Cycle Road Rage - Camera Evidence!

just been made aware of this!

Police release footage from road-rage assault on cyclist | Latest News | Cycling Weekly

I suspect electric bikers are more prone to outbreaks of rage than the manuals so members BE CAREFUL on the roads. Dont go out there naked. Protect yourselves!

I'm often a bit critical of such camera evidence which can be misleading, but this is clearly a blatant case of the worst form of car driver road rage. This driver isn't just a menace to cyclists, he is a menace on the road.

Its strange how a vehicle, any vehicle, can bring out this sort of behaviour in people who wouldn't dream of acting this way when walking amongst others.

I don't think it too extreme to advocate a loss of driving licence for a very substantial period for these offences. After all, in the worst case, Kenneth Noye who has just lost a further appeal, stabbed to death the person he raged at, showing just how dangerous such people can become.

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I'm considering getting one soon for a few reasons, one was witnessing an accident yesterday where a van turned left into a petrol station and took a cyclist with him. If that had resulted in more than an adrenaline rush then I may have been asked to be a witness, my problem would be that I wasn't paying attention immediately before and it could have been 50/50 the cyclists fault.

Another time recently I got in an argument with a driver about me not slowing down to allow him to turn left, afterwards I wasn't 100% about the events immediately preceding the incident so it would have been nice to review it and see if I did make a mistake.

More often recently I've had people overtaking me and making an immediate left turn so I can see a real need for evidence soon.

Terrible..must of been quite frightening experience for the cyclist.. You do find that some motorists with attitudes like that seem to think they own the road and have some kind of priority over cyclists. I had one experience myself recently with an impatient motorist who sounded his horn at me hard to get out of the way, and mouthed off inside his car but i couldn't hear him and just ignored him. I sometimes get the odd annoying boy racer person who hasn't quite grown up yet speeding and purposely zooming a few inches away from me which is incredibly dangerous and stupid..but on the whole I find most motorists courteous, always leaving me space and letting me go first. Likewise I'm the same to them, trying not to hold them up and keeping close to the curb as I can and signalling them to over take etc. It's always a few who can't show consideration who spoil it for the rest and as flecc said they shouldn't be on the road if they can't behave like adults.

I will just say also, since I started wearing my high vis jacket and my visible camera on the shoulder, I feel a lot safer and I've noticed drivers seem to be a lot more cautious around me.. whether it's just the visible jacket or the fact they are being filmed, not sure..

Edited April 15, 201115 yr by morphix

I suspect that you know this already but Morphix and I are experimenting as I'm sure others have done in the past .. and will continue to in the future ... I have put in a request to Russ to create a review sub-forum like we have for ELectric Bikes .. I'm working on a template and would appreciate any input to make sure I get it right! ... I think I have probably put too much in it!

I'll create a new thread so it can be reviewed and refined and then we can try to get Russ to publish it!

I suspect that you know this already but Morphix and I are experimenting as I'm sure others have done in the past .. and will continue to in the future ... I have put in a request to Russ to create a review sub-forum like we have for ELectric Bikes .. I'm working on a template and would appreciate any input to make sure I get it right! ... I think I have probably put too much in it!

I'll create a new thread so it can be reviewed and refined and then we can try to get Russ to publish it!

I noticed your good work Alan with the template and left a comment on the camera shake solution thread.. not sure if you saw it yet.. I think it will be great to have a separate camera sub-forum, cuz like yourself I'm really into the cameras and enjoy filming my rides.. As you said before, there's a big safety benefit to having the camera rolling on the road but it's also great to see other peoples videos.

... trying not to hold them up and keeping close to the curb as I can and signalling them to over take etc. I

Be careful doing this. I did exactly this in a quiet country lane and I ended up in the hedge! ...and on another ocassion I pick up a puncture! (the nearer the curb the more likely to find screws, nails and other sharp objects .. not sure what the highway code says but I suspect that we should be cycling a consistant distance from the curb. 1m or 1.5 m ? something like that? ... Now, if I am going to let a vehicle pass me I will give them the bird arm to show that I am slowing down and stopping. Look at the vehicle behind and ensure that it can pass. If not, then I will get off the bike and move out the way. Next time this happens hopefully it will be captured on video and I can show you how its done! ...

