Battery upgrade advice sought

[electricorange]

I've been very much enjoying the bike I built around a Tongsheng TSDZ2 kit but I'm starting to conclude that it deserves a better battery. I've been using a Liito Kala 36V 10Ah battery which was very purchased very inexpensively (and brand new) via a random eBay seller - it was under £90 with the charger. It works well enough and I am fairly pleased with the solution I found for mounting it to the frame. However for my 17 mile (and back) hilly commute the battery is borderline inadequate. Something that would get me there and back comfortably would be much better.

Having had an issue with the charger failing I'm also nervous about reliability and stories of lithium battery fires are making me wonder whether something from a more reputable supplier is a good idea.

So I'm posting to ask advice on what and where to buy. I'm not sure whether the 10Ah quoted on the original battery is realistic, and as such I'm not sure what capacity I really need. Also I'm not sure where to buy and what type of case is best. I've looked at BMSbattery.com having seen the site mentioned elsewhere and they seem to offer good value but I have no idea what the quality is like.

Pics and more info on my build via the link below.

Help! - Battery problem

Hi all! I fairly recently built an e-bike based around the Tongsheng TSDZ2. See the link below for the build thread. https://www.retrobike.co.uk/threads/orange-p7-e-commuter.409894/ Up until a week or so ago it was going swimmingly. However following some modifications to the battery...

www.pedelecs.co.uk

 

[sjpt]

I assume by '17 mile (and back)' you mean 17 mile each way, 34 total?
360Wh is certainly marginal for a 34 mile hilly commute. I would feel uncomfortable with less than 500Wh, preferably 600. You must be pretty much exhausting that battery (and yourself?) by the end of each day.

If it's 17 miles total the battery should be adequate, assuming it really is giving the 10Ah and has not started to deteriorate.

 

[electricorange]

I assume by '17 mile (and back)' you mean 17 mile each way, 34 total?
360Wh is certainly marginal for a 34 mile hilly commute. I would feel uncomfortable with less than 500Wh, preferably 600. You must be pretty much exhausting that battery (and yourself?) by the end of each day.

If it's 17 miles total the battery should be adequate, assuming it really is giving the 10Ah and has not started to deteriorate.

Yes, the battery is more than adequate for 17 miles, but not quite up to the 34 mile round trip. To tell the truth I am not yet commuting by e-bike - I've only done a trial run and am still using my car at the moment - I'd like to change that but I'm not quite ready to put my faith in the bike for this purpose.

So what about somehing like this?

36V10AH/11.6AH/14AH Hailong-II Bottle Battery Pack Cells / Capacity SAMSUNG 3.5AH / 14AH

36V10AH/11.6AH/14AH Hailong-II Bottle Battery Pack

bmsbattery.com

 

[sjpt]

So what about somehing like this?

36V10AH/11.6AH/14AH Hailong-II Bottle Battery Pack Cells / Capacity SAMSUNG 3.5AH / 14AH

36V10AH/11.6AH/14AH Hailong-II Bottle Battery Pack

bmsbattery.com

The 14ah appears to be out of stock, and I'd still think it was marginal, especially if you plan to do the bike commute even in winter, as range tends to reduce quite a bit. Good luck with it though.

 

[vfr400]

Yes, the battery is more than adequate for 17 miles, but not quite up to the 34 mile round trip. To tell the truth I am not yet commuting by e-bike - I've only done a trial run and am still using my car at the moment - I'd like to change that but I'm not quite ready to put my faith in the bike for this purpose.

So what about somehing like this?

36V10AH/11.6AH/14AH Hailong-II Bottle Battery Pack Cells / Capacity SAMSUNG 3.5AH / 14AH

36V10AH/11.6AH/14AH Hailong-II Bottle Battery Pack

bmsbattery.com

Do you know that you have to add the shipping cost to the BMSBattery items, and that you will have to pay around £40 duty? That battery will be close to £300 altogether. BMSBattery is good to get the right kit, but not cheap when you do. Yosepower batteries on Ebay are cheaper and probably just as good as that one, if not the same. Decent quality batteries are not cheap, but if all you want is a working battery, cheap ones are OK as long as not too cheap like the one you already got, which most likely has recycled cells in it. Expect to pay at least £180 for the cheapest proper battery.

