Fastest ebike charge?

[Deleted member 33385]

... if they can charge an EV in "5 Minutes":

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2021/jan/19/electric-car-batteries-race-ahead-with-five-minute-charging-times

...a little ebike battery would likely take seconds?

 

[MontyPAS]

... if they can charge an EV in "5 Minutes":

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2021/jan/19/electric-car-batteries-race-ahead-with-five-minute-charging-times

...a little ebike battery would likely take seconds?

Quoted in the article "they will be more difficult and expensive to manufacture, we’re likely to initially only see them in niche markets" So unless you want to pay a lot more for your batteries, probably not an option!

 

[Benjahmin]

EV's carry far more sophisticated circuitry as weight is not such a problem. This means they can mitigate against the damage, that high charging currents can cause, in a way that bike batteries can't.

 

[Woosh]

e-bike batteries and e-car batteries use the same cells.
Both would be available at the same time.

 

[Edward Elizabeth]

Ready for full production in 5 years.

But 5 years ago other firms were promising similar that never materialised.

And where does the increased voltage come from? Not such a problem for ebikes, but a massive issue for cars.

I would suggest this is a case of...

 

[Woosh]

But 5 years ago other firms were promising similar that never materialised.

this time, it's a proper pre-production run, so it is much more likely.
The main issue is the availability and cost of Germanium ($1240/kg, Lithium: $10-$11/kg). Replacing some graphite with Germanium is going to be expensive.

 

[Andy-Mat]

... if they can charge an EV in "5 Minutes":

https://www.theguardian.com/environment/2021/jan/19/electric-car-batteries-race-ahead-with-five-minute-charging-times

...a little ebike battery would likely take seconds?

A better way IMHO only, if you are not a fanatical "Anti weight" person, is to own a bike where the battery is easy, day or night, to replace with no tools. And also to own two batteries.
Remember, you will not need to take the second battery for all rides, just when you need the extra range. I have two of different capacities, as the one I view as being the "second", was bought as a "lighter, get you home" on long runs, and was a lot cheaper as well...
Having two of the same capacity, will also, in terms of years, increase the longevity of BOTH batteries (double the years if you use them fairly evenly), as any battery has a finite number of charges, before the capacity starts to drop. (Which does depend upon a great many different properties of course!)
In comparison to the "seconds" for a charge that you mentioned, and using my own bike as an example, it takes me about a minute to change a battery, with no tools! A younger stronger person, would do it in less time I am sure.....
A second battery would be both cheaper than these new Germanium ones, and available now.
Happy New Year to you and yours.
Andy
PS. I am surprised that no one else mentioned this....
PPS. Reducing body weight by the weight of the second battery, will give your health a boost, and the battery a "free ride"!

 

[vfr400]

I have a couple of ebike batteries that can charge in 5 minutes. They're designed to go in some sort of high power charging station, though I've never seen one. they also have a separate port for charging with a 10 amp charger that can charge them in 30 minutes. They're 24v lithium titanate batteries made by Toshiba that were fitted to Schwinn Tailwind bikes.

 

[01wellsd]

I've just fitted one of these to my bike, negating the need to charge at all

 

[Andy-Mat]

For anyone seeking to get the best possible life and performance out of their bike battery, reading the Battery University is a useful place to learn from.
At this time with the current types of Lithium cells, the faster the charge, the higher the SOC, the shorter the overall life span of the battery.
A good read can be found here:-

How to Prolong Lithium-based Batteries - Battery University

Discover what causes Li-ion to age and what the battery user can do to prolong its life

batteryuniversity.com

The following graph taken from that web site, demonstrates clearly as to why 4.2 volts was selected as being the best with regard to capacity and long term life, in cycles:-
Figure 5: Effects on cycle life at elevated charge voltages. Higher charge voltages boost capacity but lowers cycle life and compromises safety.

I hope this increases interest in Battery Knowledge here on Pedelec.
Battery University is a really great place to gain knowledge, even though the knowledge will not cover any very new developments and chemistries, as quickly as I would like!
But it will help a lot with the currently, generally available batteries, and not just Li-ion!
Happy New Year to all
Andy

 

[Andy-Mat]

I've just fitted one of these to my bike, negating the need to charge at all


View attachment 40316

Why and how, if I may ask? Sounds very interesting as its "only" a light I am given to understand....

