Controller phase wire issue

[UrbanPuma]

The story continues to develop. Maybe it's time to show us what you have. If it has the self-learning wires, I bet they're still connected, so it's trying to relearn every time you switch on.

So this is the second time you've had problems with those bullet connectors!

When I was at school standing in the Headmaster's study he said to me, " There are three types of people: Clever people learn from other people's mistakes; normal people learn from their own mistakes; thick people never learn. Lets hope you're in the middle category because you're clearly not in the first."

Einstein said that you can't solve problems with the thinking that created them in the first place.

This is not the same issue as I had last time - no previous juddering on startup. There's a saying, "If you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything at all."

 

[vfr400]

This is not the same issue as I had last time - no previous juddering on startup. There's a saying, "If you don't have anything nice to say, don't say anything at all."

Oh dear! Just when I came here to give you the answer.

 

[UrbanPuma]

Oh dear! Just when I came here to give you the answer.

Oh well haha. Maybe you can redeem yourself lol

 

[vfr400]

Oh well haha. Maybe you can redeem yourself lol

On 30/5/18 post#13 you wrote this and showed a photo of burnt phase connectors.

eBike stopped working - help!

Hi all, I was cycling up a minor hill using throttle and pedal assist on my Powacycle Puma when the motor cut out. All power indicators still work and batter indictor, but throttle and pedal assist doesn't. Also, when I push the bike backwards there's resistance in the back wheel. Any ideas on...

www.pedelecs.co.uk

In this thread yesterday post #1 you said, "the phase wires' electrical tape and plastic tubing were fused together and burnt. "

That's twice according to my traditional maths. I don't think it's me that needs to redeem myself!

 

[UrbanPuma]

On 30/5/18 post#13 you wrote this and showed a photo of burnt phase connectors.

eBike stopped working - help!

Hi all, I was cycling up a minor hill using throttle and pedal assist on my Powacycle Puma when the motor cut out. All power indicators still work and batter indictor, but throttle and pedal assist doesn't. Also, when I push the bike backwards there's resistance in the back wheel. Any ideas on...

www.pedelecs.co.uk

In this thread yesterday post #1 you said, "the phase wires' electrical tape and plastic tubing were fused together and burnt. "

That's twice according to my traditional maths. I don't think it's me that needs to redeem myself!

The juddering is what I posted about - look at the update. Actually, I created another post yesterday too to separate both. The issue with the wires had been dealt with, so not relevant to the juddering issue as the bike worked/works perfectly since charging the battery. I'm not going back and forth with you, so you're welcome to keep your advice, no skin off my nose.

 

[Nealh]

If at the mo the bike is now working correctly with no juddering or fault then as vfr earlier mentioned there is nothing to test until it re -occurs.
The battery isn't a likely cause of the juddering all it does is simply supply a voltage.

You don't say what the new controller is, maybe it was simply re- syncing after the phase wires were disconnected and learning again ?
Also did you check the integrity of the bullet to wire connections and that they weren't damaged by heat ?

 

[UrbanPuma]

If at the mo the bike is now working correctly with no juddering or fault then as vfr earlier mentioned there is nothing to test until it re -occurs.
The battery isn't a likely cause of the juddering all it does is simply supply a voltage.

You don't say what the new controller is, maybe it was simply re- syncing after the phase wires were disconnected and learning again ?
Also did you check the integrity of the bullet to wire connections and that they weren't damaged by heat ?

Hi Nealh,

The new controller is Hao Yueh LMK201 for Puma mk1. I've been informed that I have a sensored hub motor due to it having the 5 extra wires.

I've had the bike for 13- years and never had a problem with burning wires, until Halfords disconnected wires to remove the back wheel for a puncture repair in 2018. This makes me think perhaps the phase wires were not connected back into their original position, or maybe it's down to the electrical tape. I'm a bit weary about using the bike now as not sure about the wiring :/

The bullet to wire connections looked burnt to me. I now have RC bullet connectors and may look into getting the tools to solder them on - watched a very good video.

 

[Nealh]

The heat caused in the wiring will be down to slow riding pulling high current more so in the wrong gear or more especially on hills, if the controller doesn't thermally shut down to heat then the wiring (phases) will get very hot to the point they will melt.
I have had it occur once and it melted my inline fused connection as well as the plastic bullet shrouds.
As mentioned if your bike is now working correctly then it should be ok and the wiring sync/sequence order is correct.
All owners should or need to bite the bullet and forget about the scenario of ' I can't repair my bike' and carr y out simple testing with a metre, there is nothing involved that is rocket science. For most who don't understand we can help to try and solve issues if owners are willing to make the effort and follow guidance.

For the phase/hall sync there are a possible 36 combo's of wiring to test and try, all it involves is swapping wires around to see if any other combo will work. Out of the 36 combo's only a few 4 - 6 will work and some better then others but tbh likely you won't find a better combo then you have, but it is worth a try for piece of mind.
Many times I have posted this diagram below for users to try, it is simple to follow and nothing onerous to follow.
One simply places the bike on a bike work stand or has the motor wheel lifted off the ground, simply start stop left with the three thin hall colours connected as indicated then one simply goes down each column and changes the phase bullet connections also as indicated. With each change try using the PAS or throttle to see if each change runs or not, note down the reaction from each test as indicated until you have the 36 results. Then you disregard the bad combos' and settle on the one of the best of the rest, ultimately you may end up with the combo you already have.
All in all once you get going the test takes about 30 - 45mins to complete, no bike shop you take it too will have any idea about this way to find a correct phase combo to fault find.

 

[Nealh]

If the bike is running and quietly without any untoward noises then there is not much more one can do, any fault finding will show up as within normal criteria until the fault actually develops, once the fault develops and is present then by testing one can narrow it down.

 

[UrbanPuma]

If the bike is running and quietly without any untoward noises then there is not much more one can do, any fault finding will show up as within normal criteria until the fault actually develops, once the fault develops and is present then by testing one can narrow it down.

Thanks very much for this. I have a knee condition that makes it hard for me to use the pedals mostly so I do use the throttle a lot. This makes sense as I was only using throttle the day it cut out so guess I overloaded it.

Yes, I agree - I have fixed most things on the bike myself and watching the videos and with the help I've received here, I will continue to do so. I just couldn't/cant get the back wheel off as the nut is on extremely tight. I'll take it for a spin over the weekend

Thanks for your help.

Kind regards,

Urbanpuma

 

[Nealh]

Tbh Halfrauds I would never take any bike to for repair.
The throttle use will ask for max current power nearly all the time esp at lower speed, just be wary of steep inclines and make sure you select a lower gearing option
With bad knees you need to have low gearing so as not to pressure them to much.

When the wires melted were you going up hill ?

 

[UrbanPuma]

Tbh Halfrauds I would never take any bike to for repair.
The throttle use will ask for max current power nearly all the time esp at lower speed, just be wary of steep inclines and make sure you select a lower gearing option
With bad knees you need to have low gearing so as not to pressure them to much.

When the wires melted were you going up hill ?

I really didn't want to take it there lol.
Yes, I leave it on gear 2 always. I tried going higher, up to 4 a couple if times, but felt it caused too much resistance against my knees.

When my original controller blew I was going up a hill and it just died. This time, I was going over a lot of road humps and had stopped to let a car go then resumed to go over another when it juddered and cut out. I had smelt burning when riding on the flat on my previous ride too.

Ps. just took it for a 3-mile spin...all is fine.

 

[Nealh]

Sounds good, one needs to have faith.

Though not sure she knows much about e bikes .