First attempt ebike conversion

[RollingChunder]

To me, a motorbike would suit you better. Getting a motorbike license is extremely fun and riding the thing is so much more exhilarating than an ebike. I have ridden a 1500w throttle ebike and it's a novelty going 30mph on a bicycle but its not as fun as being the fastest thing on the road. It's only 2hp after all.

My ebike is a tool that allows me to commute 12.5 miles on a bicycle instead of taking the car or motorbike. I try to use the battery as little as possible so I get more exercise. It's boring if you sit there at 15mph doing nothing (I've tried it). I'd recommend getting something you could at least pass off as legal as the only time you'd get to use 30mph would be on main roads where you get overtaken by cars and lorries anyway.

 

[Apples24]

It’s not so much the top speed it’s the grunt for the hills I’m prob 21 stone

peddling is deffo what I want to do but I want a bit of both if I want to pop a Mike to the hop uphill without peddling atal I can

 

[Woosh]

It’s not so much the top speed it’s the grunt for the hills I’m prob 21 stone

direct drive motors are not very good for heavy riders.
You need good torque. Direct drive motors have poor starting up torque.
For your weight, a crank drive is best, a large geared hub like my DWG22C is also suitable.

 

[Benjahmin]

If you want the assist for hills then a direct drive motor is definitly a waste of money and time.
They are good at high speed on the flat. On hilss, as the rpm falls, they become battery gobbling heaters.
Despite repeated nudges towards a legal geared hub you seem to be persisting on following this big numbers motor dead end.
As has been pointed out several times now, a legal geared hub (rated at 250w continuous power) will actually give you 7-800w on hills, depending on controller setting. As the power will reach the road far more efficiently than any direct drive motor, this will give you more usable hill climbing power without overheating.
You would also end up with a bike that is not liable to being seized.
I recently took a direct drive motor off a bike I was working on, it weighed a mighty 8.5Kg in it's wheel.
It's replacement geared hub was a little under 5Kg in it's wheel.
The direct drive is a 48v Dillenger of unknown rating in a 26" rear wheel. You can have it if you want it. PM me and pay the postage - it's yours.

 

[RollingChunder]

It’s not so much the top speed it’s the grunt for the hills I’m prob 21 stone

peddling is deffo what I want to do but I want a bit of both if I want to pop a Mike to the hop uphill without peddling atal I can

As above, a geared "250w rated" hub motor is what you want. 48v battery and controller, a good amount of amps on both but research on how much current you can put through the motor before gears melt and strip (not a problem for direct drives).

a large geared hub like my DWG22C

Does this have plastic gears? How much sustained wattage have you seen them take?

 

[Peter.Bridge]

Not sure a Direct Drive hub is what you want for what you are describing - either a geared hub like the Woosh DWG22C (48v 17amp max power input) - (which is legal to use on UK roads) or maybe a BBS02B crank drive (48v 25amp max power input) (which isn't legal on UK roads) - can get with 20Ah battery for £650. The advantage (and disadvantage) of the crank drive is the power is going through the gearing / drivetrain - so you get the gearing up hills with the motor still running in it's power band and potentially a high top speed , but will wear chains / cassettes (not designed for that power). FWIW, for road use ,I find my geared hub drive more relaxing to ride. Those Direct Drive hubs are also very heavy.

 

[saneagle]

If you want the assist for hills then a direct drive motor is definitly a waste of money and time.
They are good at high speed on the flat. On hilss, as the rpm falls, they become battery gobbling heaters.
Despite repeated nudges towards a legal geared hub you seem to be persisting on following this big numbers motor dead end.
As has been pointed out several times now, a legal geared hub (rated at 250w continuous power) will actually give you 7-800w on hills, depending on controller setting. As the power will reach the road far more efficiently than any direct drive motor, this will give you more usable hill climbing power without overheating.
You would also end up with a bike that is not liable to being seized.
I recently took a direct drive motor off a bike I was working on, it weighed a mighty 8.5Kg in it's wheel.
It's replacement geared hub was a little under 5Kg in it's wheel.
The direct drive is a 48v Dillenger of unknown rating in a 26" rear wheel. You can have it if you want it. PM me and pay the postage - it's yours.

You know that you can make good wind generators out of them?

 

[Apples24]

So what’s benefits over a geared wheel hub motor over a direct drive one?

 

[Woosh]

So what’s benefits [over] a geared wheel hub motor over a direct drive one?

Geared hub motors have a typical internal 1:5 gearbox. The torque is 5 times higher at low speed.

 

[Apples24]

I see they go up to 500w

too speed isn’t tooimportant but I worry woukd one get a 20 odd stone lump of a man around

if it woukd get up a good hill without peddling then it would be fine , but a 1500w direct drive one on that fat bike did too but watched battery go down a couple bars

Maybe I’m caught up on power figures but I’d hate to spend all that money and feel it’s not powerfull enough

I’m not worried about police I’m not going to ride like an idiot

 

[Az.]

if it woukd get up a good hill without peddling then it would be fine
(...)
I’m not worried about police I’m not going to ride like an idiot

It is enough for police to see 20 stone man travelling up hill without peddling on a bike with dinner plate motor. It is not a rocket science really.

Why won't you buy yourself a moped?

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[guerney]

@Woosh - tell @Apples24 about your new bike, the WOOSH BIG TORQUER BIGGER TROUSERS™

...or about the alternative .hex file for your new TSDZ8?

 

[lenny]

 

[Peter.Bridge]

Q128H Light & Torquey 800W Hub Motor

After a long search for hub motors that are light, good for climbing hills, freewheel easily, and inconspicuous, three stood out: Q100H (Aikema, sold by BMS Battery & topbikekit) Q128H (Aikema, sold by BMS Battery & topbikekit if you ask) Xiongda XD 2-speed (sold by manufacturer and Luna) As...

endless-sphere.com

 

[Woosh]

the Q128H is good but not as robust as the DWG22C.

 

[Peter.Bridge]

the Q128H is good but not as robust as the DWG22C.

From a purely engineering perspective what would be the max controller current at 48 V you could put through the DWG22C

 

[Apples24]

I dont want a motorbike if I want to go out in a toy I have a escort rs turbo for a bit of fun

 

[Woosh]

From a purely engineering perspective what would be the max controller current at 48 V you could put through the DWG22C

it's as robust as the the Bafang BPM cassette version which is its (more expensive) cousin. IIRC, saneagle pumped 1kw through his BPM.

 

[Az.]

I dont want a motorbike if I want to go out in a toy I have a escort rs turbo for a bit of fun

Motorbike is exactly what you are looking for. You just want pedals attached to it for some reason. 2000W is not 8% or 15% above legal limit. It is 8 times the legal limit.

 

[guerney]

Would 20A X 48V = 960W at the crank utilising appropriate gearing for a 20 stone rider be a good solution? I don't know if 20A is enabled by the alternative .hex file @Woosh has for his new 750W rated TSDZ8 motor, labelled and legally rated as 250W. And it's torque sensored, possibly not as easy as cadence sensored motors, for heavy riders tackling hills?