CST - it's all working

[103Alex1]

... and the finished cruise control - shrinkwrap hides the joins (I removed the pins from the main throttle connector and fed all 3 cables through it i.e. 2 throttles and the switch, before joining them together, so it was in place to slide down and cover when done). Then re-fitted the pins in the connector after I'd tested it all worked :

Have to say a huge thanks again to d8veh for sending me a 2nd throttle with the spring removed for the cruise throttle ... and for sharing the know-how to do this (but mostly for putting up with my endless questions getting my head round the wiring up behind the scenes... must get very tiresome - but we got there in the end .

Can't believe it's actually made - now I just need to get that brake switch sorted out, a tyre on the wheel, cassette on the motor, connector on the Hall Sensor, grips off to fit the cruise/throttle array - and should be good for a test ride. It's getting closer .

The set-backs this afternoon are a distant memory. So good to see these things I've been planning and thinking about for so many weeks finally coming together. Going to bed happy tonight.

 

[Electrifying Cycles]

Nothing worth having comes easily. I am sure your patience will be rewarded. Looking forward to hear about your first test ride on the completed bike!

 

[Geebee]

The huge plus of learning to DIY this kind of job is the ability to be able to maintain and modify to suit in the future, or limp home with a quick fix.

I went to a Cycling event on the weekend with about 150~200 bikes of which 5 were electric, none of the other riders of e-bike had a clue about their how the bikes operated or what the specifications even meant.

 

[103Alex1]

What a day ..... d8veh must be absolutely wrecked . We worked from about 11am to 7.30pm straight with about a half hour off for tea and lunch today, but such a great result.

After the distasters and set-backs of brake switches and broken motor leads, it's all now working again.

The repair held absolutely solid, all the tests showed OK and the rotor went back on fine too. Reassembling proved a bit of a challenge - with all the photographing and bringing bits back & forth inside for repair etc. I'd got the washers and a couple of the other parts muddled and it was a bit of a chinese puzzle to figure it all out.

Thankfully d8veh's experience came into play and after about an hour and a half we'd cracked it - there was only one way things could logically go. But a schematic would have been a real help it has to be said. If you ever disassemble one of these, lay out all the bits and take a clear photo. It'll save a load of head-scratching down the line !

Had a go at soldering on the LM35 but the pins gave out and wouldn't take being bent into the PCB slots. So we ditched that one. Just wasn't worth it for what I'd get out of it and everything we were trying to achieve in a day.

I stupidly forgot to photograph the reassembly - too busy watching the master at work lol.

Quick break for lunch and finished off the assembly back into the wheel - having had it open, sealed the cover plate screws and formed a gasket on the cassette side for added protection. Connected up with bike upturned and a quick test showed everything working - including my brake cutoff - a VERY happy moment.

My grips arrived right on cue in the post so got the handlebars assembled and spent a good couple more hours making further mods to the torque arm with angle grinder and carbide drill bits, sorting the bolts, adjusting the rack etc. and rigged up the battery, controller and wiring in my Topeak rack bag for testing.

Cable ties to tidy up and secure. Then moment of real truth - 1st ever test rides. Thought d8veh should have the first go . We decided the tyre wasn't seated properly in the rim so fitted a new Marathon Plus MTB tyre which also arrived in the post today. Much better.

It was dusk by the time we got the final rides in, so popped on some temporary lights for safety and took it for a proper ride round the block. Oh my god... is all ... what a machine . All the trials and setbacks melted away in relief and happiness as the bike shot up the hill round the corner effortlessly - all by itself ! We moved the front gearing onto the outermost chainring and I clipped in and gave it some wellie up the hill on full throttle.

Well, all I can say is I was totally blown away and I'm overwhelmed with gratitude to d8veh for coming down and getting me up and running today. It's been a real long road to get here but I'm SO glad I didn't pull the plug on this. The bike is simply awesome. To be handled responsibly ... and with care !!!

So the first incarnation is complete and the bike is usable. I thought the day would never come. Not defeated, d8veh decided to show me how to wire in the battery isolator on/off switch which will transfer to my box, which is the next stage to complete the build.

