2017 KTM Fogo 271

[EddiePJ]

2017 KTM Fogo 271​

I have long had a passion for hardtail mtb’s be them analogue or pedal assist, and have found the eMTB version through ownership of the superb KTM Macina Race, to make the perfect bike for wet weather/winter use.

With the Macina Race now sold, it is time to introduce the replacement bike, a KTM Fogo 271

I decided a long time ago that whatever the next bike was going to be, that it needed to be 27.5” Plus size, and just as the Macina Race, it also needed to have a good component specification. I was also keen to stay with both the KTM marque and Bosch drive unit system.

As things stand the KTM Fogo 271 exceeds my requirements by a significant margin, so I am more than happy with my choice.

The Magura Boltron T-20x110 front forks is an interesting one for me, as I have read so many reports both good and bad, which made me keen to own a bike that had them fitted, just so that I could come to my own conclusion about them. I have also previously been asked privately about the forks and what I knew about them, so at least I finally get to discover for myself, and can offer opinion accordingly, and not just based from hearsay. I shall post more about the front forks as time passes, but from handling them off the bike, and checking them over thoroughly, it is a promising start. Clearly performance in use and durability are key, so time will tell, but from research that I have completed, I have already worked out that poor set up from end users, plays a major role in reported seal failure.

My preferred choice of front mudguard has long been the Rapid Racer Neoguard, (thanks guys) but after discussion, there are currently no plans to introduce a guard for USD front forks. There is no way that I could bring myself to install a guard that utilizes the steerer tube, and with that in mind I already have my own neoprene design waiting to fit to the bike.

The full bike/component specifications are detailed below, but as things stand, there is very little that I intend to change. I shall be replacing Intuvia with Purion, fit a Ragley Tracker saddle, Ritchey Foam grips, a 70mm Easton stem, and change what I believe to be a KS LEV Integra dropper post, in favour of a Rockshox Reverb Stealth. These four listed items are just personal preference and nothing more. The dropper post is simply being changed as I have one that I removed from the Macina Race, so the rebadged KS can be squirreled away.

I have chosen 27.5” Plus for a very specific reason, but just as with the front forks, I shall detail how things work out, as time passes. Briefly though, as many will be aware, I ride throughout the year and in all conditions. I treat my bikes very much as tool to do a job, and to date KTM bikes have filled this role very well, but with slight limitation. I now want to go one stage further and 27.5” plus is going to enable this. The plus size will fulfill the role of providing superb low-pressure grip in respect of riding wooded knarly terrain and also over rocks etc, then come the winter months, I intend to drop the tyre size down to 2.25-2.3 to optimize rear chain stay clearance. Running 2.25 for example, will give me a full 27mm of clearance all round, so close to zero issue of potential mud/leaf build up.

Having received the bike today, I cannot yet add ride specific details and data, but as with any bike that I receive, the first job is to strip the bike down to the component stages, then re assemble studying parts and construction as I go. By doing so I gain a greater insight into the construction of a bike, and can see what if anything in my opinion could or should be changed. Also, if anything fails whilst riding, having already stripped and rebuilt the bike, I have a head start on how to repair things. I get as much pleasure from working on bikes, as I do riding them.

This is where it gets interesting for me, as after having pulled the bike down, I am already very impressed by the frame. The build quality and paint finish is superb, but it is what is behind all that, that I am interested in. The shape and tube sizing has been improved, and just turning the first screw to remove the motor covers, revealed the first thought out design feature. A small banana shaped cover which when removed, gives clear and easy access to main connectors of the Bosch CX drive unit. That in itself was a simple, but welcome change. KTM have also now chosen to use an additional two motor mounting points. This again impressed me, not because the standard three wasn’t enough, but more from the potential that it may prevent any motor creaking, as the loading on the mounts is now more equal.

Turning the frame upside down gave the biggest and most pleasant surprise from the point of view of working on a bike. KTM have chosen to redesign the cable routing and internal cast mounts to the frame. Routing cables, wiring, hydraulic brake and dropper post hose, is now effortlessly easy and simple to do. I’m very impressed that such R&D has been put into this side of things, but I guess that it must save valuable seconds during the factory assembly stage. Speaking of cable and hose routing, I was also pleased to note that the frame entry points for routing, are now fractionally larger as well. A lot of thought has gone into the production of this frame.

Removal of the two tyres was next on the list, and it was yet another pleasant surprise to see that the rims are tubeless ready, not just compatible. That’ll save a bit of time and money when setting them up to run tubeless. Once the wheel set has been returned from a friend’s bike shop, after giving them to him to check and adjust spoke tension should it be required, it’ll then just be a simple job to install Stans valves and Effetto Mariposa CaffeLatex sealant. A sealant that I have no hesitation in using or recommending.