 

[wheeliepete]

This battery will work well with your setup and will give the range you require, 18 month warranty and shipped from UK, so no duty/VAT to pay. I've been inside a couple of Yosepower packs and they are well constructed. You need to add £100 for shipping from BMS + 20% VAT on total.

Pardon our interruption...

 

[electricorange]

That looks ideal, thanks. Am I missing anything or is this the same for less?

Pardon our interruption...

 

[electricorange]

Just thought I'd bump his up as I've not yet ordered anything, but my bank balance is looking rosier than it was a few months back...

...Any thoughts on the two eBay listings above? They look much the same to me...

 

[matthewslack]

Just thought I'd bump his up as I've not yet ordered anything, but my bank balance is looking rosier than it was a few months back...

...Any thoughts on the two eBay listings above? They look much the same to me...

I would buy a second charger and recharge at work each day as well as at home. That will buy you time to ride and get to know the range better before spending more money.

Put a picture of your charger and its plug up and someone here will be able to point you in the right direction.

The difference between Ebay suppliers listing the 'same' product is down to experiences with the supplier. The insides are what counts with a battery, not the words in the ebay listing - quality of the cells etc.. Forum members often have direct experience with specific suppliers. Otherwise it is quite chancy going for lowest price.

 

[guerney]

I worry about non-panasonic/samsung/sony/lg battery packs blowing up... maybe I shouldn't worry and simply bag a bargain, because there don't seem to have been any such incidents reported here by pedelecers who have bought cheap battery packs.

 

[Nealh]

Both are made for Yosepower, yose themselves we have seen have good CS from other buyers who have had to contact them.
The cells will likely be a China brand cell from on of the many manufacturers over there, some brands are slowly beginning to get a reasonable or fairly good reviews of some of the cells and are now being explored a little more now that well known branded cells are becoming scarce.
The bms is a basic type sellers using the word smart means nothing unless one can use BT/uart to check and adjust cell voltage balance/charge levels.
I would accept with a large pinch of salt though regarding the acclaimed 160km+ in eco mode use.

 

[electricorange]

I finally got around to pulling the trigger on the cheaper yosepower unit - hopefully it's no worse than the recommendation from @wheeliepete

Pardon our interruption...

Got a further 5% off with an ebay offer which made it hard to resist...

 

[egroover]

Pardon our interruption...

bit cheaper from yosepower ebay

 

[electricorange]

Oh no!

 

[electricorange]

/ thanks!

 

[wheeliepete]

I posted a thread a few days ago about Yosepower battery prices being reduced...never mind.

 

[electricorange]

Thanks guys, have cancelled and reordered. Looking forward to checking it out!

 

[electricorange]

Finally got round to fitting the Yose battery. It seems reasonably well made and a decent package overall for the money, although the mounting arrangement is flimsier than I'd like (too much plastic in the bracket) and for some reason it sits slightly off the level. The battery case is quite wide and only just clears the chain at the bottom corner.

I ended up opening up the bracket/connector and making a direct connection to the motor inside the rear part using "chocolate block" type wiring connectors - there's plenty of space to do that safely but I was disappointed to find that although the casing has a space for a cable clamp, none is included. Anyway I managed to find one that would work in my box of bits so I'm confident that the wiring is now safe and secure. The installation is pretty neat overall, I think.

Took a test ride his evening, performance is no different to the Liitokala battery but hopefully the range will be improved.

 

[it is i footpump]

Hi ihave tdz2 fitted to halfords carrera and use 10ah yospower bottle battery, i also have 17ah yospower dolphin, and enerprof 13.8ah battery pack samsung cells
I at70+. Use turbo most of the time if i do a longer ,hilly journey, i use 10ah bottle battery and enerprof in rear saddle bag.
Had no problems with yosepower kit, but the older 10ah yose gives lower range in cold weather , and improves on a hot day.

 

[electricorange]

Rode it to work on Friday, was brilliant. Didn't quite have the guts to test the battery range properly (and was mainly using higher levels of assist) so I played it safe and took my charger in to work.

I'm considering leaving a separate charger at work. I actually have a spare unit that I bought earlier with the right connections and spec, but it's an eBay cheapy similar to the one below - and I'm wondering whether it might be better in the long run to pick up something better. Is there much in it between these £10 jobs and the £25 ish ones Yose supply? Or anything better still? I've had one of the cheap ones fail before (mains socket solder joint failure) so am a little wary of them...

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