Just for the sake of accuracy we know he did at least once, a white English lad of around eleven.
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Brexit, for once some facts.
- Thread starter flecc
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Ofcourse they are racist ..The men were all Muslim , every single girl white.. Can you imagine the outcry if scenario were reversed..( All white gangs preying on muslim girls)
To deny a racist, ethnic,or religious element is completely missing what's going on..( or hopefully what was going on in Rotherham's case)
Had Jimmy Saville only targeted muslim children it would certainly have introduced a racist element.
The odd thing about the Asian gangs is that its assumed it wasn't systematic and that somehow only girls in care and or at risk were targeted. It was no such thing. Girls were found outside schools by young Asian lads...befriended...then targeted by older associates..families threatened for cooperation from the girls. It could have happened to any family...any white family that is.
Its the epitome of racism.
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Actually, there is't any reason to bother is there? there is no half way house in this, and I for one want no truck with that.
Sorry no compromise is on the cards.
A poor second best is not acceptable, it isn't viable.
Here's a little story about what a Brexit future could mean in some respects long term for the UK:
You've probably never even heard of this place, it's rarely shown on any maps. Situated next to Georgia, the very beautiful country of Abkhazia is an idyllic Black Sea resort, once much favoured by the politbureau elite of the USSR. Having that status it had modern infrastructure and enjoyed good living standards.
But when the USSR broke up, Abkhazia decide it would go for independence, rather than stay with Russia. Now they sit isolated, on one side Georgia which is an enemy threatening them. Their only protection comes from Russia, who taught the Georgians a harsh lesson when they overran Abkhazia, so their saviour was the very country they decided to leave.
No-one else will help them, since most countries in the world refuse to recognise Abkhazia is a country, so they can't travel since their passports aren't accepted, other than by just four countries. Since those four countries are Russia, Venezuela, Nicaragua and a small Pacific island nation, the only one they can reach is Russia, who they left! And economically they aren't going to get any help from those four either.
Today that once wonderful place to live is at the bottom of the stack for living standards. The only means of travel on their motorways is by horse and cart. Their plight is best summed up by this remark from an Abkhazian:
"I think we have paid a very high price for independence."
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You've probably never even heard of this place, it's rarely shown on any maps. Situated next to Georgia, the very beautiful country of Abkhazia is an idyllic Black Sea resort, once much favoured by the politbureau elite of the USSR. Having that status it had modern infrastructure and enjoyed good living standards.
But when the USSR broke up, Abkhazia decide it would go for independence, rather than stay with Russia. Now they sit isolated, on one side Georgia which is an enemy threatening them. Their only protection comes from Russia, who taught the Georgians a harsh lesson when they overran Abkhazia, so their saviour was the very country they decided to leave.
No-one else will help them, since most countries in the world refuse to recognise Abkhazia is a country, so they can't travel since their passports aren't accepted, other than by just four countries. Since those four countries are Russia, Venezuela, Nicaragua and a small Pacific island nation, the only one they can reach is Russia, who they left! And economically they aren't going to get any help from those four either.
Today that once wonderful place to live is at the bottom of the stack for living standards. The only means of travel on their motorways is by horse and cart. Their plight is best summed up by this remark from an Abkhazian:
"I think we have paid a very high price for independence."
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This is a discussion I didn't want to get into. However from my perspective it I do see a racist element. It has been confirmed in law that the perpetrators were of one ethic group and the victims from another. It was an extensive operation, not just down to one or two people.
There have been statements, and actions, that this group of males targeted these girls because they were easy, or trashy and less valuable persons than people from their own group because they were culturally different. These were not just crimes of opportunity but were systematic.
As an aside, and accepting the vile actions of the perpetrators, there is another group who share responsibility... The parents and particularly the mother's of these girls. These people have abrogated their responsibility.
Agree with most of your post but the point about parents is actually not fair. In some instances girls were told families would be harmed if they were told . In others gabgs actually appeared outside parents houses in the middle of night, parents confronted them and were threatened. Police informed but in nearly every case no action taken. The girls and families were ignored.
There was a complete systematic failure by all authorities? Reasons ? Who knows but sacking Sarah Champion certainly didn't help us find out why..
Our nature wants to blame parents in an attempt to reassure us it couldn't happen to "my" family. Fact is it could, and probably did in many instances and families don't even know.
The whole affair has left a shadow over region, and IMHO the only slight positive is that the communities have not reacted against each other.
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there is no way around it.
People are taught to be patriotic and independent and the majority often do not understand what is in practice good for their country.
I fundamentally disagree with the xenophobia, racism at the heart of brexit. The dishonesty of a feckless, lazy electorate projecting their woes onto a relatively small, more productive population of immigrants too. In principle I don't seek a compromise with the kind of people who endorsed it. Not that I think it's possible, they have a hidden agenda (eg destroying workers, consumers, citizens rights) - and frankly I think any suggestion of a compromise is just a ruse, an attempt at getting remainders to collude with, in my view, a disgusting agenda.
