Brexit, for once some facts.

[oldgroaner]

No, If I where you Id stick with labour. The qualifications are lower and getting lower by the day

Their Shadow cabinet must now be on its 3rd iteration at least, I suppose you would call that a Shadow of the Shadow cabinet, some of the latest lot can hardly string two words together. BUT dont worry they have the full backing of the unions and generally left wing fringe groups, not so sure about the working classes any more so not a chance in Hell that they will get elected in the near future.
Perhaps thats why you guys protest about UK democracy so much, you cant get elected so perpetual protest is all you can do.
You could allways look back to good old days when we were more like France!!!

Crikey, then you should be watching for an invitation to join then Brendan if they are that hard up, by the way was this one of those "opportunities" you were maundering about?
Good career opportunity there for you!

 

[flecc]

the French even helped Argentina out, supplying Exocet pre embargo , but then a team of experts/technicians to launch them AFTER the embargo.

Nitpicking, but I trust you meant commission the missiles.

The four Exocets used were launched in the air from Super Etendard aircraft by Argentinian pilots using their on-board radar at 12 miles range.

Of course as with so many things, EU nations retained sovereignty in relation to the Falklands conflict. The positions of the UK and France were independent and the French were entitled to complete their contractual obligations to the Argentinians. The embargo was on supply.
.

 

[oldgroaner]

Who are France and Germany going to blame in the future when things go wrong now that we have left?

http://static.presspublica.pl/red/rp/pdf/DokumentUE.pdf

Well they certainly haven't blamed us in that publication have they? so what exactly is your point?

 

[derf]

Actually no I dont, but on this thread there seems to be some stereotypes that have emerged.
The referendum was nothing to do with party politics and the division was clearly evident in all parties.
The Tory party as a whole was for IN, but argued to complete distractiion on the economic arguements, no surprises there then, but the electorates disbelieved there over stated cases and voted against
The Labour party strangely harped on about the benefits fort working people and appeared more comfortable in Europe which is rather left leaning still. But dramatically demonstrated there out of touch with there own supporters, the working classes who I believe yet again were voting against the labour party as much as the goverment line.
So you are right its not about party politics but the story is non the less revealing and the politicians finally have to wake up to it, ie Get over the result and get on with delivering it

the story is revealing: of voters and politicians who project their own failure onto immigrants. so they do not deal with their own lack of productivity, achievement - and get rid of that part of the state/economy that was supporting them. this isn't about the debates during the referendum, it's about the values that allowed the country's voters to be manipulated by Farage and Boris. if you think they (or thos who voted for brexit) will do anything remotely approaching "delivering" you are in for a very rude surprise indeed.

 

[oldgroaner]

Correct

You and I are in agreement then, for there doesn't seem to be any way we can do that, and I wish there was!

 

[shemozzle999]

Well they certainly haven't blamed us in that publication have they? so what exactly is your point?

Just providing a link to the document referred to into the Daily Express you mentioned in an earlier post - i thought it might be helpful for you to actually read it before making comments.

 

[(NoLongerRegistered#15675)]

Nitpicking, but I trust you meant commission the missiles.

The four Exocets used were launched in the air from Super Etendard aircraft by Argentinian pilots using their on-board radar at 12 miles range.

Of course as with so many things, EU nations retained sovereignty in relation to the Falklands conflict. The positions of the UK and France were independent and the French were entitled to complete their contractual obligations to the Argentinians. The embargo was on supply.
.

Nope it was launch. The aircraft and missiles had infact been purchased and supplied before Invasion. However, the argentinians found it impossible to launch, all attempts ended in failure or were aborted . These problems were overcome by a French team actually during the conflict.. It has only come to light recently but was subject of topic on R4 a little while ago. Its on internet somewhere...not hard to find. ( Article also shows USA in rather a poorer light as well. They initially supported Junta !)

 

[BrendanJ]

the story is revealing: of voters and politicians who project their own failure onto immigrants. so they do not deal with their own lack of productivity, achievement - and get rid of that part of the state/economy that was supporting them. this isn't about the debates during the referendum, it's about the values that allowed the country's voters to be manipulated by Farage and Boris. if you think they (or thos who voted for brexit) will do anything remotely approaching "delivering" you are in for a very rude surprise indeed.

There you go, throwing stones at Farage and Borris. It is the Government that has to deliver. Farage is not part of that and UKIP only have 1 MP so that is simply a distraction. Borris like him or loathe him at least he got a result.
And it is still up to the Conservative party to decide who them want as PM, it may not be him.
On the subject of Immigrants, lets be clear with the exception of UKIP and Farage most reasonable statements were about Uncontrolled immigration, not about the immigrants themselves., and more to the point it is about the impact on services that that uncontrol has caused, ie EU Rules
Unfortunately you miss the key point about this campaign. It was not an election of parties with singly party lines and policies, and the out campaign had many different factions and views that could not be silenced or seperated so you tar them all with the same brush. Which frankly I expect you already probably know but your comments are just the usual self serving type

 

[tillson]

a small xenophobic little island of self-evidently inbred intellectually impaired (to put it very mildly) voters who have completely rogered themselves economically (probably for the next fifty years) because they blamed a few immigrants for their own un-industrious, unenlightened self interest and laziness. Yes, even without brexit, the UK would have had problems with its fat, unproductive, benefit cheating, entitled day time tv watching, thick native population. Brexit was really just the icing on the cake, the logical conclusion to that.

