Can I derestrict a Cyclotricity 250W kit? Recommendations for lightweight hybrid?

[Simon Turner]

Hello all.

I am brand new to the world of ebikes and am working up to my first purchase. I'm mainly after a bike to commute 5 miles to work, and a very small amount of offroad (short cut). The commute from village to town includes some light inclines/declines.

After trying a few ebikes I was thinking of buying an Oxygen eMate. Love the easy derestriction to 25mph, the light feel and the throttle on the left hand grip.

However, I don't like the weight of purpose made ebikes in general and am beginning to think that by adding a conversion to a lightweight hybrid I may be able to reduce the overall weight from 19/20kg to something like 14/15kg. So I've fallen across the Cyclotricity 250W kits. I've rung them up and they have told me it is not possible to derestrict their kits/bikes. Is this really true? If it is, can anyone recommend a 250W lightweight front wheel kit (preferably) with good quality water bottle battery that will get me to at least 25mph.... and ideally one that will allow me to fit the throttle to the left hand side of the handlebars.

If anyone has been working through the same requirements and come to a solution I'd love to hear it, even down to choice of light weight hybrid. I am quite price sensitive and would like to keep costs as low as I am able.

Thanks very much for any help.
BTW. I am aware of all the legalities with derestriction.

 

[KirstinS]

A few trade offs here.

A 250w motor going at over 25mph must either be high rpm or over volted. Either way it won't have high climbing ability and fair chance of burning it out.

My 350w bpm2 hub 36v version has been run at 44v , 48 and 52v nominal. It can hit those speeds on higher voltages

But then it sure ain't lightweight.

Perhaps a mid drive would be better ? They are a lightweight solution and run through gears so can hit high speeds. Easy destricted via LCD settings

 

[KirstinS]

You can put thumb throttle on left. I do as my alfine shifters are on right

 

[selrahc1992]

Hello all.

I am brand new to the world of ebikes and am working up to my first purchase. I'm mainly after a bike to commute 5 miles to work, and a very small amount of offroad (short cut). The commute from village to town includes some light inclines/declines.

After trying a few ebikes I was thinking of buying an Oxygen eMate. Love the easy derestriction to 25mph, the light feel and the throttle on the left hand grip.

However, I don't like the weight of purpose made ebikes in general and am beginning to think that by adding a conversion to a lightweight hybrid I may be able to reduce the overall weight from 19/20kg to something like 14/15kg. So I've fallen across the Cyclotricity 250W kits. I've rung them up and they have told me it is not possible to derestrict their kits/bikes. Is this really true? If it is, can anyone recommend a 250W lightweight front wheel kit (preferably) with good quality water bottle battery that will get me to at least 25mph.... and ideally one that will allow me to fit the throttle to the left hand side of the handlebars.

If anyone has been working through the same requirements and come to a solution I'd love to hear it, even down to choice of light weight hybrid. I am quite price sensitive and would like to keep costs as low as I am able.

Thanks very much for any help.
BTW. I am aware of all the legalities with derestriction.

i put the oxygen 13Ah kit on a b'twin triban 3 (skinny tyred racer), as a fast commuter it works great (24mph on hilly terrain easy), curiously the rather good rim brakes on the b'twin works better for me than discs now ive accepted it. one thing I REALLY would change is the frame - mine cant take any tyres bigger than 25 (very skinny) and so I cant put proper puncture protected tyres like fat schwalbe marathon plus' with nice grippy thread and pothole absorbing quality on

 

[Rob Maule]

I have the front wheel conversion 250w with the 36v bottle battery and want to do exactly the same thing. The goal is not to go from 0 - 25mph with the motor which everyone seems to think. The goal is to go from 0 - 15mph with my own power and 15 - 25mph with the motor pushing. Surely if I'm still pedalling away hard and giving the bike power, I can just add that to the motor and it should get me up to 25mph? If not, could someone please explain why?

I also would like to know how to de-restrict the motor and have received the exact same answer from cyclotricity as OP

Thanks

 

[KirstinS]

I have the front wheel conversion 250w with the 36v bottle battery and want to do exactly the same thing. The goal is not to go from 0 - 25mph with the motor which everyone seems to think. The goal is to go from 0 - 15mph with my own power and 15 - 25mph with the motor pushing. Surely if I'm still pedalling away hard and giving the bike power, I can just add that to the motor and it should get me up to 25mph? If not, could someone please explain why?

I also would like to know how to de-restrict the motor and have received the exact same answer from cyclotricity as OP

Thanks

That's very unusual request ! Most want to be able to climb hills or go further for less effort. The most enegery is used at startup. I cant see why you'd like to push all the electric gear yourself up to 15mph

You'd need a custom controller built that didn't kick in until 15mph

You'd need to either over volt the motor you have and/ or get a motor with faster windings . And then you'd have a bike that will go faster but wont climb hills without burning out

All in all just sell the Kit you have and go buy a mid drive like bbs01 or 2 .