The box build will permanently install the battery and all the associated electrics for additional circuits :

- in-built lighting with 2-CREE day/town running circuit, on/off/brightness operation controlled from the lights.
- separate handlebar control switch for lower bracket mounted high-power night off-roading spots with separately wireable horn button (momentary switch) to operate horn if installed
- 12V charging socket - fully waterproof and marine grade compatible with phone charger case and any other 12V accessories which would plug into a socket like this in a car or motorbike
- battery charger socket for on-bike charging
- master on/off control FET switch to isolate all circuits from battery
- any other externally mounted push / toggle switches
- after much deliberation, most likely Cycle Analyst rather than Speedict now we've discussed how I'd mount it in addition to my phone on the bike

Barring a few fuses / fuse holders, getting some mudguards modded to fit, popping a kickstand on (d8veh's showed me how to get something to works on that bike frame) I have just about everything needed in now.

Just got to then tidy up the connectors and work out how to fit it all in / best arrange things in the box which will have to be something designed as it's constructed. No matter what's put on paper when you come to do this it'll only make sense looks and arrangement-wise when I build the thing. But ..... it's do'able. If I drop anything it'll likely be the horn. Idea was more to make use of a switch button option than for its likely use, but it does add weight and it's all a trade-off.

There's quite a bit to do - but I've so much clearer picture of what and how now. Would have taken me weeks to muddle through those thought processes on forum posts and trial / error. One day with d8veh and I feel I'm almost there on the planning and procurement. An incredible result. There'll be a few more questions but the forum's probably been saved oceans of tedious complete novice Q&A !

We went out for a curry and a chinwag to refuel and poor d8veh finally got on the road home at gone 11.30pm. Top bloke - really great to meet him and learned an unbelievable amount. Worth .... weight ... gold .... !!

 

[103Alex1]

A few pics of where we are :

- My big 600denier nylon Topeak bag off the Agattu is compatible with the rack I got for this bike (it has the same MTX slider) so tipped it out and put the battery, controller and cabling into this.

As you can see from the photo above it's really a bag for a big Dutch bike rather than a sporty MTB... but the bag still has lots of room for essentials on top of the 20Ah battery and KU123 controller

The battery isolator push-button switch ready for the box - means I don't have to disconnect the battery even in the bag :

The switch is an IP65 switch from Maplins - and silweld has been used to protect the terminals from accidental shorting.

Handlebars have new Ergon GP-1 comfort grips for longer rides .. and on the left, the cruise/speed control to regular throttle switch, springless throttle (constant speed throttle). The light's temporary - there'll be 2 x CREE day-running lights on the T-bar to the right when built in. On the right, the regular throttle - and the Trail Tech Horn/Hi-Low light switch will be added when lights arrive and bracket made. There's space - it's a really neat fitting switch with a great slider.

There's just room to get it all in around those XT combination shifter/brake levers (!) and still have them in the right position and unrestricted for up/down shifting.

Step by step, it's all shaping up great now. Happiness.

 

[shemozzle999]

Glad to see you are back up and running Alex and +1 for d8veh vote for new ebike Pope

 

[Deleted member 4366]

This is the stand that I'd recommend, but they also do an aluminium coloured one (not listed at the moment. Maybe someone knows where to get one from), which would look nicer on your bike:
MTB Road Bike Mountain Bicycle Replacement Side Kick Stand Alloy Kickstand Black | eBay

These are the mudguards that Saneagle and myself use:
Buy SKS Beavertail 26 Inch/700c Mudguard Set at Tredz Bikes. £11.84 with free UK delivery

Here's how to fit the front one if you don't have the thread on your fork crown. It's very secure like this:

 

[Old_Dave]

+ 1 on that triangle fitting stand recommendation

 

[johnc461165]

Great news Alec well done you stuck at it and succeeded

 

[Scimitar]

+ 1 on that triangle fitting stand recommendation

They snap eventually.

 

[103Alex1]

Thanks a lot for those links. I'll get the mudguards in and give the kickstand a try. Couldn't track down a silver one so I'll give the black a try instead. At least it'll fit - must be one of the only ones which will on those frames.

Proper test ride today - 7 miles flattish with some hills, very generous use of power. Didn't even make a dent in the battery - still showing virtually full when I plugged the charger in.