Be careful doing this. I did exactly this in a quiet country lane and I ended up in the hedge! ...and on another ocassion I pick up a puncture! (the nearer the curb the more likely to find screws, nails and other sharp objects .. not sure what the highway code says but I suspect that we should be cycling a consistant distance from the curb. 1m or 1.5 m ? something like that? ... Now, if I am going to let a vehicle pass me I will give them the bird arm to show that I am slowing down and stopping. Look at the vehicle behind and ensure that it can pass. If not, then I will get off the bike and move out the way. Next time this happens hopefully it will be captured on video and I can show you how its done! ...

You're right, the cycling lanes marked on the roads I find are the worse part of the road on many stretches and badly in need of repair..loose bits of tarmac all over the place, pot holes and broken glass plentiful :-/ What I normally do is stay about 1 meter away from curb but if I sense a car is behind me or approaching I will go in closer to let it past if theres no way to overtake, then come back out again after checking behind me of course.. I really should get a mirror I think.

Look at the vehicle behind and ensure that it can pass. If not, then I will get off the bike and move out the way.

I'm not sure if my mental image of that is right, I can't imagine getting off my bike to allow a car to overtake.

 

.. not sure what the highway code says but I suspect that we should be cycling a consistant distance from the curb. 1m or 1.5 m ? something like that? ...

I don't think the highway code gives any guidance on this. Mr Grumpy's cycling site has a lot to say in this connection:

Car drivers overtaking cyclists

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It is a good I wasn`t the bike rider because that driver would have been laying on the floor waiting for the police to arrive.

I am not one to start a ruck but I am well capable of finishing one. I don`t mind being abused verbally if I am on a bike, motorbike or in the car. I just ignore it.

But if someone squeezed me and the bike up against a rail and then got out and got hold of me it would be no more Mr Nice Guy I am afraid.

Steve

As much as it pains me to say so, it is nearly always better to back off in these situations. Put your brakes on and let the car past, try to pull out of the way, anything to avoid potential contact with the car.

As for remonstrating with the driver, again my approach is to avoid it.

I realise that we should not have to do this, but unfortunately, as we know, there are quite a few maniacs out there and their numbers are growing. The chances are, you will come across one of them someday and you simply don't know what they are going to arm themselves with. If they arm themselves with a foul mouth or fists you might be able to get the better of them. If they arm with a wheel brace, iron bar or knife, you are going to look a bit second hand by the time they have finished with you and in my view it isn't worth the risk.

It takes a lot of effort for me to resist saying or doing something if a car driver puts me in danger, but the annoyance factor soon subsides and by the time I arrive home, in one piece, I have usually forgotten all about it.

As for that worthless bullying lump of lard driving the BMW. If he is caught, he needs hurting and hurting badly. People like him only understand pain and violence. He needs to experience a violent episode that will mentally scare him for the rest of his life. Only then will he think about the effect of his actions on innocent and undeserving people. Not a very attractive solution, but I'm afraid that's where we are.

Wow. That's quite a reaction from the chap in BMW. Like flecc I'm skeptical and not sure the clip shows the full story. I could be wrong but from what little footage there is, the rider looks to be very far out from the curb for no obvious reason, that is certain to annoy any car driver.

Whatever the circumstances there was no excuse for forcing the cyclist over to the curb like that.

Or for the face to face confrontation. That's threatening behaviour, rightly an offence in law. There's no place for bullies and thugs in a civilised society.

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Indeed. Road rage is a flattering and nonsensical term. This thug has issues and shouldn't be driving around in a powerful car. His response is abnormal.

If caught he should be condemned to public transport.

Worryingly I'm sure there is a vitriolic anti cycling mentality about on the road. Much of it is based on ignorance - as in: law breaking, non tax paying, no insurance, idiot, tree hugging, lemmings - just a few of the accusations and sweeping generalisations I've come across..

Edited April 15, 201115 yr by Barnowl

Or for the face to face confrontation. That's threatening behaviour, rightly an offence in law. There's no place for bullies and thugs in a civilised society.

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Quite correct and it's also within the law to defend yourself when threatened, I'm afraid a driver getting that close to me would have ended up with a broken nose before he had got any more abusive words out of his stupid mouth !

It seems to me that riding with a camera attached isn't really the answer to the problem. There isn't much point if, as in this case, the police are seeking assistance in tracking down the car driver.

