2nd Hand Electric bike under £400?

[JamesW]

Have to second the recommendation for the mezzo. I've had the folder since 2007 was thinking about electrifing it but finances have changed. Commuter bag was £70 when I got it, is now about £20 on eBay. Would love emezzo, but mezzo itself is great anyway and at Paul's (morphix) prices a bargain.

 

[JamesW]

... And I thought you were the backup for if trex was too slow Dave

 

[trex]

OK, so I could keep my eye on the secondhand bikes that get resold on the Woosh website that come with warranties so that might save £100 or so.

But on the predictor wizard on the Woosh website, they recommended the Zephyr-CDN (rather than the Gale) due to the type of gradient/distance that I entered. With the greater cost of this bike and additional cost of a panner rack, this is even more financially challenging.

The Zephyr has a 36Volts 8AH Lithium battery and motor rated at 250W.

What do you think to my buying a Powerbyke Folder second hand for around £200-300 and then spending £200-250 on a replacement batttery of this type of power and capacity?

Example

https://bmsbattery.com/ebike-battery/114-36v10ah-lifepo4-battery-38120-battery-pack-with-carrier-headway-battery.html

There is a thread on this forum where someone bought that model with flat batteries and was advised on how to replace/upgrade this model.

http://www.pedelecs.co.uk/forum/threads/assistance-required-used-powabyke.13984/

a second hand bike makes sense. You soon save enough money to buy a better bike next time. Don't bother buying a new battery for it though. Most ready built bikes are optimized, upgrades are uneconomical. If the woosh predictor recommends the zephyr-CDN, it's because you have serious hills in your area, buy a second hand bike with the biggest 36V motor. Kits aren't cheaper than ready builts from woosh, without previous experience, you run a risk of not achieving your goal.

 

[trex]

If you can't find any suitable second hand, ask Hatti @ woosh for a Mono. These used to be sold for £399 and they are good on hills. They are no longer sold on the woosh website but I think they still got one, she probably can give you a good deal.
http://wooshbikes.co.uk/mono.html

 

[D8ve]

Trex
Looking at your photo. Is it hinged in the middle at the base of the seat post/crank ?
I cannot believe that that would do anything but wobble and rock. Sea sick on a bike?
It would incidentally reduce pedalling efficiency too?

 

[trex]

yes, it's suspended by a coil spring in the middle. Seasick on a bike? perhaps, especially going over speed bumps. It's a bit weird at first but you get used to it in a few minutes. Also, single speed does not help with pedalling.

 

[JamesW]

Have to second the recommendation for the mezzo. I've had the folder since 2007 was thinking about electrifing it but finances have changed. Commuter bag was £70 when I got it, is now about £20 on eBay. Would love emezzo, but mezzo itself is great anyway and at Paul's (morphix) prices a bargain.

Would like to point out that my Mezzo when new (without electrics and accessories was £700 just for the bike, so Paul is offering a VERY good deal for a folder, also a very good deal for the electrified version. If I didn't have one already I'd get one of those if I wanted a compact folder.)

 

[selrahc1992]

Trex
Looking at your photo. Is it hinged in the middle at the base of the seat post/crank ?
I cannot believe that that would do anything but wobble and rock. Sea sick on a bike?
It would incidentally reduce pedalling efficiency too?

apologies if this is a serious derailing (a break in work caused it) - but that got me thinking about efficiency - what is teh most efficient speed ot run an electric motor in a pedelec at? i came accross this:

This is actually not really true. A very basic electric motor has 100% torque through about half its operating range, and then 100% power through the rest. That's not exactly true, but it's pretty close.
Basically you start out with 100% torque and 0% power. The power climbs to 100% through approximately the first half of the revs, then the power stays constant and the torque falls off. At some point the torque falls to zero, at which point the motor can no longer spin any faster.
Very simply put, this is because torque depends on current which is limited by heat, and power depends on torque and RPM, where RPM is limited by the dielectric strength of the windings. At first you're torque-limited because pumping more current through the motor will simply melt it, and then later you're rpm/power limited because increasing the voltage will cause the windings to short out.
EDIT: here is a good diagram showing the constant-torque (red) and constant-power (blue) halves of an electric motor's performance envelope. Note that this is peak power. The green line is 100% duty power (motor continuously running) which is the power output the motor can cope with indefinitely given the expected level of cooling available. Not shown is the 100% duty torque line, but that can be derived from the power curve since power is basically torque*rpm.
However, yes, electric motors are much more suitable for cars than piston engines.

here: http://www.reddit.com/r/askscience/comments/1j5qay/why_arent_twostroke_diesel_engines_more_popular/

and it's kindof interesting - given something like teh oxydrive 350w hub motor kit - if you wanted to achieve optimum efficiency, woudl you operate at say 20mph (peak power, little torque) or more around 12 plus mph (peak torque little power)?

