Brexit, for once some facts.

[oldgroaner]

One of the jokers in the Guardian listed the virtues of Nissan, including the following
"Sunderland export cars to 180 countries - and 152 of those aren't in the EU"
To which I of course responded.
So why do we need to subsidise them, then?

 

[oldgroaner]

Oh the irony! The director of Nissan negotiating a deal to protect the bottom line in case of brexit and... protecting French taxpayers interests ROTFL

And all paid for with enthusiasm by 52% of the Bexit Voting British Taxpayer, and with considerable discontent by the remainder of the Nation!

 

[anotherkiwi]

One of the jokers in the Guardian listed the virtues of Nissan, including the following
"Sunderland export cars to 180 countries - and 152 of those aren't in the EU"
To which I of course responded.
So why do we need to subsidise them, then?

So the people want to know which are the 16 (or 15 if you are from the PRC) countries holding out and not buying Nissan cars?

We need trade négociations in place immediately with those countries so that they buy British assembled, Franco/Japanese cars... ROTFL

 

[flecc]

We need trade négociations in place immediately with those countries so that they buy British assembled, Franco/Japanese cars... ROTFL

Now we must be fair, far from just British assembled. Nissan's best seller is the Qashqai and that was British designed at their Paddington, London design centre, development in Surrey and manufactured exclusively at Sunderland for a long time. Only the engines were joint Renault-Nissan designs. A second production line was only set up in Japan when the runaway success of that model meant Sunderland couldn't meet world-wide demand. I knew that when I found there were over 50,000 buyers ahead of me in the 2008 queue!
,

 

[oldgroaner]

My two pennorth in the Guardian in response to a guy who thinks it is a good idea to sponsor Nissan
"
Only an idiot keeps paying a Blackmailer, Nissan have really hit pay dirt with us, haven't they?
We pay a foreign Company to be here, exploit our workers, send the profits to Japan and France while paying minimal Tax into the system. pretty much guaranteeing no British company has a chance of Competing with them as the deck is well and truly stacked against them, and idiots view that as a Victory?
We would quite simply be far better off paying for a British Company to compete and freeze these parasites out."

And to think we began the industrial revolution, now we are fair game to any con artist that chances by.

 

[derf]

My two pennorth in the Guardian in response to a guy who thinks it is a good idea to sponsor Nissan
"
Only an idiot keeps paying a Blackmailer, Nissan have really hit pay dirt with us, haven't they?
We pay a foreign Company to be here, exploit our workers, send the profits to Japan and France while paying minimal Tax into the system. pretty much guaranteeing no British company has a chance of Competing with them as the deck is well and truly stacked against them, and idiots view that as a Victory?
We would quite simply be far better off paying for a British Company to compete and freeze these parasites out."

And to think we began the industrial revolution, now we are fair game to any con artist that chances by.

but it is probably illegal under WTO rules
http://news.sky.com/story/nissan-investment-may-come-at-significant-cost-10634181
and so may not happen, sometimes I wonder whether submarine May's poker face hides an "intelligence" very bit as unkeen as andrea leadsom's

 

[oldtom]

Crikey! If we let the tory muppets carry on with any more negotiations, Britain PLC will be bankrupt before we even get to the point of triggering Article 50.

I should think quite a few carmakers will be more than a little disturbed at the news of Nissan's assurances from HM Government. This could come back to bite Mrs May! 'Taking back control' is now looking more and more like giving away control!

Tom

 

[oldgroaner]

Crikey! If we let the tory muppets carry on with any more negotiations, Britain PLC will be bankrupt before we even get to the point of triggering Article 50.

I should think quite a few carmakers will be more than a little disturbed at the news of Nissan's assurances from HM Government. This could come back to bite Mrs May! 'Taking back control' is now looking more and more like giving away control!

Tom

More in the nature of paying "Protection Money" Tom!
if you think about it Nissan are behaving more like an occupying force than a foreign company, it's a reversal of the role our victims played under the "British Empire"
They made us an offer we can't refuse again, and again, and again. good racket no?

 

[gray198]

Just seen breaking news on the Biased Broadcasting Service that Nissan are going to build Qashqai and a new model at Sunderland. Good news for the economy

I did think it was good news. Now I'm not so sure????

 

[oldgroaner]

I did think it was good news. Now I'm not so sure????

