CANNONDALE, CUBE or KTM ?

[Geebee]

We are have Hobarts first ever organised E-bike ride in a couple of weeks (organized by the states cycling organisation) and apparently 4 retailers will have bikes available for rides, I will see if I can find a Panasonic hub in one of them to test.
Anyone know if the Panasonic is available as a kit? might be good for my trike.
I was forgetting that it wasn't Direct drive.

 

[EddiePJ]

@EddiePJ how about you BH Emotion (i love this bike design) how many miles do you get with one charge ?

This is quite a tough one to answer as my experience with BH has been a very negative one, but others say in the US have found the service superb.
My bike has suffered from faults that it shouldn't but equally my riding has given the bike a very harsh time so other problems such as my recent motor failure cannot be attributed to the product, and is purely down to my use.
Issues in the UK just come when you try to get problems with the bike sorted.

As with other posts, battery life is a hard one to gauge, as I try to use the motor as little as possible and never take it out of eco mode, as there is zero difference between modes.
If I put my mind to it and just used pedal assist, I could probably kill the battery in 15miles. Using a mix of assist and non assist, on off road mud and road conditions is 35miles. With on road use only and again mixing the assist non assist, I could probably push this to nearly 50miles, but you would really have to be committed to do this. I forgot to say that I weigh 12.5 stone (80kg)

Personally, I think that you would be better off with a Bosch powered product, simply on the basis that at least you would/should be able to get things sorted if it happens to ever go wrong. Take a look at Haibike products as well, and whilst he might not be able to help with supplying you a bike, Martin on here. http://www.e-bikeshop.co.uk/ would probably be able to give you some very sound advice.

 

[Electrifying Cycles]

Panasonic systems and Bosch for that matter are not available in kit form. Regarding BH we are currently considering whether to stock these again we stopped after the distributer changed. We have had one problem with one of their bikes and we are waiting to see what the outcome is berfore deciding to continue with them. Apart from being a bit slow the service has been good so far, collected battery/charger free of charge and should be replacing these.

 

[EddiePJ]

G

Regarding BH we are currently considering whether to stock these again we stopped after the distributer changed.

I've come to the conclusion that BH build their bikes from cheese.

Have you thought about stocking Giant?

The range of bikes now looks rather nice, and the Yamaha motor looks built to last and with 36v 11.1ah (400wh) and 250W,60Nm the spec on paper looks good as well.

 

[Electrifying Cycles]

I really like the BH bikes so it is just a shame about some of the issues. The training experience was interesting but would not go into that here


I haven't to be honest. I have heard new Yamaha crank drive is supposed to be good but not rode it and at top end I normally only sign a brand after trying the bikes.

Very similar to Bosch so would want to know I could get spare bits if needed. We stock spare Bosch bits like Martin and I like the fact that we can get them so that would be my only concern if I was happy with test ride. Alot of standard bike shops tend to do Giant as there only e bike brand.

We have someone from Cube coming to see us soon so will see what I think of them. Some of their models look good but prefer frame mounted batteries but some of their bikes have the battery positioned on the crossbar.

I was also very impressed with some of the new A2B bikes which I tried at the NEC. However their styling on some of the bikes is a bit marmite but I like them

 

[Bike]

Chris,if you are anywhere near a dealer who has a good selection of many brands then try as many as possible,I guarantee you will buy a bike completely different to your initial choices.
KTM is readily available in the UK,Cannondale and Cube very rare...the Cube rep at Eurobike told me they are not interested in selling e-bikes to the UK !!
If you advise your location I can advise a dealer who has good stocks,a big list on the website does not always reveal good stocks.
At £2k price I think KTM has some nice bikes.
KudosDave
www.kudoscycles.com

Hi Kudocyles, CUBE is represented in the UK in all big bike shops and many shops have CUBE e-bikes available. Currently we are shipping several CUBE e-bike models to the UK CUBE dealer. The rep you had contact with at Eurobike was maybe incorrect informed or there was an misunderstanding during the conversation. Fortunately our e-bike range was received very possitively during our dealers shows and is available in many bike shops. If you have any questions please feel free to contact us.
Cheers,
TEAM CUBE
www.cube.eu

 

[Tim]

Don't overlook Kalkhoff with the new Impulse 2.0 motor system. Compares very well to the various Bosch systems.

