Death of the derailleur?

[flecc]

It'll be interesting to see how they integrate it with a motor, which will require the addition of the motor, primary reduction system, electronics and sensors.

Hopefully they won't bother, I don't see the point of any bicycle gear systems with crank motors in pedelecs. Though the rider needs a range of gears to cope with all terrain at healthy cadences, the motor only needs two at most to cope with the pedelec's range of legal assist speeds. Any more gears are wasted and only tend to interrupt the assistance continuity.

In a utility bike this Shimano gearbox combined with a Xionda two speed rear hub motor with either a decent chaincase or clean toothed belt drive should cope with all needs. Not much demand here with our sport biased cycling attitudes, but probably very attractive where the majority of cycling is utility in nature and hub gears are popular.
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[Fishy]

The old Sturmy Archer 3 speed would do well these days with pedelec assistance.
Not everyone needs massive gear selection.

Interesting you should say that, I was considering using one of the original Sturmy Archer 3 speed hubs with a Bafang mid motor, but not sure if it would be strong enough?
Has anybody done this? Or have any thoughts on the matter?

 

[vfr400]

Interesting you should say that, I was considering using one of the original Sturmy Archer 3 speed hubs with a Bafang mid motor, but not sure if it would be strong enough?
Has anybody done this? Or have any thoughts on the matter?

Those SA gearboxes require you to stop pedalling to change gear. Derailleur would be better.

 

[Fishy]

Those SA gearboxes require you to stop pedalling to change gear. Derailleur would be better.

I'm aware of that, what I'd like to know is whether it would be up to task.

 

[wheeliepete]

Sturmy Archer 3 speed hubs with a Bafang mid motor,

I've run both BBS02 and HD through a modern 3 speed SA hub. Not clocked up crazy mileage, but no failures. Ok on the road, not really enough range for slow off road use, but fine on fast trails. Got a build on the go using the SA RX-RK5 5 speed hub at the mo for a better range of gears. AS VFR says, you do have to stop pedalling to change down, but I'm never in that much of a hurry.

 

[Fishy]

I've run both BBS02 and HD through a modern 3 speed SA hub. Not clocked up crazy mileage, but no failures. Ok on the road, not really enough range for slow off road use, but fine on fast trails. Got a build on the go using the SA RX-RK5 5 speed hub at the mo for a better range of gears. AS VFR says, you do have to stop pedalling to change down, but I'm never in that much of a hurry.

Sounds good, it would only be for on road commuting, and like you, I'm not in such a rush that I can't stop pedaling for a second.

 

[vfr400]

It's not about going fast or slow. It's about stalling when you go up a steep hill.

 

[Fishy]

Firstly, I have no steep hills on my commute,
Secondly, it only takes a second to change gear, how slow would you have to be going to stall in a second?
Thirdly, if you've got any sense, you'd change down before a hill.

 

[flecc]

It's not about going fast or slow. It's about stalling when you go up a steep hill.

This always amuses me. Just as derailler riders plan ahead by changing down before coming to a halt, so experienced hubgear riders plan ahead for hills by being in the right gear before hitting them if travelling slowly.

But if riding quite fast, gear changes can still be after arriving at a hill.

For utility cycling in urban areas I prefer a hub gear and chain protection for its cleanliness alone when used with street clothing and none of the special dressing to ride so common in this country.
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[vfr400]

Firstly, I have no steep hills on my commute,
Secondly, it only takes a second to change gear, how slow would you have to be going to stall in a second?
Thirdly, if you've got any sense, you'd change down before a hill.

But some people do have steep hills. Don't be so self-centred.
It's nice to spout theory, but when you try it up a steep hill in a real situation, you'll see the problem.

 

[Fishy]

But some people do have steep hills. Don't be so self-centred.
It's nice to spout theory, but when you try it up a steep hill in a real situation, you'll see the problem.

Self-centred? I'm thinking of building a bike for ME, of course it's going to suit my needs. I'm not saying it will right for everyone.

 

[awol]

An MTB'er has good things to say about this gearbox bike but listening to it in a video it sounded like there was some resistance sound when pedalling.
Also isn't it going to be considerably heavier than the deraileur method?

https://www.deviatecycles.com/guide/

 

[flecc]

An MTB'er has good things to say about this gearbox bike but listening to it in a video it sounded like there was some resistance sound when pedalling.
Also isn't it going to be considerably heavier than the deraileur method?

https://www.deviatecycles.com/guide/

Indeed, nothing will ever beat a derailleur for efficiency with light weight. But for many there's more aspects to cycling than those considerations.
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[vfr400]

Self-centred? I'm thinking of building a bike for ME, of course it's going to suit my needs. I'm not saying it will right for everyone.

You can put all your theory to test then. When you've done it, come back and tell us how well it worked.

We pioneers have to risk our money for the good of everyone. My ebike testing and experimentation bill is now standing somewhere around £22,000, so about time others shared the burden.

 

[Fishy]

You can put all your theory to test then. When you've done it, come back and tell us how well it worked.

We pioneers have to risk our money for the good of everyone. My ebike testing and experimentation bill is now standing somewhere around £22,000, so about time others shared the burden.

What on earth are you talking about? I merely asked a question as to whether a certain set up (which would suit my personal needs), would work.

 

[vfr400]

What on earth are you talking about? I merely asked a question as to whether a certain set up (which would suit my personal needs), would work.

Yes, but when I gave you an answer, you didn't like it, and you argued against it. It sounds like you've got a better technique than me and easier rides, and there were no other negative points in the replies, so try it and see if you're right.

 

[Fishy]

Yes, but when I gave you an answer, you didn't like it, and you argued against it. It sounds like you've got a better technique than me and easier rides, and there were no other negative points in the replies, so try it and see if you're right.

You didn't give me an answer to my question at all, you pointed out you have to stop pedaling to change gear, which I knew, then said a derailleur would be better, (with no knowledge of the terrain I would be using it on).
Had I wanted to use a derailleur, I wouldn't have asked my original question.

 

[Jimo]

I built my only bike some 65 years ago when Sturmey Archer was King, apart from the occasional pain in the balls when it slipped on a hill, derailer systems scared me to death in case of perceived breakdown, I now have the latter system on my Batribike Quartz which I’m not fit enough to use yet with my chronic heart failure, when I use it I hope all will be ok and without problems.

Jim

 

[vfr400]

You didn't give me an answer to my question at all, you pointed out you have to stop pedaling to change gear, which I knew, then said a derailleur would be better, (with no knowledge of the terrain I would be using it on).
Had I wanted to use a derailleur, I wouldn't have asked my original question.

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[Templogin]

On my favourite leg powered bike I have a Rohloff hub with a fully enclosed chain. The hub requires a yearly oil change. No need to even remove the wheel. The chain line is always straight so less chain and sprocket wear. The rear sprocket can be reversed. Try doing that with a cassette. Choose what suits you best, but I like the quick gear change of hub gears for those unexpected stops or the hill that is steeper than it first appeared.