E-bike Costs versus Public Transport - Update

Gubbins

Esteemed Pedelecer
Coincidently, I found the spreadsheet that I use to calculate TCO on my cars. In a pathetic attempt to justify my bike(s) to the wife, I added a section that calculates the saving/mile of using the bike, assuming that you keep the car, leaving it at home on the drive. My figures include tyre wear and servicing cost reductions, but by far the biggest element is fuel cost. I don't include car parking charges, as they rarely affect me.

The results are:

30mpg vehicle = 22p/mile saved
40mpg vehicle = 18p/mile saved
50mpg vehicle = 14p/mile saved

So, in my case (30mpg) I had to complete 2700 miles to justify £600 spend.

Of course by the time I built my 4th bike I'd discovered a simpler way - don't tell 'er and hide it my workshop.
You sound like a brave man! Trying fool her indoors with maths would never work for me as she would smell a rat immediately! But, if they were all the same colour she would be non the wiser. With regard to your justification figures did you factor in car value depreciation?..
I log all my fuel in a phone app and got a new car10 months ago and I have done 4500 miles, spent £680 on fuel and probably lost about £4000 in depreciation..
That would buy a lot of bikes....
 

Alan Quay

Esteemed Pedelecer
Dec 4, 2012
2,351
1,076
Devon
You sound like a brave man! Trying fool her indoors with maths would never work for me as she would smell a rat immediately! But, if they were all the same colour she would be non the wiser. With regard to your justification figures did you factor in car value depreciation?..
I log all my fuel in a phone app and got a new car10 months ago and I have done 4500 miles, spent £680 on fuel and probably lost about £4000 in depreciation..
That would buy a lot of bikes....
I did not bother including it in my e bike figure, because the additional 3000 miles makes no difference in my case. The car will do 25,000 mile a year in my hands, so the odd 1000 a year makes almost no difference to the resale value after 3 years.

Of course, I account for it in my TCO figure. With a modern (new) diesel car the capital loss accounts for 50% of the costs over 3 years.
 

Alan Quay

Esteemed Pedelecer
Dec 4, 2012
2,351
1,076
Devon
Quick message to Trex:

You often complain that people are misquoting you. I'm starting to see why.

My quote in post #16 is a direct quote. You have subsequently edited the post, and changed the content. (post #14 - life expectancy of tyres).

Sorry if that's 'below the belt'.
 

axolotl

Pedelecer
May 8, 2014
150
50
50
Mike - you've inspired me to actually work out the TCO for my old car. Based on an annual mileage of about 6k, it cost 45p a mile to run.

I'm going to keep track of my bike expenses so, hopefully, in a year or so I'll be able to make a meaningful comparison.
 
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Gubbins

Esteemed Pedelecer
Doing a quicky on mine..
New car with 5 year service plan included so rough figures for 5 years based on 4000 miles per year.
fuel £3500
Insurance £2000
Tax £100
Depreciation (40% residual value after 5 years) £12000
Total 17600 / 20000 = £0,88 pre mile!
 

Alan Quay

Esteemed Pedelecer
Dec 4, 2012
2,351
1,076
Devon
Doing a quicky on mine..
New car with 5 year service plan included so rough figures for 5 years based on 4000 miles per year.
fuel £3500
Insurance £2000
Tax £100
Depreciation (40% residual value after 5 years) £12000
Total 17600 / 20000 = £0,88 pre mile!

Ouch! Could you drive it round the block a few times to increase you mileage and save yourself some money?;)

Personally, if I were only doing 4000 miles a year I'd run an older car. In your case, almost 70% of your motoring expense is depreciation.
 

Gubbins

Esteemed Pedelecer
Ouch! Could you drive it round the block a few times to increase you mileage and save yourself some money?;)

Personally, if I were only doing 4000 miles a year I'd run an older car. In your case, almost 70% of your motoring expense is depreciation.
I suppose that's one way of looking at it! I sold a 4 year old car to buy this one which lost £7500 of original £14500, not too bad but perhaps I should kept it and started playing out for repairs and stuff! Or I could have bought a cheaper one..
But, being a techi geeky sort of bloke I rather fancied all the clever stuff that's been stuffed into this one. Also consider that working people spend a lot of time in their cars just commuting,... Now that must be painful!
 

flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
53,213
30,613
Personally, if I were only doing 4000 miles a year I'd run an older car. In your case, almost 70% of your motoring expense is depreciation.
The mistake with Phill's method is the service plan. Any modern car should run for at least 50,000 miles without attention other than oil, so a low mileage car shouldn't cost much to run. Long ago GM in the USA introduced two models with their first service at 100,000 miles.

In my case with different low mileage cars in retirement, all with no servicing at any point:

Fiat, 10.5 years, 14000 miles

Skoda, 5.5 years, 5800 miles

Chevrolet, 5.5 years, 5600 miles

Suzuki, 3.5 years, 4200 miles

The only purpose of manufacturers often ridiculously frequent service intervals is to give their dealers an income. It's a charity I don't donate to.
.
 

Gubbins

Esteemed Pedelecer
The mistake with Phill's method is the service plan. Any modern car should run for at least 50,000 miles without attention other than oil, so a low mileage car shouldn't cost much to run. Long ago GM in the USA introduced two models with their first service at 100,000 miles.

In my case with different low mileage cars in retirement, all with no servicing at any point:

Fiat, 10.5 years, 14000 miles

Skoda, 5.5 years, 5800 miles

Chevrolet, 5.5 years, 5600 miles

Suzuki, 3.5 years, 4200 miles

The only purpose of manufacturers often ridiculously frequent service intervals is to give their dealers an income. It's a charity I don't donate to.
.
You may be righter than you think.... One of the selling point was a free 5 year service plan, so now I am at 10 months the car tells me 400 days to next service.... Rung the dealer thinking it's a mistake and they told me the car decides when it wants servicing dependant on how it is being driven... So my free service plan isn't worth what I thought it was.
 

flecc

Member
Oct 25, 2006
53,213
30,613
I know only too well Phill, I'm a fully qualified motor mechanic. Actually the 50,000 miles I quoted wasn't mine, I know they'll go much further. It was said in my presence by one of Ford GB's senior technical men some 15 years ago, and he meant all makes.

Cars that flash up a service need are a menace, but as long as the customer has a method of cancelling the indication it doesn't matter. My VW group Skoda flashed up annual service need but I was able to cancel it each year using the dashboard clock and odometer controls.
.
 

john h

Esteemed Pedelecer
Nov 22, 2012
510
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murthly castle estate
If i remember rightly FLEC, you hold the two buttons in and turn the igniton key on and off three times to clear it, I to worked on the tools for years and what you said about a car service is correct,( NOT required) i only do repairs to mine as faults come up, most of these things are a way of selling people things that are not needed (ie plugs, oil , oil filters air filters )
 
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Gubbins

Esteemed Pedelecer
If i remember rightly FLEC, you hold the two buttons in and turn the igniton key on and off three times to clear it, I to worked on the tools for years and what you said about a car service is correct,( NOT required) i only do repairs to mine as faults come up, most of these things are a way of selling people things that are not needed (ie plugs, oil , oil filters air filters )
I think things have moved on a bit these days... On mine you just ask it to display service information and there is a reset option in there. Only thing is it doesn't understand my accent for anything but basic commands. Last time I asked it to change to radio 2 it rang my mother. :oops: