Do the cops care about illegal eBikes?

[danielrlee]

I also received plenty of physical discipline at early ages, including hands caned witn a ruler from 5 years old and the cane from about 8 years old, so I appreciate what's behind the logic you express, even though it has no factual basis.

But I believe your concluding sentence is completely wrong, physical discipline is all the more important for minors. The psychology is well understood, the younger we are the more important our sense of self over others. Indeed up to three years old, there is no sense of "other", so appeals on behalf of others interests can have no effect.

That's why all higher order animals physically discipline their young at their very young ages, simply because they don't have the "other" learning capacity they gain later.

As much as we resent the physical discipline when very young, it does work as the crime and prison statistics of half a century ago and now show only too clearly.
.

Before uttering another word, I'd like to acknowledge that this is indeed both a sensitive and emotive subject and I am in no way passing judgement on anyone else by expressing my own views.

Ignoring morality for a moment... Flecc, did you ever receive physical discipline for the same behaviour twice? If so, is it not arguable that it was ineffective as a means of teaching a 'lesson'?

There have been many hundreds, thousands, (millions even) of social changes over the last half-century. Why link the increasing prison population to changes in attitude to hitting children?

 

[Fordulike]

The word 'hit' is maybe a little extreme. It suggests a far more physical action than we are implying here.

Smack, yes.

I, like flecc, got a smack from the teacher, or my Father, if I wasn't playing the game, and I still see the reasoning behind it. Whether it made me a better person, who knows, but the old cliche stands where it never did me any harm.

BTW, I do smack my wife every now and then, but it's usually on the bum in the bedroom and she loves it

 

[flecc]

did you ever receive physical discipline for the same behaviour twice? If so, is it not arguable that it was ineffective as a means of teaching a 'lesson'?

Yes, for one behaviour only, smoking during school hours. But not for many others, crucially including respect for others, so it mainly worked.

There have been many hundreds, thousands, (millions even) of social changes over the last century. Why link the increasing prison population to changes in attitude to hitting children?

I'm linking crime levels, prison populations and poor social behaviour. All the downsides of those are linked to a marked increase in absence of self discipline.

Lawlessness is rife now, and one only has to see this forum to know that. A very high proportion use illegally powered e-bikes, and whether illegally powered or not, even more derestrict for illegal speeds. They boast about it and anyone even mildly mentioning the law gets verbally abused for doing so, all this despite there being very little regulation.

Over half a century ago things were much tougher for powered cycling, one had to register, have number plates, pay tax and have insurance, and toughest of all, a full motorcycle driving licence was necessary. Yet everyone complied, in my time in the trade I saw no law breaking of the sort that's so common now.

Broadly speaking the same range of punishments existed then as now, indeed they are often harsher now. But one element is different, for decades now we've no longer physically punished the young, and the deterioration in public behaviour has paralleled that.
.

 

[danielrlee]

If calling it a 'smack' makes it more palatable for the person handing out the discipline, then that's their prerogative. Once they start introducing weapons to the process, they're just kidding themselves.

 

[danielrlee]

Broadly speaking the same range of punishments existed then as now, indeed they are often harsher now. But one element is different, for decades now we've no longer physically punished the young, and the deterioration in public behaviour has paralleled that.

Today it is largely understood that the majority of sentenced abusers were once abused themselves. You know where I'm going here....

 

[Fordulike]

Thing is, does anybody really know what a suitable punishment for a child is.

Banishment from using an Xbox, Playstation, or iPhone, usually lasts much longer than a smack. Who knows if this type of punishment has a worst psychological effect than a smack, pain gone in 10 minutes scenario.

 

[flecc]

Today it is largely understood that the majority of sentenced abusers were once abused themselves. You know where I'm going here....

I don't believe this widely applies and there's also well based conflicting opinions.

All acceptance of evidence is subject to fashion, and nowhere is this more true than in the subject of physical discipline.

It should always be avoided where possible, but ruling it out completely in all circumstances has been a very serious mistake which we are paying for dearly in a very large number of ways.

ADHD, Anorexia nervosa, Bulimia and many other such psychological conditions including M.E. were unheard of long ago, simply because at the first signs of them they were immediately dealt with effectively in ways that can no longer happen.
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[Fordulike]

I think we've gone way off the thread's topic here, which isn't fair on the OP. Mostly my fault, sorry Alan.

If someone wants to open up another thread, then that's great, but I'm nipping my contributions in the bud

 

[danielrlee]

I think we've gone way off the threads topic here, which isn't fair on the OP. Mostly my fault, sorry Alan.

If someone wants to open up another thread, then that's great, but I'm nipping my contributions in the bud

Yep, my bad.

 

[flecc]

Yep, my bad.

Me too.
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[anotherkiwi]

Doing my bit, back on topic ladies and gents!

I ride in a country which until 5 years ago was subject to "political" violence. So there is now a large police force made up of mostly young and bored cops looking for something to do. This is why all the bits I put on my bike have the right markings (no cheap illegal Chinese lights for example). My cut off speed is set to 25 km/h etc. etc.

The bike has been inspected casually a couple of times so I do everything possible to make it squeaky clean and law abiding just in case. I have no spare money to invest in eventual fines and no other means of transport should it be confiscated.

 

[flecc]

I ride in a country which until 5 years ago was subject to "political" violence. So there is now a large police force made up of mostly young and bored cops looking for something to do. This is why all the bits I put on my bike have the right markings (no cheap illegal Chinese lights for example). My cut off speed is set to 25 km/h etc. etc.

Move to the UK and pedelecing means anything goes now. As many watts as you like, throttles, 45 kph assist or more, and spare parts whether approved or not. No authority will bother you.
,

 

[anotherkiwi]

You have other issues, like climate, expensive food and wine...

 

[flecc]

You have other issues, like climate, expensive food and wine...

Politely not mentioning astronomic housing costs!
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[Renax]

expensive food and wine...

Where? UK? My buddy just came back and he couldn't believe how cheap it was, only 3-4£ for a beer, thats a bargain!

 

[soundwave]

weed is £10 a gram tho

 

[Renax]

weed is £10 a gram tho

cheaper than a pack of cigarettes... thats a good deal

 

[flecc]

Where? UK? My buddy just came back and he couldn't believe how cheap it was, only 3-4£ for a beer, thats a bargain!

But if unemployed you can receive up to 87.6% of your previous salaries for 500 days.

Here it's £72.40 a week which doesn't leave much for beer after struggling to live.
.

 

[Renax]

But if unemployed you can receive up to 87.6% of your previous salaries for 500 days.

Here it's £72.40 a week which doesn't leave much for beer after struggling to live.
.

I belive its 75% and limited to about 35000£ a year. But its a good deal for some.
For 72£ a week I couldn't even pay half my rent...

 

[soundwave]

rent is paid by benefit 72 is what you get to live on. max i could get is 100 quid a week for rent.