Bosch CEO's prediction

[Deleted member 25121]

Has it? Haven't you seen the new, smaller, lighter hub-drive offerings from Bafang this year? Hub drives are certainly a more mature market.

The push bike market is even more mature and then there's your ultimate, the penny farthing. WOW, just look at those lines...

 

[cyclebuddy]

so let us all see it then speakers and amps and ur setup what you have for real

My new £1100 Ebco USR55 crank-drive hybrid e-bike against (nearly) £11,000 speakers in the playroom. Oh, and the Monitor Audio Apex speaker on the wall next to the home cinema screen come in at about another £2500 for the set (I'd forgotten about those).

This isn't about "mine being bigger than yours". It's about making personal choices, as vfr400 eloquently wrote in post #6 of the recent "advice on 3 bikes" thread.

 

[danielrlee]

This isn't about "mine being bigger than yours".

If it was, you'd definitely win.

 

[Deleted member 25121]

My new £1100 Ebco USR55 crank-drive hybrid e-bike against (nearly) £11,000 speakers in the playroom.

This isn't about "mine being bigger than yours". It's about making personal choices,

Can I remind you of your first post in this thread "All the Bosch CEO is saying to me is that you'd be a fool to spend £2000/£3000/£4000+ on an electric bike"

That's hilarious, you call people fools for spending lots of money on a bike and what do you do with your speakers??? And then you say "It's about making personal choices" having called them fools.

Have you looked in a mirror recently?

Oh, and I hear that Audio Thesis are working on a replacement for your Usher CP-8871 speakers due out early next year.

 

[soundwave]

i bought my bike and speakers 2nd hand but the genelecs were part of the 5.1 system from town house studio so plenty of famous bands has used them when they was there.

Townhouse Studios - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

have been offers more than double to what i had paid for them cant say that for the bike tho

 

[cyclebuddy]

Can I remind you of your first post in this thread "All the Bosch CEO is saying to me is that you'd be a fool to spend £2000/£3000/£4000+ on an electric bike"

That's hilarious, you call people fools for spending lots of money on a bike and what do you do with your speakers??? And then you say "It's about making personal choices" having called them fools.

Have you looked in a mirror recently?

Oh, and I hear that Audio Thesis are working on a replacement for your Usher CP-8871 speakers due out early next year.

What part of "All the Bosch CEO is saying to me.." don't you understand?

Loudspeakers are a mature (developed) market and the basic principles/materials haven't really changed in decades: eg: Monitor Audio designed the Apex system in 2010 - and they still keep making them without change - you can still buy the exact same models today. On the bigger speakers, AT is an importer, not the maker. When I last spoke to the designer, his view was that there wasn't really any way to improve them, and, given this is a fairly niche market, redevelopment costs weren't justified.

Loudspeakers are a mature market. That isn't the same as an e-bike system/electronics, where there's still a lot of development potential.

have been offers more than double to what i had paid for them cant say that for the bike tho

Exactly. I've sold 10 year old "classic" amplifiers for much more than I paid too; e-bikes become obsolete and almost worthless from season to season. Is there a "classic" e-bike yet that appreciates?

 

[soundwave]

Exactly. I've sold 10 year old "classic" amplifiers for much more than I paid too; e-bikes become obsolete and almost worthless from season to season. Is there a "classic" e-bike yet that appreciates?

give it 100 years but i doubt you will ever get what you paid for it new same as computers i paid 3k each for my xeon cpus but there worth about 30 quid each today.

 

[GLJoe]

All the Bosch CEO is saying to me is that you'd be a fool to spend £2000/£3000/£4000+ on an electric bike now given their current drive systems are already obsolete and won't be worth a crap in a couple of years time once their much slimmer, lighter, more powerful motors/enhanced systems hit the market shortly.

It's exactly why I wouldn't spend much over a grand on a crank-driven e-bike until the tech has been optimised/stabilised, and there's still a good way to go if we believe the Bosch CEO in that article.

Hmmmm. Its not as if we are now in the true 'early adopters' stage. Ebikes are certainly changing, but its more of a case of refining, or entering new market segments, rather than evolving - at least in the case of the base technology.
Buy a £2-3000 Bosch powered ebike today, and its going to do pretty much the same as a similar £2-3000 Bosch powered ebike in 3 years time! (just that the new one might look a bit snazzier and more integrated)
And to be honest, most of the new 'innovations' are going to be stuff like Bluetooth connectivity and crap that lots of people aren't going to really need or want!
If you want a decent bike, just buy one now. They're out there and they're not going to get any cheaper with time!

 

[cyclebuddy]

I could see the boffins at Bosch coming up with something the size and weight of the Fazua motor in just a couple of years - but maybe with 100Nm torque and weighing under 2kg that fitted into a pretty much standard size bike frame as the Fazua does. It's weight and size loss, with more powerful, discrete in-frame batteries (again as Fazua, where the frame retains a pretty standard dimension).

If Dyson can do much the same with a vacuum cleaner motor (i.e. smaller, more powerful, more efficient, and much lighter) it can't be beyond the wit of the Germans.

 

[vfr400]

I could see the boffins at Bosch coming up with something the size and weight of the Fazua motor in just a couple of years - but maybe with 100Nm torque and weighing under 2kg that fitted into a pretty much standard size bike frame as the Fazua does. It's weight and size loss, with more powerful, discrete in-frame batteries (again as Fazua, where the frame retains a pretty standard dimension).

If Dyson can do much the same with a vacuum cleaner motor (i.e. smaller, more powerful, more efficient, and much lighter) it can't be beyond the wit of the Germans.

Remember that large companies are motivated by profit. They use marketing as a tool to convince people that their max-profit solution is the one that they need. It's competition that keeps them on their toes and forces them to make improvements. They will never change more than they have to. It's only when they can see/foresee profits going down or when they can see a chance for bigger profits that they think about changes.

 

[flecc]

Spot on, crank motors and their controllers is where the action is. Why has development of hub motors and their controllers stalled?

It's just fashion.

The first production e-bike electric motor was a hub motor from Heinzmann in 1922, followed by Philips with another hub one. They disappeared with World War 2, and after that tiny petrol motors took over the bicycle assist market until 1982, both in hub and other positions.

In the early 1080s we in England produced a couple of crank drive electric bikes, but they never sold well. E-bikes first really came to notice in 1999 with crank drive models from Giant and Yamaha which dominated from then until about 2004.

In that year hub motors began to take over the market and within a couple of years were totally dominant and the remaining two crank drives from Panansonic and Yamaha were discontinued.

A year later Panasonic were making a new crank drive motor which first showed here in Kalkhoff bikes just before we entered 2008. I gave one a very good review and they really took off and were quickly followed by other brands using that crank motor.

On the strength of that others entered the crank motor market, starting with Daum and going on to Bosch et al with China and Taiwan joining in later too with crank drives added to their hub motors.

Just give it time and I guarantee hub motors will be back. Panasonic in Japan make both, but with the majority sold being their hub motor designs.
.

 

[soundwave]

This isn't about "mine being bigger than yours". It's about making personal choices, as vfr400 eloquently wrote in post #6 of the recent "advice on 3 bikes" thread.

i just got a even bigger one