, this Israeli guy knows a thing or two about the technology and his article is a very informative and practical guide to replacing your own cells.

http://www.ebikeschool.com/how-to-build-a-diy-electric-bicycle-lithium-battery-from-18650-cells/

His advice on not going for the cheapest but the safest and best option seems to me very good advice, much better than many youtuber's hairbrained and dangerous examples out there.

The only problem is the cost of a spot-welder suitable for the job, maybe the Pedelec community can ask for donations and we can all club together to buy one for the community to enable it to be sent on loan to members for a small fee and the shipping costs. Further to this, perhaps a supply of the nickel strips and large shrink-wrap can be made available to members. Just an idea to put out there-not just for the Freego but all pedelec batteries post warranty.

ps. I'd be happy to be the first guinea pig in this battery experiment and would be ok to chip in the first $50

 

[Deleted member 4366]

When you get your battery re-celled by Insat International (ebay link above), you get a choice of the best cells available. After the re-celling, you can have a battery with considerably more capacity and or power. Battery cell technology has moved on considerably since you origininally bought your battery. These re-cells give you access to the latest developments.

In other words, the re-cell will improve it a lot from what it originally was.

 

[vidtek]

When you get your battery re-celled by Insat International (ebay link above), you get a choice of the best cells available. After the re-celling, you can have a battery with considerably more capacity and or power. Battery cell technology has moved on considerably since you origininally bought your battery. These re-cells give you access to the latest developments.

In other words, the re-cell will improve it a lot from what it originally was.

d8veh- You don't think much of my idea then? There is a lot of unused talent out there in our community, not least of all yourself. You seem to have a real grasp of battery tech. Surely the Pedelec community can be a route to many people avoiding the pitfalls of DIY battery replacement, with guidance from tech-savvy people like you and in a small way myself. If we can demonstrate how it can be done safely and at a large discount to the normal battery replacement sources why wouldn't the Pedelec community support such an idea?

 

[vidtek]

d8veh- You don't think much of my idea then? There is a lot of unused talent out there in our community, not least of all yourself. You seem to have a real grasp of battery tech. Surely the Pedelec community can be a route to many people avoiding the pitfalls of DIY battery replacement, with guidance from tech-savvy people like you and in a small way myself. If we can demonstrate how it can be done safely and at a large discount to the normal battery replacement sources why wouldn't the Pedelec community support such an idea?

If you look at 289's response, he is typical of where people's priorities lie in the real world. He cannot see the value of paying 3 times the price for an item he can directly source for a third of that. Wringing of hands and saying how wrong it is will do diddly-sqat - it will happen however much the industry deplores it.
As a community we must show them a better way, by supporting them in their DIY efforts, sourcing good quality materials and batteries, then helping them as they build their own battery packs SAFELY.

 

[vidtek]

When you get your battery re-celled by Insat International (ebay link above), you get a choice of the best cells available. After the re-celling, you can have a battery with considerably more capacity and or power. Battery cell technology has moved on considerably since you origininally bought your battery. These re-cells give you access to the latest developments.

In other words, the re-cell will improve it a lot from what it originally was.

d8veh- I probably posted this in the wrong area, will post in a more appropriate place
Cheers, Tony

 

[289]

D8veh and Vidtek spot on.

Just about to forward battery and payment to get battery re-celled at a very reasonable cost. Courier collection and delivery included in this UK service.

Was just about to go again to China then contacted UK comapny after reading post above.

This auld pensioner and his wife are looking forward to be soon oot and aboot on oor bikes.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

d8veh- You don't think much of my idea then? There is a lot of unused talent out there in our community, not least of all yourself. You seem to have a real grasp of battery tech. Surely the Pedelec community can be a route to many people avoiding the pitfalls of DIY battery replacement, with guidance from tech-savvy people like you and in a small way myself. If we can demonstrate how it can be done safely and at a large discount to the normal battery replacement sources why wouldn't the Pedelec community support such an idea?

Battery repair/manufacture is not a job for amateurs. The welding takes lots of practice to get it right. You need a lot of different materials. You can buy a complete battery for less than what you'll pay for the cells and BMS. You still need a case, heat-shrink, nickel strip, wire, solder, connectors and test equipment.

If you're interested in finding out about batteries, it's good to do as a learning excercise, but it won't be an economic way of getting a new battery.

 

[vidtek]

Battery repair/manufacture is not a job for amateurs. The welding takes lots of practice to get it right. You need a lot of different materials. You can buy a complete battery for less than what you'll pay for the cells and BMS. You still need a case, heat-shrink, nickel strip, wire, solder, connectors and test equipment.

If you're interested in finding out about batteries, it's good to do as a learning excercise, but it won't be an economic way of getting a new battery.

d8veh-
I tend to disagree with you about not being a job for amateurs, I myself have replaced many battery packs individually over the years, mainly power tools, but I did have access to some decent tools in my factory, as well as an industrial spot welder (I still have a half interest in my trailer factory in Perth). Although my background is as a television engineer and I understand schematics and power supplies I see no reason a talented amateur could not do the same.
I am sure once a good supply chain is established, there are many savings to be had in a rebuild, I am not suggesting a build from scratch. There are links to the Alibaba site where good Samsung cells and quality BMS boards can be sourced for a fraction of the cost of a professional rebuild, so I respectfully suggest maybe you can have another think about it. If it turns out that the figures just don't add up, then I will bow to your better judgement and abandon the idea.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

All I can say is try it, and then see if you think it's an economical proposition.

There's a plentiful supply of cheap ready-made replacement batteries and good quality re-celling. It's mainly ignorance that stops people using these services. Why would anybody want to spend £500 on a replacement battery, when you can get a better one for £250?

You don't even need to fit the same type/style of battery on many bikes. You can swap your crappy rack one for a nice down-tube one, which, as well as better handling, would give more power and capacity.

When people buy a bike, the savvy ones might ask about the cost of a replacement battery. For many bikes. that's an irrelevant question, but some expensive bikes use Canbus or other communication with the battery, which locks you in to a direct replacement. For me, that would be an import consideration. It also locks you out from repairing/replacing other important modules as well, like motor, controller and HMI. If you're technically ignorant, that makes no difference because you'd be taking your bike back to the dealer to be fixed anyway. and be at the mercy of their charges.

 

[anotherkiwi]

I thought about building batteries for myself and others at one point and the conclusion was let people like Insat do it. @vidtek you have the know how but many people including DIY pedelec builders familliar with soldering irons wouldn't risk using a spot welder on a battery cell.

After lots of research I chose to go the LiPo route because I have the time to watch over charging and am careful and methodical. I can have a 16 Ah LiPo for the cost of a 10.4 Ah Li-Ion including chargers and sundry.

 

[289]

.....battery re-celled by Insat International (ebay link above), you get a choice of the best cells available. ......

Just done this and had a great service from Mary,Jimmy and the Insat Team.
16Ah battey re-celled, case repaired, new charger, all collected and delivered for a VERY reasonable cost.

I was very happy with the Chineese battery that I fitted to the wifes 705Wisper and thought about going that route again but decided to give the Insat team a chance with my Alpino Wisper bike.

Just back from my first outing with the new improved battery and can highly recommend this cost effective method for a new battery.

Wi her new hips and ma new battery.....oor wee dug will need to keep up wi these auld pensioners
Just waiting on some sunshine for SWMBO and the dug to join me in our outings wi the bikes.