E-BIKES ARE TAKING OFF IN THE UK – AND A NEW TAX BREAK COULD ENCOURAGE EVEN MORE PEOPLE TO SADDLE UP

[Woosh]

Wander, as long as the sum of (rentals + final sale) inclusive of VAT is more than 25% of the original purchase price inclusive of VAT, you can word it any way you like.
In my model for basic tax rate payer, the total paid is £465 + VAT (£558 inc VAT), if your are the employer, you can rent out the bike for nothing, and sell the bike at the end for £465 + VAT or a set any arbitrary rental and charge the difference at the end, for example, if you want the final sale to be £208.33 + VAT (£250 inc VAT), then set the rentals amount to £558 - £250 = £308 inc VAT in the hire contract.
As I said, as long as the end user pays in total more than 25% of the original price, there is no problem with HMRC.

 

[Wisper Bikes]

Ahem..... leave it to the professionals.

If you guys find it so tricky can you imagine Employers wanting to get involved?..............

Nor can I.

GCI have bundled it up neatly and have approval, why mess about?

 

[Woosh]

If you guys find it so tricky can you imagine Employers wanting to get involved?..............

I don't find it tricky. Most members don't deal with PAYE like I do.
It's much less hassle than dealing every month with payslips, pension contributions and tax forms.

 

[Wisper Bikes]

But you are wrong in your assumptions and calculations. It's all a bit strange, why creat such a fuss about something that has already been taken care of by someone who really understands the rules?

Maybe you simply like to be in the lime light?

All the best, David

 

[Wander]

Wander, as long as the sum of (rentals + final sale) inclusive of VAT is more than 25% of the original purchase price inclusive of VAT, you can word it any way you like.

Wrong again.

The problem with anything tax related is a little knowledge is a dangerous thing.

This thread has already shown that you were wrong about:-
The National Insurance rate.
Charging VAT.
A credit licence.
The basis for the VAT charge.
& a couple of other points.

As has been suggested above leave it to the professionals. I’ve checked through what I can find about the GCI scheme & am struggling to find any holes in it.

 

[Woosh]

But you are wrong in your assumptions and calculations.

do you know where I was wrong?
the self administered schemes are not in direct competition with the scheme providers. In fact, you can download sample C2W contracts from various universities for free. The aim is to make C2W as popular as possible. The scheme providers are often in competition with one another and adding cost and complexity where there weren't.

 

[Woosh]

This thread has already shown that you were wrong about:-
The National Insurance rate.
Charging VAT.
A credit licence.
The basis for the VAT charge.
& a couple of other points.

Why don't you correct my numbers?

 

[Wander]

Why don't you correct my numbers?

Don't need to, you appear to have already accepted that you were wrong on the points listed.

You are equally wrong on your latest statement.

I could probably get a book & do my own conveyancing. Do I? No not a chance, I'll leave it to a solicitor.

Likewise if I ever wanted to do C2W I'd use a company like GCI. I'd just accept that they know what they are talking about without putting an awful lot of effort into a scheme of my own just to save their 5% charge. More chance of them getting all the documentation right than me.

 

[Woosh]

Wander, I did not admit I was wrong and if anything, you just admitted that you don't know anymore than I do.
BTW, I use a solicitor when I buy a property and I act for myself when I sell.

 

[Wander]

... if anything, you just admitted that you don't know anymore than I do.

Strange conclusion to reach.

Do you do your own filings at Companies House as well? Maybe you should get someone to look at your most recent filings & correct them before you get them wrong next year as well.

Please don't get me wrong here. I admire your company & what you do. It's just there are some things that you should leave to professionals.

 

[Woosh]

yes, I do our accounts too. Did you spot anything wrong?

 

[EddiePJ]

Wander, I did not admit I was wrong and if anything, you just admitted that you don't know anymore than I do.

Given the failure of Wander to correct your figures and statements, that is how I am reading it as well.

Wander, back up your claim by correcting the figures.

Saying "don't need to" isn't an acceptable reply, given that the request of you doing so by Woosh, is a fair and reasonable one.

 

[Wander]

Saying "don't need to" isn't an acceptable reply, given that the request of you doing so by Woosh, is a fair and reasonable one.

In your opinion!
But if you read back you'll find Woosh has made a number of mistakes already.

 

[Wander]

yes, I do our accounts too. Did you spot anything wrong?

Yep, mistakes in more than one of your filings. But do you really want me to point them out in an open forum? I'll PM you.

 

[Woosh]

OK, wander.

 

[Wisper Bikes]

Hi all,

Just in case you were wondering:

We are discussing the new Green Commute Initiative. A scheme that enables employees buying an electric bicycle to do so by sacrificing gross sallary to pay for their bike. This means they can save up to 42% off the retail price. The Green Commute Initiative is different from other C2W schemes, it has no upper limit, a final payment of only £1 to buy the bike and it costs the dealer only 5%.

GCI will arrange all the details with employers not already on the scheme and will lend them the cash to buy your bike if necessary. The loan would cost less than the NI the employer would normally have to pay if the employee was not on the scheme. It's a "no brainer".

All the best, David

 

[Green Commute Initiative]

Having thought about the original concept I can see what Whoosh is trying to do. However I believe there is a fundamental problem with the approach of low rentals and then a payment at the end to account for the price of the bike. This is a hire purchase transaction. Even if you call it something else. IMO HMRC will simply say it's a hire purchase and that doesn't qualify for C2W because the employee can't own the bike. http://www.legislation.gov.uk/ukpga/2003/1/section/244 condition 2

There is also the matter of issuing a Hire Purchase agreement without FCA authorisation. Courts often rule an agreement a sham if it's clear it's purpose is something other than it says it is. If they did that you are in real trouble.

This is why all the C2W providers have a hire arrangement and then in a seperate transaction dispose of, hire or loan the bike.

This is why we spend £600 an hour with Eversheds, the UK's leading credit lawyers. Come to think of it maybe 5% is too cheap

 

[Green Commute Initiative]

Now after all that argy bargy does anyone fancy a free e-bike cultural tour? If you're in London take a look at this: www.quietways.london

A chance to try a decent range of e-bikes free of charge and learn something of the amazing history of our capital city. Did I mention it was free?

 

[Wisper Bikes]

Wisper bikes will be available to try! Come and say hi.

All the best, David