Whilst in its knock down stage, I decided to take advantage of the situation, and fitted an AMS XL Honeycomb frame guard kit. It seemed silly to pass up the opportunity to test a kit, so time will tell as to how effective that it is. It was certainly easy enough to apply, although the frame colour doesn’t really mask any slight air bubbles very well. I have also added 3M clear film to several areas of the frame as well.

Finally, the lad that purchased the Macina Race hardtail has indicated that he wants to start to ride off road as well, so that being the case, I should be able to format some interesting bike comparisons.

As well as regular updates to this forum, further updates and photographs will be posted at the following places.

https://www.facebook.com/groups/313908402329634/permalink/451984891855317/

https://www.facebook.com/edwardpeterjefferies/posts/474559259568509

https://www.instagram.com/eddiejefferies/?hl=en

Thanks to KTM Bike Industries, The Little Bike Shop, Bikegoo, Effetto Mariposa, Fork Juice, and Magicshine UK.

Full component specification​

• 2017 KTM Macina Fogo 271 8s EX1
• Frame :- Macina MTB 27.5"+ BOOST, Alloy for Bosch, with semi-integrated battery
• Frame sizes :- 43cm, 48cm and 53cm.
• Bike colour :- Matt light grey, black + toxic orange.
• Front fork :- MAGURA Boltron inverted, T-20x110 120mm travel, weight 2,200g
• Headset :- KTM Team B303AM drop/in-tapered, +10
• Headset bearing numbers :- MH-P28 and MH-P08M
• Stem :- KTM Team KT-6 7° 95mm Weight 133g
• Handlebar :- KTM Team HB-RB12L riser, rise 15°, Width 720mm
• Handlebar grips :- KTM Team VLG--775-12D2 Diamond fin with end Clamps
• Brake rotors :- Shimano RT86 6-bolt, 180mm front, 180mm rear. 260.4g pr
• Brakes :- Shimano Deore XT M8000 Weight 554g pr including caliper/hose/lever assembly
• Trigger shifter :- SRAM SL EX1 8speed Weight 122g
• Rear derailleur :- SRAM RD EX1 8speed. Weight 289g
• Front sprocket size as supplied 16T
• Cassette :- SRAM XG899 11-48 ( 11, 13, 15, 18, 24, 32, 40, 48) Weight 360g
• Chain :- SRAM EX1 Weight 273g
• Pedal cranks :- SRAM EX1, ISIS for Bosch. Length 170mm. Weight 510g pr
• Pedals :- VP components VP-539 black platform, with replaceable pins. Weight 370g pr
• Wheel set :- KTM Line 27-5" plus B/B Tubeless ready
• Wheel rims :- Ryder edge 35, 32 spoke hole, suitable for 2.3 to ‘plus’ size of 3.0. Weight 580g
• Front hub :- 20mmThrough axle DT Swiss 350 classic-6-bolt 20/110/TA BOOST. Weight 239g
• Rear hub :- 12mm Through axle DT Swiss 350 classic-6-bolt 12/148/TA BOOST. Weight 305g
• Tyres :- Schwalbe Nobby Nic 70-584 TL-easy, Snake skin, Apex. Weight 910g per tyre.
• Saddle :- Fizik Gobi M7 with Manganese rails. Weight 255g
• Seat post :- KTM Comp JD-YSP12L hydraulic adjustable 100-370, diameter 30.9mm Weight 560g
• Display :- Intuvia LCD, with Walk assist
• Drive unit :- Bosch Performance Line CX 36V-250W, 25km/h 75NM of torque, four assist levels,
• Eco giving 50% Tour giving 120% Sport giving 210% Turbo 300% Maximum torque available
• per assist level, Eco 40Nm Tour 50Nm Sport 60Nm Turbo 75Nm
• Battery :- Bosch Powerpack 13.8Ah - 500WH
• Motor weight :- 4kg
• Battery weight :- 2.6kg, dimensions 325mm x 92mm x 90mm
• Overall Bike weight :- 21.4kg

 

[Nealh]

Very nice, but not your usual colours.

 

[Trevormonty]

Interest to see how many miles you get out of EX1 chain. 16T chainring seems bit large for bike with 15mph cutoff, thought 15t would be better match.

Lower Unsprung weight of inverted forks should give better performance but more vunerable to dirt and damage.

 

[RobF]

Upside down forks are the work of the devil, according to the mountain biking manager of my local bike shop.

I predict Eddie will quickly lose patience with the extra maintenance and seal changing and fit a Rockshox fork.

 

[EddiePJ]

Very nice, but not your usual colours.

I know. That was another reason for opting for this bike. I fancied taking photos of something other than black.

Interest to see how many miles you get out of EX1 chain. 16T chainring seems bit large for bike with 15mph cutoff, thought 15t would be better match.

Lower Unsprung weight of inverted forks should give better performance but more vunerable to dirt and damage.

