Advice on Commuter ebike

[Deleted member 4366]

Pence per mile for the same bike can be vastly different for individuals depending upon mileage.

Its my belief that most don't even consider the cost. They buy the bike and ride as little or often as they need or like. Each to their own.

More of a lifesyle choice. I don't look at how much TV costs per hour to watch, do you?

My ebike costs what it costs. I get immense enjoyment from it and there is no need to buy a pipe and slippers.

I don't think anybody would disagree with you. For some, it's a hobby, and the cost isn't important. I myself have spent more than £20,000 on Ebike stuff during the last four years, and I've done about 7-8000 miles in that time.

When you look at the title of the thread, it's relevant for Trex to draw attention to the potential high costs, and for us to debate it.

 

[SRS]

I don't think anybody would disagree with you. For some, it's a hobby, and the cost isn't important. I myself have spent more than £20,000 on Ebike stuff during the last four years, and I've done about 7-8000 miles in that time.

When you look at the title of the thread, it's relevant for Trex to draw attention to the potential high costs, and for us to debate it.

There are those who will bo looking to commute for the minimum of pennies , this forum being a great place to get the best cost saving advice possible.

In your instance, you clearly love messing (for want of a better word) with ebikes and associated technology.

If your knowledge is a result of your messing, keep it up. I for one find your posts most informing.

SRS

 

[trex]

posting nonsense like this on a public forum, doesn't do anyone any favours, and frankly I hope if we request it, it can be removed.

its dangerously inaccurate and no matter what brand you are talking about is of no help to anyone considering any eBike, because its so far off the mark.

Everybody who comtemplates replacing a car with an e-bike should read flecc's post
http://pedelecs.co.uk/forum/threads/selling-and-buying-second-hand-e-bikes.4311/

It is important because if you base your decision partly on potential savings, then you may be in for a surprise.
Essentially, Chinese commuters can just about beating bus fares on distances of 5-15 miles a day.
I have a formula to calculate depreciation based on mileage and cost of batteries here if anyone is interested.
http://pedelecs.co.uk/forum/threads/selling-and-buying-second-hand-e-bikes.4311/page-2#post-195364

 

[Croxden]

I have an spreadsheet I record my mileage each trip, when charged and how much a mile it has cost so far. It gets cheaper each time I use it. Only £30.00 per mile now.

 

[KTM Bike Industries UK]

we're just trying to say, that you simply can't say:

leonzos,
if you are cost conscious, forget the German bikes. Their running cost exceeds 50p a mile.

the figures that Trex is basing this on so vague and everyones case is different.

If he said.... the running costs can exceed over 50p a mile if you hardly use it, and give it away after 2 years. Then we'd not be taking issue with it. But he hasn't

and - KTM are not a German brand, so I'm not trying to defend our brand.

This below statement is designed to be a bit confrontational and geographically sweeping, to emphasise the problems with Trex's statement.

"The lack of market and value associated with second hand eBikes might actually be caused by the poor history of reliability and quality associated with Chinese bikes sold in the UK in the past. This is after all the reason why most traditional bike shops in the UK won't touch eBikes. Which could also be the reason why the market is such a small % of the cycle market in the UK, compared to Germany, where they sell lots of quality brands in high volumes."

If more people were riding eBikes, the second hand value would be higher, and therefore the depreciation would be less.

Also I've noticed that when I ride my eBike to work I actually save about £3.00 a day just in the food I don't need to eat to fuel my trip home!

 

[trex]

...
Also I've noticed that when I ride my eBike to work I actually save about £3.00 a day just in the food I don't need to eat to fuel my trip home!

driving to work saves you more in food.

 

[KTM Bike Industries UK]

driving to work saves you more in food.

not really, cos I drive past the local butty shop. So driving didn't save me any money, I was just getting fatter.

plus when I used to drive every day I had to be a member of a gym to get the exercise I needed. So riding a bike / eBike is saving me £40.00 a month straight away.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

"The lack of market and value associated with second hand eBikes might actually be caused by the poor history of reliability and quality associated with Chinese bikes sold in the UK in the past"

I'll give you some alternative reasons to quote, which are probably just as realistic:

The lack of market and value associated with second hand eBikes might actually be caused by the shops stocking the wrong colour bikes.

The lack of market and value associated with second hand eBikes might actually be caused by too many immigrants stealing our jobs, so nobody can afford them, especially when the non-Chinese ebikes are so expensive.

The lack of market and value associated with second hand eBikes might actually be caused by Al Quaida, who've slipped secret chemicals into our water supply that cause us to not want to exercise.

The lack of market and value associated with second hand eBikes might actually be caused by the fact that people don't think they'll make any return on their investment because they're going to be wiped out by a meteor strike next week.

Feel free to quote these statements to your boss if you don't meet your sales targets.

 

[KTM Bike Industries UK]

Feel free to quote these statements to your boss if you don't meet your sales targets.

no fear of that for two reasons... 1) I'm the boss and 2) we set the 2014 sales target for eBikes in the UK for the season back in August... (our season goes 01/09 - 31/08) we've already beaten it and its only 6 months in.

however - the thread is more about second hand bike values and depreciation, so our sales of new bike sales isn't super relevant.

however we have had good feedback from KTM customers that they like the fact that we don't clear bikes out into the UK from previous seasons and also don't do big end of season sales. This means their purchase doesn't devalue as quickly as some other brands. But we're always open to feedback about things.

 

[trex]

I can't see KTM vying for the commuter bikes market.
You just don't have the right bikes for the job.

 

[KTM Bike Industries UK]

you're perfectly entitled to that opinion Trex....

there are many who do commute on KTM eBikes, who are equally entitled to their opinion.

there is a massive variety of bikes available and choice is no bad thing for anyone.

 

[trex]

this is a good commuting bike:
http://www.50cycles.com/electric-bikes/agattu-all-rounder/agattu_i8_hs

You still need to do 1,500+ miles per annum to beat public transport on cost.

 

[KTM Bike Industries UK]

* I'm going to bite, just because I do like a good forum debate.

it must be good... they are having to discount it

however just for my understanding why do you think thats a better commuting bike than something like this:

http://www.ktm-bikes.at/bikes/e-bike.html?action=bike_details&bike_id=13&cHash=c5d3f89f600651ea7d71ed65c66e2e0e

and you can do a lot less than 1,500 miles and still beat public transport. Can you tell me how you've worked this out?

 

[Cyclezee]

* I'm going to bite, just because I do like a good forum debate.

it must be good... they are having to discount it

however just for my understanding why do you think thats a better commuting bike than something like this:

http://www.ktm-bikes.at/bikes/e-bike.html?action=bike_details&bike_id=13&cHash=c5d3f89f600651ea7d71ed65c66e2e0e

Because it's German?

 

[Electrifying Cycles]

The spec of the Kalkhoff is very similar to many Bosch powered bikes including KTM, Riese and Muller etc e.g Shimano Nexus 8 speed. The only difference is the e bike system.

In terms of public transport, living in a rural county we know only to well the benefits of e bikes as often you have no alternative if you can not drive or afford a car. In London and some other big cities that may be different but the beauty of the bike is you choose when you want to live not fit round a timetable.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

You can commute on any bike - whatever floats your boat. If you have other cycling interests, it saves having to have two bikes, but, as I've said before, if you have a reasonable length commute (10+ miles), the Ezee Torque is a difficult bike to beat. It's comfortable, stable and relaxed. The motor has masses of torque for easy hill-climbing, and of course, it's very fast (20mph cruise) if you unplug the speed restrictor, which takes less than a few minutes. It has a nice big battery so that you don't run out of power, and most important of all, a nice tall top gear for relaxed pedalling while cruising at 20mph. They also have an excellent record for reliability and durability. To me, the only way to get a better commuter is to make one yourself. Other bikes are better for other things, but the Ezee Torque is the one for commuting.

 

[KTM Bike Industries UK]

Other bikes are better for other things, but the Ezee Torque is the one for commuting.

your unwavering support for a single bike is to be commended d8veh, I'm not sure how much they are paying you

personally we'd never suggest there is one bike that is "best" for commuting, or indeed best for any single task. Everyone has different needs for even this single task.

I'm sure there are people who commute for whom that bike wouldn't be ideal, for two reasons - 1) it only comes in 1 size, and 2) it weights 60kg.

Therefore not making it ideal for commuting for everyone.

Great for some I'm sure.

But no one can say one bike is best for commuting.

 

[Cyclezee]

Hi KTM,

D8veh gets nothing from me but respect, if he has a fault is that he gets the model name incorrect, it is called the Torq, not torque, although it does have plenty of the latter.
If I may just correct the figure you quote for the weight, the actual figure is 27.2 Kg., including the 15Ah battery, not 60 Kg.
Of course if fitted an 8Ah battery and you threw away the mudguards, lights, rear carrier etc., it would of course weigh less.
Yes it only comes with one frame size, 50 cm., which may not suit all, but saddle height and handlebars are adjustable.

Oh, one final thing, Dave along with many others has actually ridden one

 

[RobF]

Here's another decent commuter from KTM.

Bigger Bosch battery, hub gears for cleanliness and low maintenance, and balloon tyres rather than a suspension fork which is better solution in some ways.

Reasonably priced at £2,150:

http://www.shop.flidistribution.co.uk/p/2014-ktm-macina-bold/ktm_bicycles_ebikes?pp=25

 

[KTM Bike Industries UK]

Hi KTM,

D8veh gets nothing from me but respect, if he has fault is that he gets the model name incorrect, it is called the Torq, not torque, although it does have plenty of the latter.
If I may just correct the figure you quote for the weight, the actual figure is 27.2 Kg., including the 15Ah battery, not 60 Kg.
Of course if fitted an 8Ah battery threw away the mudguards, lights, rear carrier etc., it would of course weigh less.
Yes it only comes with one frame size, 50 cm., which may not suit all, but saddle height and handlebars are adjustable.

Oh, one final thing, Dave along with many others has actually ridden one

hi ,

Sorry - on two counts - it appears my point has been missed again, and yes I got the weight wrong, its 60lbs, not 60kgs.

I've nothing against your bike, in fact it could be the best bike on the planet, and as you point out I've not ridden one so I can't really judge.

My point is, and I'll try and make this clear.

dave is trying to say its the best bike for commuting....

which even if it is the best bike in the world can't be true for everyone.

I'm not trying to turn this into a debate about what bikes better, because again you and I cant decide that its up to a user to decide whats best for them.

but I think to say one bike is best for everyone, for a task as broad as commuting is simply wrong of dave.

we make loads of bikes, and something like the Macina Bold comes in three frame styles (gents, ladies and full step though)... each of those frame styles comes in up to 4 frame sizes, and you'd never catch me, or find me allowing anyone who works for me, being arrogant enough to suggest the bike is best for someone, or some specific task without know A LOT more about that person and their planned useage.

I'm just taking issue with dave cos he makes lots of sweeping statements that aren't helpful.

that bike can't be right for everyone, cos no bike is!

Col

also I should point out, that for my commute... even KTM don't make the ideal bike.

I want a fully rigid cyclo cross style bike, disc brakes 700c / 29er wheels so i can switch them easily depending on conditions. Panasonic hub drive, cos I love the 400% assist, and drop road bars to give the range of positions and width to get though traffic easily.

I don't think anyone makes that bike.