EU ICE ban postponed indefinetly.

[flecc]

EU agrees to exempt e-fuels from 2035 ban on combustion-engine cars

The exemption was included at the behest of Germany, which mounted a last-minute campaign to spare e-fuels from the 2035 ban. #EuropeNews

www.euronews.com

All formalised a cross EU now.
How they will enforce use of drop in fuels I have no idea. Don't think any sensors are capable of distinguishing E Fuels from fossil Fuels.??

What the EU does or doesn't do isn't relevant though, bans remain a national matter. The many countries in the EU or EFTA who have impending outright bans on ICE sales will still enforce them, as will Britain in 2030 (ICE only) and 2035 (Hybrid).

Norway is the first, the last ICE car sale allowed 31st December next year, 2024. Their commercial vehicle petrol and diesel last sales 31st December 2029.
.

 

[flecc]

How they will enforce use of drop in fuels I have no idea. Don't think any sensors are capable of distinguishing E Fuels from fossil Fuels.??

Heavy enough penalties to be a strong deterrence perhaps. Large fine, including confiscation and destruction of the car, plus a driving ban for using an uninsured vehicle since the vehicle will be illegal and therefore automatically uninsured.

And of course we don't know if the synthetic fuels are identical. They may require different injectors which would rule out sneaky use of old school petrol or diesel.
.

 

[Zlatan]

EU nations agree to install hydrogen fuelling stations in all major cities and every 200km along core routes | Hydrogen Insight

New regulation for the deployment of alternative fuels infrastructure (AFIR) agreed by Council of ministers and European Parliament late last night

www.hydrogeninsight.com

Interesting...

 

[flecc]

EU nations agree to install hydrogen fuelling stations in all major cities and every 200km along core routes | Hydrogen Insight

New regulation for the deployment of alternative fuels infrastructure (AFIR) agreed by Council of ministers and European Parliament late last night

www.hydrogeninsight.com

Interesting...

It's good to see that for hydrogen since it will enable fuel cells for long distance buses and coaches, not just bus fleets like those in some of our cities.

For BEVs the TEN-T network is already largely covered with enough chargers already, a surplus over much of it. The problem remains the areas off that major network,
mainly rural and more sparcely populated. That's where local government needs to act with national government support. Here in Britain some already have and set a good example, but this action needs to be more universal since such loss making areas will never attract the commercial charging companies.
.

 

[Zlatan]

No combustion engine ban exemptions for efuels says UK Government | Auto Express

New petrol and diesel cars will be banned from sale by 2035, with no plans to keep efuel-powered ICE cars on the market

www.autoexpress.co.uk

 

[guerney]

we're doomed

The Mining Industry’s Next Frontier Is Deep, Deep Under the Sea

Companies are diving to the bottom to scoop up metals essential for our EV-driven future. But how much ocean are we willing to sacrifice?

www.wired.com

 

[soundwave]

 

[Zlatan]

Think his original piece was tongue in cheek but he now makes valid points. Trouble is nobody actually knows.. Think we should buy cars to enjoy now and cross all those Bridges when we get to them. Don't think the e-fuels will affect man in street. It will be for those who can afford to buy and run super cars.. Will banning Morgan, Caterham, Westfield, Pembleton, TVR and such actually make the slightest difference to environment issues. I don't think so.
We, ve got the wrong people making decisions about technology. Politicians should set the required standards, targets and time scales. How we get there is for technicians and engineers. Zero emissions for transport is actually quite ridiculous. Its totally unobtainable, taking entire process into account.
Are we actually saying a Caterham 170, running a 660cc 3 cylinder motor, weighing circa 500kg is more damaging to environment than a 2500kg Tesla. Taking production, usage, and disposal into account I, d bet my house it isn't. Yet the Caterham will be banned...

 

[jonathan.agnew]

Think his original piece was tongue in cheek but he now makes valid points. Trouble is nobody actually knows.. Think we should buy cars to enjoy now and cross all those Bridges when we get to them. Don't think the e-fuels will affect man in street. It will be for those who can afford to buy and run super cars.. Will banning Morgan, Caterham, Westfield, Pembleton, TVR and such actually make the slightest difference to environment issues. I don't think so.
We, ve got the wrong people making decisions about technology. Politicians should set the required standards, targets and time scales. How we get there is for technicians and engineers. Zero emissions for transport is actually quite ridiculous. Its totally unobtainable, taking entire process into account.
Are we actually saying a Caterham 170, running a 660cc 3 cylinder motor, weighing circa 500kg is more damaging to environment than a 2500kg Tesla. Taking production, usage, and disposal into account I, d bet my house it isn't. Yet the Caterham will be banned...

Tricky, and this is very back of fag packet (after a few mojitos), but I guess 10l/100 miles means 15000L (or something like 13 tonnes) e5 over 150000 miles (my worryingly knackered old tesla is well past this, but still hanging in there) vs a 550kg lipo battery pack, assuming one generated the electricity in a mostly environmental way (say something like 40% of the time on a green tariff in uk). But I guess greenest solution is to emigrate away from a huge Anglo saxon nightmare of a city that demands one to drag several tonnes of scrap metal around for circa 40 miles a day because the public infrastructure suck.

 

[flecc]

Don't think the e-fuels will affect man in street. It will be for those who can afford to buy and run super cars.

Agreed, if only because such fuels will be very expensive anyway. But where will they fill up as time passes? Such miniscule usage will never be able to support the existing chain of filling stations, nor will charging points since that industry has developed completely different models which exclude liquid fuel stations. I foresee most of the existing 6000 filling stations shutting up shop in the long term, like the 4000 plus that have already done so over recent decades.