612Wh battery (up to about 125 miles in favourable conditions, 70-80 miles realistically)
70Nm max torque
More than twice the battery lifetime at 1100 charge cycles rather than 500

At a 50cycles showroom you can try Bosch-powered bikes, Impulse-powered bikes, Xion-powered bikes (a direct drive a bit like BionX with regen but far better battery) and also leg-powered bikes (Kalkhoff do pedal cycles too)

 

[chris2014]

Tim ,Kalkhoff is great bikes but its ugly or boring looking and very expensive

 

[rsscott]

Traders, please remember to only step into threads where your brand is specifically mentioned or the OP has opened the thread to all.

Thanks
Russ

 

[Martin@e-bikeshop]

Take a look at Haibike products as well, and whilst he might not be able to help with supplying you a bike, Martin on here. http://www.e-bikeshop.co.uk/ would probably be able to give you some very sound advice.

Hi Eddie,

I have not been on here much as have been busy busy with sales and setting up our new outlet.
Nice to see I am still recommended Thanks Eddie.

Chris please feel free to give me a call or email to discuss the eBikes. Lots in stock here that would be suitable along with a good back up service and expert advice.

I will be able to narrow it down for you, be it over a coffee and test ride in store or over the phone please feel free to get in touch.

Regards
Martin

 

[Gringo]

I've been following this thread with some interest as I'm considering either the KTM action 29 or Cube reaction 29 to replace my present bike.
It has turned into a bit of a general battery bashing session rather than talk on the merits of the bikes in question.
Anywho, if we accept the fact that all manufactures are optimistic with there mileage and always will be, many we could talk about bikes

Currently I'm using my 2008 converted Agattu for off roading, bridal ways, gated roads, light trails and some tight woodland trails.
I'm not a fast rider but I'm noticing the bikes limitations, off road it feels a bit of a bus, particularly "tucking in" on tight slow turns, getting over fallen trees ! Also the forks, ok on most surfaces until I find myself on bridal ways, what with the dried up hoof prints worse than any cobbles !
With the possibility of a sale on some of my hobby equipment and a little overtime, I'm looking at my options should I decide to upgrade.
I think I've narrowed it down to two contenders ( both very much at the upper limit of my budget).
1/ 2014 KTM Action 29
2/ Cube reaction hybrid 29

The Cube, looking much like the KTM but so much cheaper.
I'm by no means any kind of expert when it comes to bike spec, not knowing the difference between this group set or that make of breaks but as an engineer I can tell quality from the cheap stuff LOL
Whatever route I go, its certain to be a crank motor with a down tube mounted battery and what I need the most is a low first gear with some decent amounts of torque.
So I'm hoping to pick up some of your knowledge & experience of these machines.

Thanks Carl

 

[jackhandy]

Not being familiar wirh eithwr bike, I feel I'm qualified to advise you, in the best traditions of this fine forum

The only comments I'd make are that, riding a 29er myself on allsorts of terrain, the improvement over 26" wheels is considerable.
A comment often made is that the 29er is not so nimble in tight manoeuvering; but the jommetry of some has been rethought to overcome this.

I certainly can't fault mine on the rough stuff, but have got into a bit of a tank-slapper when getting out of the saddle to gain some speed boost uphill:
Rightly or no, I blamed the jommetry.

 

[Gringo]

I certainly can't fault mine on the rough stuff, but have got into a bit of a tank-slapper when getting out of the saddle to gain some speed boost uphill:

A 29er is 700c wheels with 2" plus tyres fitted and my Agattu has some 2.1 smart Sams fitted making it a 29er, changing from thiner road tyres didn't worsen the handling so it must be the largeness of the bike and it's geometry that's the problem.
I also ride a nice unpowered Trek hybrid and that's very nimble, but because of my arthritis (knees) I don't have the luxury of "getting out of the saddle to gain speed" so I can't use it off road hence the need for low geared torque.

 

[KTM Bike Industries UK]

Hi Carl.

I'll take some time to hopefully give you some additional information.

however first I'll just respond to this...

A 29er is 700c wheels with 2" plus tyres fitted and my Agattu has some 2.1 smart Sams fitted making it a 29er,

this isn't correct. a 29" wheel is a 700c wheel, they and also infact 28" wheels are all the same size.

What tyre you put on it won't effect the size of the actual wheel..

I think I've narrowed it down to two contenders ( both very much at the upper limit of my budget).
1/ 2014 KTM Action 29
2/ Cube reaction hybrid 29

The Cube, looking much like the KTM but so much cheaper.
I'm by no means any kind of expert when it comes to bike spec, not knowing the difference between this group set or that make of breaks but as an engineer I can tell quality from the cheap stuff LOL
Whatever route I go, its certain to be a crank motor with a down tube mounted battery and what I need the most is a low first gear with some decent amounts of torque.
So I'm hoping to pick up some of your knowledge & experience of these machines.