I am totally blown away now. Popped it on the bathroom scales now the rack and gubbins are on - 25.4kg. Did the same with the Agattu. By co-incidence was exactly the same. Probably 50-75% more performance and similar useable battery miles compared to Impulse power mode (I predict maybe a tad less if you were very heavy on the throttle). And so far even with power cable replacement, hydraulic cutoff switch, major cost run-ons, new tyres, grips, store full of bike tools and bits set up from scratch and a load of fancy accessories and in-built power options a good £1,000 less outlay. Cash availability issues set to one side to look at it objectively, that's incredible really. . Obviously time costs haven't been factored in. That's where if you enjoy doing the build, have the time, are not in a desperate hurry and can turn that all into a recreation rather than a chore it all makes so much sense.

None of this would have been possible without major help from Pedelecs members and unwavering guidance from d8veh on choice of everything to do with the bike build kit bits. Made a few mistakes on my own bits and bought some unsuitable stuff experimenting but that's to be expected - and I now have much more experience about what to get / use and what not to bother with.

I am genuinely reeling with shock today. Happily. The system is in practice so much better than I ever expected 'on paper' and from reading threads. As I expected, a hub-drive bike like this with throttle control is a totally different beast to a crank drive. Apples & oranges. Both in their own very different ways are amazing things. If you possibly can, don't choose one over the other. Have both ! For long distance rides which would be a real challenge on the Kalkhoff, the CST now wins hands down. The bike it's on isn't as stately or comfortable - it's a sporty MTB - but the performance is incomparable and for fun rather than utility (with fancy LCDs etc), in mixed terrain, it's a clear winner for me.

They snap eventually.

Even if it only lasts a few months that's OK - it's better than nothing and at £8 let's be honest, it's the cost of a tube of auto sealant. Broke the clip on my mobile tough case - even that as a top of the range accessory didn't last more than 3 1/2 months with me rolleyes. I've learned not to expect too much from bike accessories .

 

[Old_Dave]

And now you have nothing to use your new skills on and while away the small hours..

Its build number 2 then

 

[103Alex1]

And now you have nothing to use your new skills on and while away the small hours..

Its build number 2 then

It'll be a while yet before I get it all built into the triangle, wire up all the circuits, get brackets made / modified for lights etc.... that'll be at least a couple of weeks. It's a fiddly job making a custom box like that and will probably take me 2-3 attempts I'd say to get it right and see what'll actually work. But I'm a lot more used to working with wood than wires and metal so it won't be quite such a learning curve on the new skills front.

Decided to use silver Glosstex from Solarfilm to cover it, so plenty to keep me occupied in the wee small hours for a while yet .. the important thing is the bike can now be used whilst I'm doing this and isn't a white elephant sat in the garage. And I'm not making finishing touches for a bike with a broken motor !

 

[Scimitar]

Even if it only lasts a few months that's OK - it's better than nothing and at £8 let's be honest, it's the cost of a tube of auto sealant. Broke the clip on my mobile tough case - even that as a top of the range accessory didn't last more than 3 1/2 months with me rolleyes. I've learned not to expect too much from bike accessories .

I liked the design of it, but the let-down was the body of the swivel was made of cheap alloy which couldn't withstand much away from near-vertical without bending then breaking. However, I'm inclined to copy it in steel, or simply get a decent centre stand.

 

[103Alex1]

Probably down to the material used (as usual). It's a weight thing too I guess. Problem with centre stands is that they don't work well with many MTB frames or wider tyres. Not enough clearance between the tyres and the stays.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

I have mine for 2 1/2 years, given it loads of abuse and it hasn't broken yet. it's been on three different bikes so far.

 

[Scimitar]

I have mine for 2 1/2 years, given it loads of abuse and it hasn't broken yet. it's been on three different bikes so far.

I suspect you got a decent one, then.
The ones on ebay now are just cack, and you can't tell from the pics what the quality is like.

 

[103Alex1]

Well, front brakes were sounding well dodgy during the test rides and d8veh said they felt like pads needed replacing. I had the rear ones out when fitting the brake cutoff and they looked fine :

Guy who sold me the bike said the brake pads had been replaced by his LBS not an excessive number of miles before sale so didn't bother checking the front ones. When the front pads came out they were NOT fine

I've put in a new pair of pads and also cleaned a load of muck off both discs with brake disc cleaner. Easy job but the results are really good. The front ones will need to wear in a bit but I feel a lot safer on the bike now.