Politicians should set the required standards, targets and time scales. How we get there is for technicians and engineers. Zero emissions for transport is actually quite ridiculous. Its totally unobtainable, taking entire process into account.

They've set the standard, it's NET zero overall by 2050, not absolute zero for transport. However they are quite determined on this target as their latest decision shows, gas to be made more expensive to encourage (force) households to switch away from using it.

The UK politicians see net zero as the one remaining major chance this country has to lead the rest of the world, since we are behind with poor prospects in so many other major areas.

So I see them clinging onto that target more and more as each year passes and 2050 gets ever closer.
.

 

[flecc]

assuming one generated the electricity in a mostly environmental way (say something like 40% of the time on a green tariff in uk). - - - - - - - - drag several tonnes of scrap metal around for circa 40 miles a day because the public infrastructure suck.

Too gloomy!

Average daily mileage across the UK car fleet is half that, 7300 a year, 20 miles a day.

Which in turn means most charging done at home overnight, just like now with 85% done that way for existing BEVs. So in turn mostly with green energy as the BEV fleet and green energy production both increase together and the night surplus of energy is mostly green anyway.
.

 

[Zlatan]

Agreed, if only because such fuels will be very expensive anyway. But where will they fill up as time passes? Such miniscule usage will never be able to support the existing chain of filling stations, nor will charging points since that industry has developed completely different models which exclude liquid fuel stations. I foresee most of the existing 6000 filling stations shutting up shop in the long term, like the 4000 plus that have already done so over recent decades.



They've set the standard, it's NET zero overall by 2050, not absolute zero for transport. However they are quite determined on this target as their latest decision shows, gas to be made more expensive to encourage (force) households to switch away from using it.

The UK politicians see net zero as the one remaining major chance this country has to lead the rest of the world, since we are behind with poor prospects in so many other major areas.

So I see them clinging onto that target more and more as each year passes and 2050 gets ever closer.
.

But net zero is utterly ridiculous. How can digging up /making all those metals, minerals etc in production if a 3 ton vehicle possibly be net zero. The hidden environmental damages for EVs arer never spoken of,well rarerly. Are you really saying the overall damage of let's say a Kei car doing 100,000 miles is more than a Tesla S doing same mileage? I very much doubt it.
Laws should have been past years ago limiting weight's, sizes and emissions much lower than present.

 

[flecc]

But net zero is utterly ridiculous.

As I posted, not net zero from transport but by offset from other actions, like carbon capture and storage. E-cars will need a bit less of that than ICE cars over time. Net zero will only succeed if we succeed in the capture and storage of carbon. If that fails, net zero fails and a new medieval age beckons.

The hidden environmental damages for EVs are never spoken of, well rarerly.

It is and has been studied in depth.

Are you really saying the overall damage of let's say a Kei car doing 100,000 miles is more than a Tesla S doing same mileage? I very much doubt it.

It is, ultimately the e-car is always cleaner:

Are electric cars 'green'? The answer is yes, but it's complicated

Electric vehicles have surged in demand, and hit a record number last year as more and more people turn to battery-operated cars.

www.cnbc.com

But e-cars are a stepping stone to this quote. “So, it’s not a silver bullet for climate change mitigation. Ideally, you also try to reduce the number of cars massively, and try to push things such as public transport,” he said. “Getting people away from individual car transport is as important.”

Exactly as I've been posting and governments intend but dare not say for electoral reasons. There'll be a lot less private cars in future, of any kind.
.

 

[soundwave]

with a cbdc they will just take it out of ur account and have no choice to appeal it

at the end of the day it is about total control and taxing the living crap out of ppl any way they can think off as if we found a new free power supply so all could have free power it would never happen.

when do those new tesla lorrys come out ? should make a good size hole when one melts its self in to the road

Free energy patents - a Freedom of Information request to Intellectual Property Office

I would like to know how many patents for energy or free energy have been denied or blocked since 1990 and where I can find more information on this Yours faithfully, Taron Dosanjh

www.whatdotheyknow.com

you cant have anti matter either or anti gravity ect because if you had that and a free energy device you will be the enemy of the state

 

[Danidl]

Have ended my doddering around and pulled the plug on a 2021 ID3 with 5,000km on it and all bells and whistles. Getting the home charger on Monday . It is surprising how much the small incremental advances in things like lane assist and blind spot radar build up over a decade. With the Home charger, it can automatically use any excess PV Solar to charge the car, during the day and hold off if it's using grid power

 

[flecc]

Have ended my doddering around and pulled the plug on a 2021 ID3 with 5,000km on it and all bells and whistles. Getting the home charger on Monday . It is surprising how much the small incremental advances in things like lane assist and blind spot radar build up over a decade. With the Home charger, it can automatically use any excess PV Solar to charge the car, during the day and hold off if it's using grid power

Congratulations Danidl, delighted to learn you've joined the e-car ranks. I'm sure you'll love driving it, and even the bits when it's driving itself.
.

 

[soundwave]

 

[guerney]

There are conversion kits for classic cars which enable safe use of E10, I expect similar will become available for German air-capture sourced fuels.

 

[snafu]

 

[flecc]

Strange how with all the brains at Porsche and in Germany generally, they dont think things through. This car is very expensive and the synthetic fuel will also be. In addition the fuel won't be as widely available as petrol, which will still be on sale for all the existing cars until 2060 at least.

So the wealthy person will either use their existing petrol Porsche or buy one now. Then renew it in 2034 from the last ones being made and continue to drive on cheaper, widely available petrol until the car finally dies sometime after 2060, or until they die before.
.