In the long term we need to replace Foreign companies with our own if we are indeed going to "make a go of it"
Despite what Brexiters think, in principle I also think economic independence is possible, but not without British Companies making the goods we sell, the tax and profit staying in this country.
Foreign Companies using our workforce and resources is short term only.
It is on the social , environmental and political front that we lose out not being in the EU.
Economics are important, but not so important as that loss

 

[derf]

In the long term we need to replace Foreign companies with our own if we are indeed going to "make a go of it"
Despite what Brexiters think, in principle I also think economic independence is possible, but not without British Companies making the goods we sell, the tax and profit staying in this country.
Foreign Companies using our workforce and resources is short term only.
It is on the social , environmental and political front that we lose out not being in the EU.
Economics are important, but not so important as that loss

with respect, I don't agree. to me a developed country like the UK (for now) trying to manufacture its own goods in a globalised world is a bit like, say, someone with a profession taking time out form his professional activity to make his own toothpaste. in a world in which other countries in the far east produce whatever the uk could in the best possible scenario for a fraction of the cost would simply be silly. a bit like Russia's misguided attempts to manufacture "feta cheese" from cow's milk (it tastes every bit like rubber) following EU sanctions. It's the wrong answer to the wrong question this late in a globalised world in 2016.

 

[tillson]

brexit happens because the conservative party has won a slim 12-seat majority in 2015.
If they lose that majority either through by-elections or at the next general election, brexit will be reversed. When you think that about 40% of tory voters voted to remain, it is very possible that Mrs May is the last conservative PM for a very long time.

I can see your point and it will be interesting to see what happens if / when the referendum result is disregarded by parliament. It will certainly make the Conservatives unpopular for a minimum of a decade.

But what is the alternative? I like Jeremy Corbin and he seems a decent sort of man who lives a principled life, but recently I have doubted his judgement. First with the appointment of Gizapeerage Onionbahji to the House of Lords and Shadow Attorney General, presumably for her work on the final solution to the jewish problem. Secondly for the appointment of Diane Abbott to the shadow cabinet, the great opponent of privilege and selective education, except where her own family is concerned.

Two greater wastes of good and fully functioning body organs you will seldom find.

Labour and Conservative, both totally unelectable.

 

[oldgroaner]

with respect, I don't agree. to me a developed country like the UK (for now) trying to manufacture its own goods in a globalised world is a bit like, say, someone with a profession taking time out form his professional activity to make his own toothpaste. in a world in which other countries in the far east produce whatever the uk could in the best possible scenario for a fraction of the cost would simply be silly. a bit like Russia's misguided attempts to manufacture "feta cheese" from cow's milk (it tastes every bit like rubber) following EU sanctions. It's the wrong answer to the wrong question this late in a globalised world in 2016.

Sorry but that is nonsense as modern manufacturing is so automated that slave labour is going out of fashion anyway.
It can be done just as easily here as in China and Frankly it applies to China too where automated manufacture will inevitably replace human based systems in due course.
Your thinking is years out of date, and defeatist,
If we are a "Developed" Country , not just a race of Bankers, lawyers and "Professionals" you so admire, our "professional Engineers" will be up the the job and our "professional Management Executives up to running it efficiently"
Just what do you imagine we are going to give to the world from our "Professional Activity" services that the rest of the world can't do as well or better? Nothing Whatsoever
Absolute Nonsense!
We must become a manufacturing nation again with more advanced technology that the opposition or be condemned to becoming a third world nation.
Only through trade can we earn a living long term, the rest is Fantasy.

 

[oldgroaner]

I can see your point and it will be interesting to see what happens if / when the referendum result is disregarded by parliament. It will certainly make the Conservatives unpopular for a minimum of a decade.

But what is the alternative? I like Jeremy Corbin and he seems a decent sort of man who lives a principled life, but recently I have doubted his judgement. First with the appointment of Gizapeerage Onionbahji to the House of Lords and Shadow Attorney General, presumably for her work on the final solution to the jewish problem. Secondly for the appointment of Diane Abbott to the shadow cabinet, the great appoint of privilege and selective education, except where her own family is concerned.

Two greater wastes of good and fully functioning body organs you will seldom find.

Labour and Conservative, both totally unelectable.

Good old tillson, and classic material too "Gizapeerage Onionbahji " quite exquisite humour!
Alas I must agree with your post, more's the pity!

 

[derf]

Sorry but that is nonsense as modern manufacturing is so automated that slave labour is going out of fashion anyway.
It can be done just as easily here as in China and Frankly it applies to China too where automated manufacture will inevitably replace human based systems in due course.
Your thinking is years out of date, and defeatist,
If we are a "Developed" Country , not just a race of Bankers, lawyers and "Professionals" you so admire, our "professional Engineers" will be up the the job and our "professional Management Executives up to running it efficiently"
Just what do you imagine we are going to give to the world from our "Professional Activity" services that the rest of the world can't do as well or better? Nothing Whatsoever
Absolute Nonsense!
We must become a manufacturing nation again with more advanced technology that the opposition or be condemned to becoming a third world nation.
Only through trade can we earn a living long term, the rest is Fantasy.