It's good to be able to start doing things like this myself without it seeming like a huge obstacle and all the inconvenience of having to put the bike in to a shop for work. Unless it's something major or especially unusual you often lose as much time delivering and collecting it as you do just getting on with it and doing the job yourself. Also get to clean out all the calipers properly and really look after the bike - something which I know doesn't always happen when it goes on a conveyor belt of work in a shop.

Matching Marathon + MTB tyre on the front race rim now too - and I've stopped breaking Presta valves getting inner tubes out. Way harder then the rear eBike rim. Incredibly tight fit on that tubeless-ready rim - was drenched by the time I got it on and hands seized up ! Over half an hour to get that new tyre on last night versus about 5 minutes to get a Marathon + Tour on the Agattu now I've got a bit more practice under my belt.

 

[Scimitar]

Somehow, the spirit of dodgy car workshops lives on in some LBSs.

 

[103Alex1]

Finally worked out how to easily mount my lights and made a decision on what's going on the bike.

One big light - 27W for night trails and high-beam :

Really good quality this light – just had to adapt the fixings. Was very pleased.

It's fixed to a modified Rixen-Kaul handlebar bag mount with extra wide brackets that I had from a previous bag that I sent back and got left with the mount. I took the click-fix attachment out and drilled a bolt hole through the front to take the light bracket. Then swapped the light stock nuts for locking nuts courtesy of my local (well, 'ish') "nuts & bolts" heroes 'Balls Grinding'.

It’s absolutely rock solid and the handlebar mount is further reinforced by nylon under tension.
2 smaller lights on a T-bar extension dropped vertically down below the handlebars. One is the 3-LED 5W light here :

http://www.pedelecs.co.uk/forum/electric-bicycles/13628-new-light-runs-direct-battery.html
The other is a single CREE. All 3 lights will be run off a single 3-position handlebar switch that I got from Trail Tech :

http://www.trailtech.net/040-HBS-02.html

Bit of an indulgence but you can’t have a 27W light that you can instantly kill when you need to. The switch will slot in just inside the shifter levers on the right hand side. This switch will also run a horn off separate wiring if I want to rig it up at the back. There’s a momentary switch that you simply press on the top of it. The 2 little ones will come on if I put the switch into position 1. The monster will come on in addition in position 2.

Now at least the combine harversters will see me coming and won’t mow me down... and if ET touches down in the nearby field I'll be able to communicate effectively !

Thanks a bunch to d8veh for drawing out loads of variants to show me how you can wire stuff up and the options for where you put the DC-DC converters.

Thanks also to Scimitar for linking the big one. When it arrived on Wednesday I didn’t know where to start mounting it securely but quickly worked out an easy solution adapting the handlebar bag mount with the help of a surfer dude in LBS when I took the bike and lights up there. I knew he’d understand ! They got a sale of the extra wide handlebar pins for the mount I had so I didn’t feel quite so bad st the £2.50 sale (!) – and he did have lots of fun checking out the bike.

Might insert an inline socket plug with a spring cover for weatherproofing between light and supply, just so I can take the big one off if I'm not going to be using it at night for a while. It takes no longer to refit to the bracket than strapping on a bunch of headlights and battery packs for a night ride - and definitely won't need anything more with that, just an emergency torch in case of supply failure (which you'd take anyway).

I had to buy 2 of the big lights (both would be overkill and out of proportion on a bicycle – even for me !) so if anyone wants one let me know. They’d be at cost – about $63 with shipping if I remember right so half that and a collect+ drop (£4 I think).

Lightmeister d8veh can have with my compliments and eternal gratitude if he wants it ! Let me know else I'll sell it on.

Now at least I can finalize my wiring plan and integrate the lighting into my triangle box. It’s been a complete b*gger trying to work out how to do the lights and get the right ones.

I’ve also managed to find an alternative handlebar mount for my phone which frees up the headstem area for a cycle analyst :

Everything is fitting perfectly now – even the cruise control switch behind the phone mount is reachable without taking my hands off the grips :

I cut down the new grips to give a proper stable sliding surface with a bit of controlled resistance for the cruise control throttle on the left. It slides up and down against the rubber grip so will stay 'put' when the target constant speed has been selected with the throttle lever.

Now I know it all fits together I can go away happy knowing I’ll be coming back to build in an arrangement that’s going to work and fit easily. Thank **** for that.