The belief that all members of each race possess characteristics, abilities, or qualities specific to that race, especially so as to distinguish it as inferior or superior to another race or races.

The words in the above paragraph define the term racism. Can you spot any similarities between what you have said and that definition? I can.

 

[derf]

There you go, throwing stones at Farage and Borris. It is the Government that has to deliver. Farage is not part of that and UKIP only have 1 MP so that is simply a distraction. Borris like him or loathe him at least he got a result.
And it is still up to the Conservative party to decide who them want as PM, it may not be him.
On the subject of Immigrants, lets be clear with the exception of UKIP and Farage most reasonable statements were about Uncontrolled immigration, not about the immigrants themselves., and more to the point it is about the impact on services that that uncontrol has caused, ie EU Rules
Unfortunately you miss the key point about this campaign. It was not an election of parties with singly party lines and policies, and the out campaign had many different factions and views that could not be silenced or seperated so you tar them all with the same brush. Which frankly I expect you already probably know but your comments are just the usual self serving type

no, I'm not throwing stones at farage or Johnson (they are not worth it). there you go still talking party politics. I'm well aware that the both in and out contained tory and labour supporters. this isn't about party politics. it is about the values underpinning the brexit movement. Farage's statements were often about immigrants themselves, and very derogatory. you google it. My criticism is of the values underpinning brexit generally. brexit voters and politicans focussed on immigration as part of blaming immigrants for their own lack of achievement, their own failure to deliver, for themselves and others. When you say "the government has to deliver" I frankly get the impression you come from a similar entitled place. This is the reason the UK did not choose a more pro-active meaningful role in the EU and world, and it will pay for this.

 

[derf]

The belief that all members of each race possess characteristics, abilities, or qualities specific to that race, especially so as to distinguish it as inferior or superior to another race or races.

The words in the above paragraph define the term racism. Can you spot any similarities between what you have said and that definition? I can.

who on earth mentioned race (other than you)?

 

[derf]

who on earth mentioned race (other than you)?

see I can do a tillson too ;>)

 

[derf]

see I can do a tillson too ;>)

which frankly doesn't help much, given that were all about to experience something worse than 2008..

 

[BrendanJ]

no, I'm not throwing stones at farage or Johnson (they are not worth it).My criticism is of the values underpinning brexit generally. brexit voters and politicans focussed on immigration as part of blaming immigrants for their own lack of achievement, their own failure to deliver, for themselves and others.

I just don't get you on this. You seem to be seeing what you expect to see. Blaming Immigrants, what politicians have made such statements
You expect every time someone mentions the word immigration to see racism, which is not at all what anyone has been saying. In that sense you are distorting the facts, perhaps even in your own head

Just usual Campaign of fear that you have swallowed hook line and sinker.

 

[tillson]

who on earth mentioned race (other than you)?

Err...you! "little island of self-evidently inbred intellectually impaired"

Unacceptable.

 

[flecc]

Nope it was launch. The aircraft and missiles had infact been purchased and supplied before Invasion. However, the argentinians found it impossible to launch, all attempts ended in failure or were aborted . These problems were overcome by a French team actually during the conflict.. It has only come to light recently but was subject of topic on R4 a little while ago. Its on internet somewhere...not hard to find. ( Article also shows USA in rather a poorer light as well. They initially supported Junta !)

No they were not launched by the French. They repaired and commissioned the missiles but the Super Etendards were only flown by Argentinian pilots who launched the missiles using their radars as I posted.

These are usually air launched missiles. One that was fired at HMS Glamorgan from an improvised land base was fired by Argentinian navy technicians.

Here's the link to the BBC story.
.

 

[oldgroaner]

Just providing a link to the document referred to into the Daily Express you mentioned in an earlier post - i thought it might be helpful for you to actually read it before making comments.

Have you you read a different one?

Sent from my XT1032 using Tapatalk

 

[derf]

Err...you! "little island of self-evidently inbred intellectually impaired"

Unacceptable.

other than the fact that race is a hypothetical construct without basis in fact, this particular little island (that has just done the equivalent of put its head in a crocodiles mouth, voluntarily, without any reason, whatsoever), consists of - arguably - very many "races"

 

[derf]

I just don't get you on this. You seem to be seeing what you expect to see. Blaming Immigrants, what politicians have made such statements
You expect every time someone mentions the word immigration to see racism, which is not at all what anyone has been saying. In that sense you are distorting the facts, perhaps even in your own head

Just usual Campaign of fear that you have swallowed hook line and sinker.

no - Brendan this my final attempt to get through to you: I'm not trying to frighten anyone and I don't really take much interest in what bacteria like farage utter. I don't really take much interest in race or immigration. there is a very, very large lump of **** coming our way. And its about to hit a very big fan. I wish I wasn't here. I take not pleasure from it. Mainly I wish I had spent the past ten years in France and not here.

 

[BrendanJ]

no - Brendan this my final attempt to get through to you: I'm not trying to frighten anyone and I don't really take much interest in what bacteria like farage utter. I don't really take much interest in race or immigration. there is a very, very large lump of **** coming our way. And its about to hit a very big fan. I wish I wasn't here. I take not pleasure from it. Mainly I wish I had spent the past ten years in France and not here.

Impossible to understand you, just does not relate to my post, and you just re-iterate your prejudice and obvious dislike of Farage (Oh I get that one!)
Get over it