Fire at ebike showroom

[Deus]

India Today: Fire at Telangana e-bike showroom kills 8, owner on the run.

8 people dead, several jump off to save themselves after fire at Hyderabad e-bike showroom

At least eight people died after fire broke out in an e-bike showroom, which spread to a lodge on the upper floor in Telangana's Secunderabad.

www.indiatoday.in

 

[guerney]

Things have gone from Hyderabad to Hyderaworse

 

[StuartsProjects]

If this type of incident continues, people might get to idea there is some risk involved with eBikes.

 

[Nealh]

It all boils down to charging as looks likely as indicated in the story.
Simly leaving bikes on charge way past there charge duration is a no no and those who do it at night when gone to bed is a short cut to the undertakers.

 

[Nealh]

There's another near horror story on ES where a guys bike batterie/s have failed and caught fire in his garage, lucky for him he heard the commotion and extinguishd it with a hose pipe and saved his bike before the fire truck turning up.
On ES they do lots of silly things with batteries which they aren't designed for and this looks to be a classic case.
The guy used two UPP batteries (some would say not the greatest batteries in the world) a 54v and 58v and had them wired inseries for 112v.
It isn't clear if the bikes were on charge but the pictures appear to indicate so with a charger evident under the part burnt bike.
When one starts to mess with batteries with BMS then one has to think hard about what they are doing.
Parallel connecting is ok if one knows the protocols involved but cherging is a no no.
Series connecting and charging involves a whole new ball game and very high voltage brings risks which the BMS components aren't rated for.

Note the charger under the bike.
Even if the guy was charging the batteries independently, the likelihood is the the BMS's on either battery were compromised by the series discharging in use and the 112v was'is way above the components volatage rating.

 

[Andy-Mat]

If this type of incident continues, people might get to idea there is some risk involved with eBikes.

There is always a risk with the type of battery used, care must always be 100% correct.
Tesla cars have had people die in battery fires, ones that spread so rapidly, the driver could not get out in time!!
A recent one:-
In Woodlands, Tex., two passengers died in April 2021 after a driverless Tesla veered off the road, struck a tree and burst into flames. The battery ignited and burned for four hours, requiring 30,000 gallons of water to extinguish the fire,

The Post reported.22 Jun 2022

Take GREAT CARE!
Andy

 

[matthewslack]

Series connection can easily lead to unanticipated faults during charging as the circuitry in the chargers themselves comes into play.

The 'simple' way to charge those 54 and 58V batteries is to plug in their respective chargers to the batteries and then both into the mains... at which point the non-isolated voltage conversion circuitry in the chargers stands a chance of shorting out one of the batteries.

A number of failure scenarios possible from there, including the huge short curcuit current in the cable from charger to battery that is only sized for 2 or 3 or 4 amps, and unless that is caught in time by a fuse, the cable will burn.

Golden rules: don't do anything you don't understand, and never leave out the fuse.

 

[StuartsProjects]

Golden rules: don't do anything you don't understand, and never leave out the fuse.

Intially you dont know what you dont know.

But after a fair bit of experience you do appreciate how much you dont know.

 

[matthewslack]

Intially you dont know what you dont know.

But after a fair bit of experience you do appreciate how much you dont know.

Always good to learn from others' experience rather than just ones own!

And assume you might have missed something!

 

[Andy-Mat]

There is always a risk with the type of battery used, care must always be 100% correct.
Tesla cars have had people die in battery fires, ones that spread so rapidly, the driver could not get out in time!!
A recent one:-
In Woodlands, Tex., two passengers died in April 2021 after a driverless Tesla veered off the road, struck a tree and burst into flames. The battery ignited and burned for four hours, requiring 30,000 gallons of water to extinguish the fire,

The Post reported.22 Jun 2022
View attachment 48817
Take GREAT CARE!
Andy

Teslas Catching on Fire More and More

There have been several hundred fires confirmed from Tesla cars, as many as 300 estimated so far. That’s incredible in itself. Allegedly the Ford Pinto had a tiny fraction of that number yet caused international outrage. More to the point, there are now 32 recorded fatalities from Tesla fires...

securityboulevard.com

Flaming Tesla has to be buried in pit to extinguish battery

‘This is a whole new animal for the fire service,’ captain says

www.independent.co.uk

regards
Andy

 

[matthewslack]

I remember years ago when I did some DofE stuff at the local fire station being told about what was then called a 'Class D' fire, which had the characteristic of 'you can't put it out, just have to contain it and wait'. In those days it was magnesium alloy engine blocks apparently.