'taught to be patriotic' usually translate as manipulated by politicians to further their (not the peoples) interests. Brexit is intrinsically the most unpatriotic phenomenon I've witnessed, in damaging the UK perhaps more long term than anything else in 100 years
Naturally, I'm not in the habit of expressing anyone else's
Which in this day and age is a bit of a revolutionary approach[emoji1]
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.. OK I am happy to be corrected on that detail. But the relationship between child and parent should have been such that this void at puberty would never have happened. By the time gangs get to the stage of forming outside doors , the battle is basically lost and it needs a task force to come in and sort it out. I don't think political correctness , was the enemy, more likely official penny pinching.
I won't respond to any further posts on this topic, as I think it's off thread.
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Strictly for what it's worth, it's always good to hold in mind the - vast- majority of sexual abuse, in the UK as elsewhere, is perpetrated by parents of the child. And that fact cuts across ethnic boundaries.
Back to Brexshit...
interesting blog post from leaveHQ
"There was nothing preordained about Brexit being permanently harmful yet we are in very real danger of it becoming so." etc etc etc.
http://leavehq.com/blogview.aspx?blogno=259
interesting blog post from leaveHQ
"There was nothing preordained about Brexit being permanently harmful yet we are in very real danger of it becoming so." etc etc etc.
http://leavehq.com/blogview.aspx?blogno=259
I'm not sure I fully know where i stand on this.. its not an easy subject.
Does someones sexual preference, ie preference... which is a positive thing (I know it can be directed negatively) make them racist? Ie they prefer something? It probably does. But are they acting for racist reasons? There was an interesting program on the other week about how internet dating is essentially encouraging racist behavior because you can exclude people based on skin colour etc etc. It was interesting.
White Supremacist's seem to argue that they are protecting their blood line, heritage etc etc, so don't believe they should be breeding with other religions / skin colours. That seems subtly different to the crimes in Rotherham where they targeted vulnerable kids. I wonder if the kids were targeted because they were vulnerable and white, or just white, or just vulnerable. Were there no vulnerable asian / muslim / sikh / atheist kids? I don't know? Is that a reflection on white society maybe?
I just find it hard to balance the religion with these crimes, because you can be white and muslim, and equally you can be from Asia and not Muslim.
Its not an easy one. I can see that race is involved in many many things, but I think blaming it as a cause just continues to divide society which causes more problems than it solves.
But there is clearly a problem with sectors of society who feel they are above the law... I just don't think we should be blaming their race / religion. even if their actions were racist... Does that make any sense??
.. that is a pretty clear analysis of the current situation. I don't accept their fundamental premise, but their analysis of the state of play is spot on.
Yes, agreed again. My motive for pushing point on thread has been fact leavers , including myself, have been continually portrayed as racist. Our region voted Brexit quite strongly yet even under all pressure of mentioned incidents our communities have remained united and all turned out against EDL when they reared their ugly heads near us.
Asian, Muslim, white, pakistani have actually all united against the gangs. Sarah Champion knew that and was simply pointing out to a wider audience what has happened.
If country cant have an open discussion ,the behaviour will continue. Corbyn is simply bowing to demand from PC brigade who actually do not understand the situation.
It seems to me he always takes easy way out, he has done same with Brexit.
There hasn't been a single act of reprisal, yet posters on here insist we are a racist nation. I don't think so.
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I have a product currently being made in China that requires TUV GS and CE standard...I approached TUV UK for advice as to their requirements for testing the product to these standards.....ball park figure £5k per standard,testing time 6 months.
I advised my manufacturer,the largest jack manufacturer in the world.about my problem....they had already tested in house to the standards,cost would be nil,buy us a beer next time you are over.
Now do you see the problem,the UK is already a side show when it comes to achieving standards,these big manufacturers are already tuned-in to working with EU customers and CE/GS standards but not to UK standards,they wouldnt know how to manufacture to a UK standard
The supplier is OEM to most of the German car manufacturers,when you take the emergency jack out of a VW you are handling their product.
I am trying to be respectful,but I am at the coalface of world trade,just saying 'its ok we just test to the EU standard' shows an amateur knowledge of what real trading is all about. If the EU wont let us have access to their standards it will be impossible for UK manufacturers to sell to the world....I suspect the CE/GS standards are almost 100% accepted in the world.
Selfishly I dont care,most of my product now comes from China and the chinese realise that they have to build to CE (European) and GS (USA) standards,I will ignore UK standards as irrelevant.
KudosDave
Yes, he's being clever, since that upsets the least number of people.
If one does nothing, one does nothing wrong.
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