Thanks Carl

The bikes might at first impression look similar - ie aluminium hardtail 29er with Bosch drive.

But as with anything in life you do get what you pay for.

For instance the Cube Reaction is also available with a better spec for over £3000

so its really about deciding your budget and getting the best bike you can for the money.

Clearly we work with the KTM brand, so we're going to suggest the KTM is worth the extra cash, because you are getting better components, which are important parts of what makes a bike's ride quality.

Especially with a 29er the wheel quality can make a dramatic different to how a bike feels and accelerates, and the suspension fork is also an important thing to look at.

On the KTM Macina Action, you get a set of Rockshox forks, DT Swiss Rims and Shimano Deore hubs. On the Cube, you get Suntour forks, Cube own brand rims and budget Shimano hubs. All these things cost extra money, which is why the KTM is more than this Cube. Only you can decide if having these better quality lighter components is worth it to you.

On another note, the KTM is in stock, I don't think the Cube will be with dealers for some time. So again, the fact the bike actually exists does also add some value to the KTM, ie you could be riding it before the weekend.

So in summary, both are excellent bikes, but at slightly different price points so direct comparison is a bit unfair.

If you have any specific questions about the KTM just ask and we'll try to help.

Regards
Col

 

[Gringo]

Thanks for your comments Col
You pulled me up on wheel size, I said 29ers had 700c rims are you saying they don't ?
As I understand it, we have the Americans to thank for the term 29er as they quote there bikes not by wheel size but prefer to use the overall tyre diameter. I'm sure if I'm wrong you'll be quick to correct me.

You say, no Cube's in stock.
I say, I was in a shop yesterday and rode one around there carpark, I could have taken it away with me if I had the funds, unfortunatly I'm a bit shy of the full amount at the moment.
My budget is £1000 plus what I can get for my Agattu.

I appreciate the KTM's components are better and would like those forks, I also prefer your paint work.
If there wasn't the £500 difference, you'd have my custom every day !

 

[RobF]

As we all grasp, the wheels are all the same size.

So what makes a 29er?

It has to be the tyres, which tend to be 2" - or more - wide and higher profile, ie: taller sidewalls.

 

[KTM Bike Industries UK]

As we all grasp, the wheels are all the same size.

So what makes a 29er?

It has to be the tyres, which tend to be 2" - or more - wide and higher profile, ie: taller sidewalls.

A 29er is just an Mtb term for the same size wheel that roadies call 700c it's the same size wheel, the tyres are interchangeable. The difference is just one is used for mountain bike and the other road bikes. Confusingly lots of hybrid style bikes have 28" rims. These are also identical size.


And gringo, I'm sorry I didn't realise there was stock in the uk, all dealers I looked at were showing pre order only.
Regards
Col

 

[Tangsoo]

Hi Kudocyles, CUBE is represented in the UK in all big bike shops and many shops have CUBE e-bikes available. Currently we are shipping several CUBE e-bike models to the UK CUBE dealer. The rep you had contact with at Eurobike was maybe incorrect informed or there was an misunderstanding during the conversation. Fortunately our e-bike range was received very possitively during our dealers shows and is available in many bike shops. If you have any questions please feel free to contact us.
Cheers,
TEAM CUBE
www.cube.eu

Had a look at these in Leisure lakes, Daventry. Think they had three on show and a haibike? Looked very nice, battery looked nice, very low in the frame. Bit $$$ for me tho'.

 

[RobF]

A 29er is just an Mtb term for the same size wheel that roadies call 700c it's the same size wheel, the tyres are interchangeable. The difference is just one is used for mountain bike and the other road bikes. Confusingly lots of hybrid style bikes have 28" rims. These are also identical size.
Col

So are you telling me you could put a 2"+ mountain bike 29er tyre onto a wheel from a 7kg road bike?

Or that one of those racing snake 50g rubber bands the roadies laughingly call a tyre would fit on my 29er Rose?

By the way, I already knew the wheels are all same diameter, but thanks for telling me, twice.

 

[KTM Bike Industries UK]

So are you telling me you could put a 2"+ mountain bike 29er tyre onto a wheel from a 7kg road bike?

Or that one of those racing snake 50g rubber bands the roadies laughingly call a tyre would fit on my 29er Rose?

Yes, the wheels are the same size, so the tyres are interchangeable.

the difference is just marketing.