Globalisation isn't only (or even mainly) about technology, manufacturing and production. economic freedom and free trade are ends in themselves - it can, arguably, produce higher levels of overall material wealth worldwide and the spread of liberty (and capitalism). An inward looking Britain trying to become self sufficient is a massively retrograde step, out of tune with a world that's heading the opposite way. Renault's beef with brexit was about trade barriers. so, you envisage an automated manufacturing plant producing toothpaste for the same cost of a replica of it in Vietnam? I don't think so, the same quality staff, same quality professionals, but a currency that's 27000 times cheaper (and, in dollar terms labour and manufacturing that is too). what then, a Britain that imitates putin's Russia and in some misguided fit of patriotism produces all its own stuff for much more (in dollars)?
i'm an immigrant. I feel it's entirely not my business that the British economy has invested so much in financial services. perhaps it could have, as part of the eu, developed a different kind of developed economic infrastructure. but to start competing with india and china as manufacturing hubs of the world would be a mistake, to put it politely.

 

[oldgroaner]

Globalisation isn't only (or even mainly) about technology, manufacturing and production. economic freedom and free trade are ends in themselves - it can, arguably, produce higher levels of overall material wealth worldwide and the spread of liberty (and capitalism). An inward looking Britain trying to become self sufficient is a massively retrograde step, out of tune with a world that's heading the opposite way. Renault's beef with brexit was about trade barriers. so, you envisage an automated manufacturing plant producing toothpaste for the same cost of a replica of it in Vietnam? I don't think so, the same quality staff, same quality professionals, but a currency that's 27000 times cheaper (and, in dollar terms labour and manufacturing that is too). what then, a Britain that imitates putin's Russia and in some misguided fit of patriotism produces all its own stuff for much more (in dollars)?
i'm an immigrant. I feel it's entirely not my business that the British economy has invested so much in financial services. perhaps it could have, as part of the eu, developed a different kind of developed economic infrastructure. but to start competing with india and china as manufacturing hubs of the world would be a mistake, to put it politely.

The choice of Toothpaste is rather interesting as Companies like Church and Dwight have a large automated factory in Folkestone..
How are they making a living if what you say holds true?

I am not suggesting for a moment that we go back to being self sufficient, only that if we must, there is only one way to do it.
Automated Manufacturing would be that one way.
And with it we can compete with Anyone and Everyone.
It recognises no barriers.

 

[flecc]

to start competing with india and china as manufacturing hubs of the world would be a mistake, to put it politely.

But we can be a manufacturing centre for the EU, if we stay in at least. Nissan, Toyota and Honda, Vauxhall-Peugeot vans and Ford diesel engines have shown that.

Since Nissan's most successful model world wide is wholly British designed and developed, we could have been doing it for ourselves rather than a foreign company. So it's for this sort of reason that I still think we'll fail outside of the EU, our long shown inability to take advantage of what we can do well.
.

 

[Kudoscycles]

Nissan.....it may be that May and Co have no intention for us to leave the EU,that is why she can underwrite Nissans tariff costs,because she knows there can never be any tariff if we don't leave.
KudosDave

 

[derf]

The choice of Toothpaste is rather interesting as Companies like Church and Dwight have a large automated factory in Folkestone..
How are they making a living if what you say holds true?

I am not suggesting for a moment that we go back to being self sufficient, only that if we must, there is only one way to do it.
Automated Manufacturing would be that one way.
And with it we can compete with Anyone and Everyone.
It recognises no barriers.

Fine,but why have "if we must go back to being self sufficient" as a premise at all? Or make national boundaries s defining issue? Its the wrong premise and a backwards basis for planning things. If i have toi could dig a fallout shelter and grow my own potatoes. But happilly living in an open integrating society (france) i dont have to or plsn to and,my god,what a waste of life it would be

 

[Kudoscycles]

Mark Garnier,international trade minister,has been speaking some home truths about Brexit.....he says...
Banks will lose passporting rights after Brexit and equivalence won't replace that,it won't work for banks.
Rising prices are going to happen and there's nothing we can do about that.
Everyone in the cabinet knows that 'Brexit means Brexit' is intentionally vague and meaningless
Brexit will cause a slump in sterling but that was predicted.

He was slapped down by Commissar May as a traitor,how long before he is sent of to the Gulag for 'retraining',hehe
KudosDave