Although there has been at least one successful prosecution recently based on video footage, I suspect there will be many other occasions where the police or CPS may determine that the video footage obtained is evidentially insufficient to justify prosecution. An assailant might very well remove and/or destroy a camera anyway....especially if one tells the other party he is being filmed!

The camera can hardly be objective as it only reveals some of the story so I'd expect challenges from defence lawyers if their use in such a manner proliferates.

Confrontation with a cretin like the one shown in the clip could be quite enjoyable if you're confident in your own ability to knock the sh.....sorry,...to defend yourself! Unfortunately, there are those like Kenneth Noye who aren't very good with their fists so they will just stab you.

The answer? I really don't know but I shan't be attaching a camera to my bike or my person. I guess I'll just have to take my chances in the same way as I do by not wearing a helmet.

Indalo

Hi

With today High pressure society It is very hard to say what that driver was thinking he may be just about to have his a braking point and house reposes or caught his wife with another man

As human beings we all have a breaking point

It is possible the cyclist was just in the way and he snapped

This why we have courts

The main thing is the cyclist was OK Better to face a mouth full off abuse than have a outraged car try and run you off the road

Personally when driving a car I treat cyclists and motor cyclist and pedestrians As Very vulnerable they are not in a metal protection box

Give way Give them room I will follow a cyclist not overtaking till i can give him / her at least 2 bike wide gap between him and my car

Thinking that could be me or my wife or kid

As for horses slow down to a crawl stop in you need to they have been on our road long before the motor car

Now speed limits a 30 MPH road marker means 30 MPH maximum

NOT 30MPH +++

so in normal roads in town 25 MPH

so if a kid or dog / cat runs out I stand a chance of stopping

and if I hit them they will survive

I am a 61 year old FART but I sleep at night

Frank

It seems to me that riding with a camera attached isn't really the answer to the problem. There isn't much point if, as in this case, the police are seeking assistance in tracking down the car driver.

 

Although there has been at least one successful prosecution recently based on video footage, I suspect there will be many other occasions where the police or CPS may determine that the video footage obtained is evidentially insufficient to justify prosecution. An assailant might very well remove and/or destroy a camera anyway....especially if one tells the other party he is being filmed!

 

The camera can hardly be objective as it only reveals some of the story so I'd expect challenges from defence lawyers if their use in such a manner proliferates.

 

Confrontation with a cretin like the one shown in the clip could be quite enjoyable if you're confident in your own ability to knock the sh.....sorry,...to defend yourself! Unfortunately, there are those like Kenneth Noye who aren't very good with their fists so they will just stab you.

 

The answer? I really don't know but I shan't be attaching a camera to my bike or my person. I guess I'll just have to take my chances in the same way as I do by not wearing a helmet.

 

Indalo

I think some cameras can be quite discrete and not easy to spot on a bike, especially very small ones you can get now.

As for the criminal evidence side of things..I think cameras increasingly have a role to play and as they are now HD-capable and very clear, it's easy to recognise a persons face, any weapons they might have, and car number plates etc.. As long as the video is clear, it could be used to charge a person or presented as evidence in court to secure a conviction.

The only problem is with filming at night or in low-light conditions, like this video in question, where a lot of cameras don't perform too well and become very pixelated.. but I'm sure you can find some cameras that do night filming...my Vado HD is very good in low light conditions, unusually good.

It's also probably helpful if the video has a time and date stamp imprinted in the video for evidence purposes..

 

 

Give way Give them room I will follow a cyclist not overtaking till i can give him / her at least 2 bike wide gap between him and my car

 

Quite right Frank, my Grandfather, a cyclist all his life advised me to "always give a cyclist lying down room when passing".

 

 

Now speed limits a 30 MPH road marker means 30 MPH maximum

 

NOT 30MPH +++

 

The thing with all speed limits is that they are just that - a limit not a target

A little advice for a newbie please

OK...............how do you get the original quote to appear in a shaded box?

OK...............how do you get the original quote to appear in a shaded box?

I think you just hit the quote button at the bottom right of the post you want to quote and then you can play around within the square bracket endpiece thingies (can you tell I'm not a techie?)

Edit - yup, that worked

Edited April 16, 201115 yr by lectureral