Brexit, for once some facts.

[flecc]

You are getting far too complicated again. If the prisoner is isolated and confined to a whitewashed cell measuring 2m x 2m and remains there 24 hours per day, they can’t commit crime.

You wouldn't be able to do that and still be a respected member of the international establishment. Long term isolation is rightly almost universally condemned.

There's also inconvenient matters like showers, meals, haircuts and medical treatment to be taken care of, so large numbers of prisoners would need inordinate numbers of prison wardens to individually attend to those, even more costly than our present system.

And wardens are corruptible, how do you think many of the phones and drugs get in?
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[50Hertz]

You wouldn't be able to do that and still be a respected member of the international establishment. Long term isolation is rightly almost universally condemned.

Again, the solution is delightfully simple. Behave and don’t harm others or their property. If they fulfil that requirement, they can come out the cell. If they misbehave, back in you go for twice as long. The choice is entirely in the hands of the individuals concerned.

Showers could be by way if sprinkler systems in the cell. Prison staff can be cut by a factor of 10 if everyone is in solitary.

I know prison staff take drugs and phones into prisons and sell them to the inmates. If they are caught, they could share a cell with “Susan” I doubt anyone else would want to embark on that enterprise again after that experience.

 

[jonathan.agnew]

Again, the solution is delightfully simple. Behave and don’t harm others or their property. If they fulfil that requirement, they can come out the cell. If they misbehave, back in you go for twice as long. The choice is entirely in the hands of the individuals concerned.

Showers could be by way if sprinkler systems in the cell. Prison staff can be cut by a factor of 10 if everyone is in solitary.

This fantasised division between criminals and non criminals is just that. A fantasy. Have you ever driven or piloted a plane while not entirely sober, or under the influence of medication? Broken the speed limit or contravened some regulation in an effort to get home to deal with an emergency? Not told the police about some form of criminal activity because there were mitigating circumstance and no one were disadvantaged? We do not live inside a puritanical prick's imaginary world where people are good or bad or right or wrong. Its all ambigous and were all guilty of crimes to varying degree. Theres alot of there but for the grace of god thats the only thing that prevents all of us from ending up through misfortune in front of a judge.

 

[Fingers]

You wouldn't be able to do that and still be a respected member of the international establishment. Long term isolation is rightly almost universally condemned.

There's also inconvenient matters like showers, meals, haircuts and medical treatment to be taken care of, so large numbers of prisoners would need inordinate numbers of prison wardens to individually attend to those, even more costly than our present system.

And wardens are corruptible, how do you think many of the phones and drugs get in?
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Bum holes.

 

[Fingers]

This fantasised division between criminals and non criminals is just that. A fantasy. Have you ever driven or piloted a plane while not entirely sober, or under the influence of medication? Broken the speed limit or contravened some regulation in an effort to get home to deal with an emergency? Not told the police about some form of criminal activity because there were mitigating circumstance and no one were disadvantaged? We do not live inside a puritanical prick's imaginary world where people are good or bad or right or wrong. Its all ambigous and were all guilty of crimes to varying degree. Theres alot of there but for the grace of god thats the only thing that prevents all of us from ending up through misfortune in front of a judge.

Nope. You’re on your own again Jonny boy.

 

[Danidl]

You’ve caught overcomplicationitis off Dannidl. Just lock ‘em up 24/7 in solitary with no visits = no drugs = no mobile phones = no crime on the outside. Job done.

As I said, a bullet in the back of the head would be more humane

 

[flecc]

Again, the solution is delightfully simple. Behave and don’t harm others or their property. If they fulfil that requirement, they can come out the cell. If they misbehave, back in you go for twice as long. The choice is entirely in the hands of the individuals concerned.

So it's not in any way solitary and they will be able to communicate and conspire with fellow inmates. No different from now.

Showers could be by way if sprinkler systems in the cell.

It isn't possible to have a bunk and bedding, toilet and shower in a 2 metre x 2 metre space.

Prison staff can be cut by a factor of 10 if everyone is in solitary.

Not so with all of them out of cells, and they will be if that's an option. Even the present staff levels are pushed to cope, if cut by a factor of ten they would barely exist.

Your notions are a non starter, internationally illegal if as originally stated, little different from now if relaxed as you've amended.

And whats the point when such treatment when tried is proven to greatly increase crime, as I've explained in other replies.
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[flecc]

Bum holes.

How does that deal with the stated showers, meals, haircuts and medical treatment?
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[oyster]

This fantasised division between criminals and non criminals is just that. A fantasy. Have you ever driven or piloted a plane while not entirely sober, or under the influence of medication? Broken the speed limit or contravened some regulation in an effort to get home to deal with an emergency? Not told the police about some form of criminal activity because there were mitigating circumstance and no one were disadvantaged? We do not live inside a puritanical prick's imaginary world where people are good or bad or right or wrong. Its all ambigous and were all guilty of crimes to varying degree. Theres alot of there but for the grace of god thats the only thing that prevents all of us from ending up through misfortune in front of a judge.

We also have issues with remand. Innocent until proved guilty... But still shut in your four square metres with no contact?

 

[flecc]

Nope. You’re on your own again Jonny boy.

Not quite, he's had two agrees so far.
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[jonathan.agnew]

Nope. You’re on your own again Jonny boy.

Are you ok old chap? Thats worryingly vapid.

 

[50Hertz]

As I said, a bullet in the back of the head would be more humane

That’s extreme and I can’t agree with your suggestion. State sponsored murder is not acceptable to me.

My solitary confinement solution places the criminal’s destiny entirely in their own hands. They can choose whether to remain in those conditions or not. That’s fair and decent.

 

[oyster]

That’s extreme and I can’t agree with your suggestion. State sponsored murder is not acceptable to me.

My solitary confinement solution places the criminal’s destiny entirely in their own hands. They can choose whether to remain in those conditions or not. That’s fair and decent.

It wasn't a suggestion. It was a statement about the inhumanity of your proposed approach.

 

[50Hertz]

And whats the point when such treatment when tried is proven to greatly increase crime, as I've explained in other replies.
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And 3 murders in London in the last 24 hours under the present system.

 

[50Hertz]

It wasn't a suggestion. It was a statement about the inhumanity of your proposed approach.

No my approach gives choice. People choose to live a life of solitary 24 hour confinement.

 

[50Hertz]

Not quite, he's had two agrees so far.
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They are just a measure of vanity.

 

[flecc]

And 3 murders in London in the last 24 hours under the present system.

Which is precisely the point of my sequence of posts, illustrating how the bad decisions of the type you and others make have inevitably led us to this. The more we keep on this course, the worse it gets, as events prove only too clearly,

Why is it you cannot grasp this obvious fact from the events?
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[Fingers]

How does that deal with the stated showers, meals, haircuts and medical treatment?
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You asked how mobile phones and drugs got into prisons.

 

[oldgroaner]

No my approach gives choice. People choose to live a life of solitary 24 hour confinement.

I'm enjoying this, it's a load of old cobblers, but keep up the good work.

 

[flecc]

You asked how mobile phones and drugs got into prisons.

In reference to wardens bringing them in, the back passage only works once on entry to prison. Thereafter it's often warden collaboration.
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