 

[Deleted member 4366]

Could you start a new thread, and I'll answer there rather than hijack this one? Just vopy and paste everything uou wrote here.

 

[Jowo]

a second hand bike makes sense. You soon save enough money to buy a better bike next time. Don't bother buying a new battery for it though. Most ready built bikes are optimized, upgrades are uneconomical. If the woosh predictor recommends the zephyr-CDN, it's because you have serious hills in your area, buy a second hand bike with the biggest 36V motor. Kits aren't cheaper than ready builts from woosh, without previous experience, you run a risk of not achieving your goal.

With the Powerbyke, plus new battery, it seemed to come in cheaper than a current model 2nd hand Woosh, closer to my £400 budget, though I am thinking about increasing it as I'm selling off some stuff on ebay.

I was inspired by that thread where someone planned to upgrade one of the Powerbyke shoppers (they bought it with totally flat batteries). However, I can barely change a plug so perhaps I ought to leave swapping out older batteries for new more powerful ones alone. That said, I can read a manual...

I was surprised about the results with the Woosh predictor. I've cycled my work route and it didn't seem that onerous but that's subjective judgement for you. My commute:-

One-way: 4.0 miles, return: 8 miles, outbound elevation: 36m, inbound elevation: 56m
At 10mph: outbound consumption: 45WH, inbound consumption: 45WH, return trip: 91WH
At 15mph: outbound consumption: 54WH, inbound consumption: 55WH, return trip: 109WH

 

[trex]

If you buy a second hand, most of the depreciation has already been taken by the first owner. When you come to upgrade, you don't lose much. But if you buy a new battery for it, it is going to double the cost of your second hand bike.
Before you go down the road to upgrade anything, ask yourself the question: if I can't do it myself, then how much will I have to pay someone to do it for me? Most of the time, the answer is too much.
The woosh predictor gives you also the maximum gradient on your commute. Click the button 'help me choose', it will check all the local routes for you and give you the gradient in the worst case scenario. Give us that information (the maximum gradient), we'll know better what to recommend.

 

[patpatbut]

This looks good for your second hand?
Only £150

http://pages.ebay.com/link/?nav=item.view&alt=web&id=121560464963

 

[Nealh]

Sounds and looks in v.good condition, would be a good choice and nice looking folder for an intro in to ebiking plus Woosh are well established and good with cust svc's. Brakes are easy to adjust or replace/upgrade as well as chains, of course the same gamble is there about the battery life however£205 gets you a new one.
Ready to go mudguards /lights, rear rack and bell, comfy looking saddle.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

Looks like someone just bought that Woosh. I hope they realise that it's Newcastle under Lyme, not Newcastle upon Tyne

 

[Nealh]

Wonder if it was someone on here ? I was tempted my self as the Mrs. could have used it as well.

 

[Jowo]

Looks like someone just bought that Woosh. I hope they realise that it's Newcastle under Lyme, not Newcastle upon Tyne

1. It was me.
2. No, I didn't - that's an extra 100 miles to travel due to my stupidity...

 

[patpatbut]

1. It was me.
2. No, I didn't - that's an extra 100 miles to travel due to my stupidity...

At least I helped to find you this good deal

Pat

 

[Jowo]

My geography is fine. I blame the mistake on a hasty purchase made with a mobile phone...

Thanks, patpatbut. Thanks all.

Will tell everyone how I get on in a few weeks time, whether it copes with the terrain or whether I bought a beat up bike with a flat battery whose repairs exceed the cost of buying a new bike, such is the risk of buying unseen.

Fingers crossed it will be a good first bike to fit my moderate budget. I can see how I get on for a few months when the the Bike to Work scheme might get resurrected.

My next bike may well be a Mezzo for the lighter body. If I win the lottery, it will be a Brompton titanium with Heinzmann kit (the chauffeur will put it in the boot of the car and drive me to the countryside..).

 

[JamesW]

... If I win the lottery, it will be a Brompton titanium with Heinzmann kit (the chauffeur will put it in the boot of the car and drive me to the countryside..).

Nah you just need to persuade KTM to build a e-tandem MTB and pay EddiePJ to sit on the back for you. Then you don't need a chauffeur!

 

[Deleted member 4366]

You still got a bargain. 100 miles is about £20. Do you have someone to repair the spokes. You can't ride it like that despite what it says in the listing.