 

[slowcoach]

I can remember on a fire course at our local firestation. Came time to look at extinguishing various types of materials burning in cut down oil drums. Got to the magnesium swarf fire. Nothing really happening as the lecturer gets us to lean over and take a close look. Then he sprayed water on it. A lesson that I will never forget.

 

[Andy-Mat]

I can remember on a fire course at our local firestation. Came time to look at extinguishing various types of materials burning in cut down oil drums. Got to the magnesium swarf fire. Nothing really happening as the lecturer gets us to lean over and take a close look. Then he sprayed water on it. A lesson that I will never forget.

You have reminded me of an incident in the RN fire training I attended (several times over 10 years!).
I remember a hot oil fire (reacts differently to a cold oil fire), that was sending 30 foot flames in the air. The trainer, who was telling us all to gather round to watch what happens when water hits a hot oil fire, was turning on the water, to a nozzle mounted way above the fire. I noticed that he turned his back on the fire, while all the students were getting closer, I just back pedaled rapidly, the only one who did so!
He mentioned that afterwards to everybody.....
The water came down and suddenly the flames almost exploded and doubled in size. many observers got hair and eyelashes singed.....but not me, thoughthe wave of heat was bad enough where I got to!!
This is what many people do when their chip pan catches fire! I bet that they only do it once!
Far better is a wet towel, drapped over the chip pan, heat off and let it cool slowly of course.....
Watch this:-

regards
Andy
PS. I stumbled on this, nothing to do with the subject, but totally hilarious for people who are not stupid. I had to share, sorry!! Enjoy:-

 

[sjpt]

The only demonstration I remember was a very low key one somewhere on the West Coast (Kyle of Lochalsh I think); they couldn't get the fire to start because of the rain.

 

[StuartsProjects]

The only demonstration I remember was a very low key one somewhere on the West Coast (Kyle of Lochalsh I think); they couldn't get the fire to start because of the rain.

Ah, memories.

Waiting in the queue to get a vehicle across before the bridge was built.

The flesh devouring midges when camping at Glen Brittle.

The very very long days on the black cullin ridge.

 

[guerney]

Our chemistry teacher showed us this lithium and water reaction - releases hydrogen:

...he then demonstrated this sodium reaction, without the safety glass.

 

[flash]

I remember years ago when I did some DofE stuff at the local fire station being told about what was then called a 'Class D' fire, which had the characteristic of 'you can't put it out, just have to contain it and wait'. In those days it was magnesium alloy engine blocks apparently.

and wheels

 

[sjpt]

Ah, memories.

Waiting in the queue to get a vehicle across before the bridge was built.

The flesh devouring midges when camping at Glen Brittle.

The very very long days on the black cullin ridge.

Our favourite is Ferry House at the Glenelg ferry, in May before the worst of the midges (and not camping) but the days already long. Sadly rather a long drive from Winchester (about 50% of our annual mileage there and back).

 

[Crawfojo]

I would like to see a web incident reporting site or forum that would log all ebike batterie calamities which would log all the suspected causes of an incident as well as who the manufacturer of the individual cell is, the designer and assembler of the battery pack as well as the make and model of the BMS. I suspect the problems would be narrowed down to a few shoddy players or bad practices.

 

[Woosh]

people might get to idea there is some risk involved with eBikes.

there is a small but inherent risk of fire with anything electric, from your toaster to your fridge, TV, washing machine, laptop etc. The fire risks of e-bike batteries attract more attention because of the larger amount of heat produced by the batteries.
You need to be careful with batteries so do pay attention to the warnings on the batteries.
Also, a faulty charger can start a fire. Don't buy the cheapest charger there is on the net.