Thanks for your reply.
Andy

 

[vfr400]

For anyone seeking to get the best possible life and performance out of their bike battery, reading the Battery University is a useful place to learn from.
At this time with the current types of Lithium cells, the faster the charge, the higher the SOC, the shorter the overall life span of the battery.
A good read can be found here:-

How to Prolong Lithium-based Batteries - Battery University

Discover what causes Li-ion to age and what the battery user can do to prolong its life

batteryuniversity.com

The following graph taken from that web site, demonstrates clearly as to why 4.2 volts was selected as being the best with regard to capacity and long term life, in cycles:-
Figure 5: Effects on cycle life at elevated charge voltages. Higher charge voltages boost capacity but lowers cycle life and compromises safety.
View attachment 40317
I hope this increases interest in Battery Knowledge here on Pedelec.
Battery University is a really great place to gain knowledge, even though the knowledge will not cover any very new developments and chemistries, as quickly as I would like!
But it will help a lot with the currently, generally available batteries, and not just Li-ion!
Happy New Year to all
Andy

Warning about that advice. By all means read that stuff and improve your understanding about lithium battery cells. All that research is about how individual cells behave. You have a battery of cells with a management pcb attached to them and controlling them. You can do harm to your battery if you do anything that stops that management system form working as intended, like not fully charging.

 

[01wellsd]

Why and how, if I may ask? Sounds very interesting as its "only" a light I am given to understand....

Thanks for your reply.
Andy

It was only a joke.
It's the Arc Reactor that Tony Stark uses to power his Iron Man armour in the Marvel universe.
I think we are many centuries before we see a fusion/nuclear reactor this small!

Even though in Back To The Future II there was the Mr Fusion Home Energy Reactor in the future of 2015!

 

[Andy-Mat]

You can do harm to your battery if you do anything that stops that management system form working as intended, like not fully charging.

Why would anyone do that, and why do you even mention it, in your opinion?
Also, you appear to be answering me (?), but as I did not see it mentioned by the Battery University (or myself) in the data I posted, which was all at the cell level, therefore no BMS......
So what are you talking about? You appear to be mildly confused IMO!
Happy New Year
Andy

 

[Andy-Mat]

It was only a joke.
It's the Arc Reactor that Tony Stark uses to power his Iron Man armour in the Marvel universe.
I think we are many centuries before we see a fusion/nuclear reactor this small!

Even though in Back To The Future II there was the Mr Fusion Home Energy Reactor in the future of 2015!

View attachment 40318

Good one!
Andy

 

[01wellsd]

Why would anyone do that, and why do you even mention it, in your opinion?
Also, you appear to be answering me (?), but as I did not see it mentioned by the Battery University (or myself) in the data I posted, which was all at the cell level, therefore no BMS......
So what are you talking about? You appear to be mildly confused IMO!
Happy New Year
Andy

I think that what VFR was getting at was that some people only like to charge to 80%, which I believe stops the BMS from balancing the cells.

 

[Deleted member 33385]

Aaaagghh I've been Googling like mad to find recent developments on supercapacitors... but they're not quite there yet - lightweight, no lithium, charge a car in seconds or an ebike in even less time... that technology has been simmering for years. Meanwhile, here are some capacitor bricks, we all have bricks:

https://medium.com/technicity/smart-bricks-is-a-novel-concept-in-energy-storage-84503f7379b5

 

[Deleted member 33385]

e-bike batteries and e-car batteries use the same cells.
Both would be available at the same time.

Yes and at scale, therefore likely at a price interesting to yours truly.

 

[Deleted member 33385]

Ready for full production in 5 years.

But 5 years ago other firms were promising similar that never materialised.

And where does the increased voltage come from? Not such a problem for ebikes, but a massive issue for cars.

I would suggest this is a case of...

View attachment 40311

There is so much to play for, it's not a matter of if but when. I'm hoping supercapacitors get here first because of weight, but they could be specacularly injurous in a crash.

 

[Deleted member 33385]

Why and how, if I may ask? Sounds very interesting as its "only" a light I am given to understand....

Thanks for your reply.
Andy

Lol there's always something emitting a bright light in nearly every science fiction film... just wait and it appears... a bright light of unknown contrivance or origin...