They run through the gears to can get up to 25 mph and a bit more.

Ultimately you have a road legal kit with the voltage, controller and motor windings designed to give you a legal ebike experience. If you want something else then best start again. Imho

 

[Rob Maule]

Ok, I think you slightly misunderstand what I meant but that's because I explained it poorly. Let me try again.

I can currently cycle at 15mph with my own power. I want to be able to go 25mph. All I want is a motor to make up the difference. If I derestrict the 250w with 36v battery, will it be capable of this? If so, how do I do it?

 

[trex]

your intended use is not what the law allows. You'll need to have a number plate and bike insurance if you want assistance when riding at above 25km/h.
The law tries to help the less able bodied persons to enjoy biking, not to replace the petrol motorbikes with electric ones.

 

[KirstinS]

Ok, I think you slightly misunderstand what I meant but that's because I explained it poorly. Let me try again.

I can currently cycle at 15mph with my own power. I want to be able to go 25mph. All I want is a motor to make up the difference. If I derestrict the 250w with 36v battery, will it be capable of this? If so, how do I do it?

Legalities aside - the simple answer is no. You might be able to get another 2 or 3mph using a unrestricted controller. That's a maybe.

beyond that you are limited by what the motor windings are capable of 36v. It simply cannot turn any faster without increasing the voltage.

If you really want to try it (and are prepared to risk burning out your motor and /or controller) find a 12v battery and add in series to get 48v and test it

 

[anotherkiwi]

Many of us can cycle at 15.5 mph on our own power. I can even do it with the motor switched off so am moving myself and 21 kg of e-bike!

The motor will help you get to 15.5 mph then you, fresh as a daisy, will only have to add the effort to get to 25 mph. On the flat or downhill why not. Uphill you will be limited to 15.5 mph. Laws of physics come into play...

 

[Warwick]

I'd echo the OP's opinion on the weight of many e-bikes. My Woosh Scirocco really is a heavy lump and is a devil to get off the mark quickly. However, I'm adapting it by fitting better wheels and replacing the horrible and heavy suspension forks with rigid ones. That should save me 1-2Kg and improve the ride. It's a mid driven bike, so I've been able to up the cut out speed to the maximum available 40Km/h. The front brake will also be upgraded. I've yet to fit all the parts I mentioned, but I'm looking forward to trying it out. That said, it will still be a lump to get up hills. I'm aware that it's illegal as it is, but will depend on plod's ignorance.

Perhaps this route would suit the OP's requirements?

 

[trex]

@ warwick: I don't think Hatti @ woosh will like what you are saying.
She will charge you for repair if she found out you derestrict the bike.

 

[Warwick]

http://www.pedelecs.co.uk/forum/threads/derestricting-sirocco-cdl.18824/page-3#post-279228

You seemed to like the idea here...

 

[trex]

I like your idea of upgrading the brakes to Avid and replacing the suspension fork with rigid one. I don't have any view about derestriction, to me, it's a personal choice. Hatti @ woosh made clear on her website that she'd void your guarantee if the bike is derestricted.

 

[JohnCade]

How would she know? I don’t suppose anyone would be fool enough to send it back under warranty without putting it back to 25kph.

In this case though there can’t be many bikes modified with rigid forks so he has made himself a hostage to fortune by posting about all this.

 

[trex]

How would she know?

Her sixth sense?

 

[JohnCade]

The only way to make riding those bikes a pleasurable experience is to change the cut out. You don’t have to go overboard but 30kph is 19mph and eliminates the very unpleasant harsh cut out.

Someone wrote recently that the later LCD allows you to set the cut out in steps of one, and in that case it might be possible to set it to the kph equivalent of 17mph, which is legal and would probably not be so harsh as 15.5mph. If the Chinese could make the motors power down progressively as the cut out speed was approached it wouldn’t be necessary to fiddle about with it at all.

 

[trex]

I can think of ways to make the King Meter LCD more user friendly but would the customers be willing to pay £15-£20 for the soft transition add-on while they can simply derestrict the LCD for nothing?

 

[JohnCade]

But shouldn’t a customer expect a 'soft transition’ as a matter of course? The constant jerking forward as the cut out comes in at full power must put many riders off, and probably is the main reason that they want to derestrict it.

 

[trex]

there is already a soft landing zone in assist levels 1,2,3 in the J-LCD, none of that jerkiness but on 4 & 5, you can still feel the stop/start. I suppose the King Meter people are making progress.