This 'plan' has been created by idiots and is both unworkable and unsupportable.
The only part that baffles is that our less than gifted 'Brexit' negotiators think that they will get away with it - that people won't notice the stupidity of it.
Tom
Brexit, for once some facts.
- Thread starter flecc
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The only part that baffles is that our less than gifted 'Brexit' negotiators think that they will get away with it - that people won't notice the stupidity of it.
Tom
Once again, external influences illustrate the kind of friends this fascist government of ours support. These pics and links describe those friends:
it-seems-something-good-has-come-from-the-charlottesville-violence
Tom
it-seems-something-good-has-come-from-the-charlottesville-violence
Tom
there is nothing wrong to state the objectives in order to establish consensus among the UK voters and set out the parameters for negotiation.
How much of it will be achieved in subsequent negotiation is less important than us agreeing with each others.
What remainers should worry about is the hard brexiters pushing us toward the middle of the Atlantic, not when ordinary brexiters want out of the EU and yet, stay very close.
You`re not wrong there Dan, and unfortunately your own local beaches featured prominently in that
https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2014/may/10/disappeared-ira-troubles-northern-ireland
What KTM is alluding to is correct, the `border` or lack of will now become a smugglers paradise.
I can safely say right at this moment republicans from the border counties especially south armagh and louth are welcoming back the good old days, they have a life-time of experience and it won`t be a two-bit operation either, moving through a 40ft container full of e-bikes will be childs play!
Roll-up, Roll-up!
Thats a degree from the University of the Bloody Obvious,but reality must sink in at some point.
KudosDave
None of what you say is agreed,it has been suggested by May and Co,but it hasnt been put to parliament and more importantly it hasnt been agreed with the EU...they havent offered visa free travel,the expats in Europe do not yet know their medical situation and freedom of movement elsewhere in Europe,the EU have not yet said we can use their standards (CE),the government have said that EU citizens can come to the UK to live but not work,so if they need emergency care are we going to turn them away from our hospitals?,the Irish border solution is so vague (do you understand what they intend,I dont) ,the EU will reject anything which leaves a weak spot for tariff controls....this isnt a weak spot, its 300 miles long.
And nobody wants to talk about the divorce bill because the UK hasnt got any money and the Farage/Rees-Moggs dont want to give them any,so thats a problem that is being forgotten about.
So where do you get 'the agreed policies'....I think the negotiations are moving apart,there are no agreed policies. I can see no commonsense from this government,as Juncker said its all 'fantasy'.
Brexit is going to end up with no deal and then we need to hope that the EU let us stay,but on their terms...I suspect some Brexiters will throw their toys about,when they dont get what they wanted, but we all have to be grown up and live with that.
KudosDave
Tommie,it wont become a smugglers paradise,because the EU wont let it,they will say if you want to leave you have to have customs controls between the UK and EU.
If you look at the efforts the EU have gone to,to prevent tariff evading bike smuggling,this is normal bikes,not e-bikes...originally it was only China,then they stopped Malaysia,then they stopped the Phillipines and Indonesia....now you have to ship to Tunisia in bits and assemble there before shipping into Italy,there are strict controls on local labour content percentages.
All that took a lot of effort and policing,can you imagine the EU is going to allow a 300 mile long gap ,with no border,that will allow bikes to be shipped into N.I. tariff free and then shipped across the 'no border' border,and relatively on their doorstep,no way!!!
If we insist on no border then the EU will look at the UK as a satellite of Asia (especially China) and put a line down the middle of the English Channel,across the Irish Sea and between North and South Ireland,any goods that cross that line will pay tariffs...these tariffs are sometimes heavy,maybe 55%,they will also affect goods which are made in N.I.,unless we negotiate the qualifying local percentages,which could take many years.
We think the EU are stupid,they are not,they have been at this game for many years,it is us who are stupid putting ourselves in this position,Cameron/Gove and Boris should all be tried for treason.
KudosDave
Ireland votes to rejoin the UK....why would Ireland want to join with the UK when we cannot even agree amongst the already devolved nations,Ireland would add a whole new set of problems.
Maybe N.I. uniting with Ireland but that would start all the old nationalist problems,that would surely be worse than a hard border?
Be interesting how our 'inteligent' government come up with a solution????
KudosDave
If they can come and live here, their hospital bills are picked up by their respective government, like ours do if we retire in an EU state.
Agreed - as in current position papers.
Those positions are generally agreed with parliament.
then there would be GE because the majority of parliament is already on the side of no deal = worst outcome.
Woosh....you really havent been reading the news,the UK and EU currently refuse to allow reciprocal medical rights,the end of the E111 form,that is why old expats living in Spain are so worried and may be forced to return to the UK...they are in a difficult position,they cant afford to come back because their spanish property wont buy a garden shed here, but they also cannot afford to have private medical insurance in Spain because of the high cost....the weakness of their pension pot in pounds changed into Euros makes it worse.
And yet Cameron wouldnt let them vote in the referendum,the one group of people who were most affected.
I am surprised you didnt realise this.
KudosDave
You really must do some homework,parliament have not agreed those position papers,they are by their name 'position papers',a sort of wishlist by our government,once the negotiations are complete parliament votes on the outcome,which probably wont look anything like those position papers,by the time the EU have started to unpick them.
Better to look at the EU position papers because thats what we are going to end up with....note how we compromise(cave in?) on every aspect of the negotiations and the EU havent moved an inch,or should that be a mm,hehe!!!
KudosDave
.. yep we agree on that also. I will willingly agree that the majority of the smuggler dynasties are south of the border. Those lovely Dallas style mansions didn't build themselves.
I know people who live in the EU without a job are covered by our health budget and it is our current position that they should be able to remain there. The European health system is wider than the EU, covering the EEA and EFTA countries. If we opt to remain as EFTA member, there won't be any change.
So why isn't it suicidal to upset those who hate the idea?
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I do lots of business with the Irish,lovely people,north or south of the border,great fun but you count your fingers after shaking hands,they act like they can't but they can add up!!!!
KudosDave
there is no obvious objection from the EU if we wish to retain membership of EEA or EFTA. It's a rubber stamp job because they can't stop us.