I have already been discussing the EX1 chain, or rather the whole SRAM system privately over a period time, whilst trying to gain an insight into durability, and for this reason and respect of my local riding conditions, I am going to be rotating chains on a regular basis. The bike is more of an experiment for me in respect of components, as both the groupset and forks are ebike specific. I want to be able to make my own mind up over what works or doesn't work, and whether those additional cost points are worthy. I already know a lot about the EX1 groupset including trying it briefly in the Alps, but again I want to format my own thoughts over time.
In respect of the 16t front sprocket, I don't see the issue with it. The Lycan came with the Performance motor running a 15t and 11-36 set up. For UK use I found it fine, but switched to 15t and 11-42 for when riding in the Alps. In normal solo UK use, I hardly ever required the 42t other than for when using eco and riding with analogue mtb riders.
The Macina Race came with 16t and 10-42t which again was more than adequate for UK use, and used the 42t in just the same way as when riding above.
The point that you have missed is that the Performance Line motor puts out a quoted 63Nm of torque, where as the CX motor puts out a quoted 75Nm or torque. Easily enough to compensate for the difference in gear ratio.
Once again, being an experiment for me, I will inevitably play with the front sprocket size, but with a 48t rear, I really can't see UK riding conditions proving to be an issue with just the standard 16t.
After using the system in the Alps, with a 13t front sprocket, I would have no hesitation switching to that size for any future trips. The one and only limiting factor would then be traction, and certainly not gearing.

Ref the front forks, my first thoughts were identical to that of yours, but as someone pointed out to me, that opinion could be easily countered by the fact that just about every off road motorcycle has USD front forks, so at least from a damage point of view, there shouldn't be any. There also seems to be a lot of contradictions when reading about inverted front forks, so once again, I am being open minded about this, and will format facts rather than just opinion, as the winter progresses. I am certain that my riding conditions will soon show up any issues.
I would say though, that one thing that I had forgotten about them, is things such as axle sliders rotating when installing the wheel. That is a possible minus point. Funny what you don't miss and take for granted with RWU forks.

Upside down forks are the work of the devil, according to the mountain biking manager of my local bike shop.

I predict Eddie will quickly lose patience with the extra maintenance and seal changing and fit a Rockshox fork.

That again is something that I shall have to find out for my self. I used to work on GP race bikes, and have a good familiarity of fork rebuilding, both on race bikes and road bikes, to the extent that it nearly became a part time living for me, so we shall see. Straight forward maintenance aside, any issues will simply dealt with under warranty, so in some respect I shall kind of miss out on delving inside, but again from research, it would appear that most issues are due to forks that have been incorrectly set up, and or maintained. I'm not saying that you are wrong though, only that time will tell, which is part of the fun for me.

With acidic soil and powder fine sand as below, my riding conditions are going to test everything. I am never sure if the dust that settles in dry conditions, is worse that the wet grinding paste of winter conditions.

 

[Sherman]

I know. That was another reason for opting for this bike. I fancied taking photos of something other than black.

Knowing you, you will enjoy the time spent cleaning that matte paint [emoji854]

Congrats on the new bike, I'm looking forward to read ride reports.

 

[EddiePJ]

It'll certainly be interesting see how the paint finish cleans up. I'm already worrying about greasy fingerprints.

I'll have to hunt out the white gloves for this one.

 

[KTM Bike Industries UK]

Top tip for cleaning matte frame finishes.

https://www.discountedcleaningsupplies.co.uk/erase-all-sponges-abbey-pack-of-10-speawh10a?utm_source=google_shopping&gclid=EAIaIQobChMI35LPwPvW1QIVqbXtCh3ZnwFvEAQYAiABEgK8rfD_BwE

They are amazing.

 

[soundwave]

i cant believe you bought a bike with those forks where you ride lol

 

[EddiePJ]

As said above, I'm happy to judge for my self, but mine don't twist as those in the clip are doing.

I assume that is a cycle shop, and that the bike is in repair, so without actually being there to see what is causing the twist, I'm making no judgement. From working on countless inverted forks, I can guess what has happened to them though, and unless someone has delved into them before, that wouldn't, or is highly unlikely to happen from factory.
Type in Fox forks creaking, banging, clunking or blown into Youtube, and plenty come up. It is just a matter of perspective.

Only time will tell, but I'm remaining open minded about them.

 

[Paul smith]

gosh..how can you take it apart like that?..id **** myself...I,d be ok taking it apart..it,s the putting back together thing....you had a peddle yet eddie?

 

[EddiePJ]

Hi Paul, it's only nuts and bolts.

Sadly work has been manic over the last week for both myself and my bike shop owning friend, so I haven't had time to pop into the shop for the wheels, and he hasn't had time to check them for me yet. The aim is to collect them this coming Monday, but I'm in no rush.
I'm also still waiting on the Purion display to arrive, and don't really want to have to put the motor and Intuvia back on the bike, just to have to pull it back down again. Something else for me to chase up on Monday.

On the plus side, it has given me the chance to strip, rebuild, and fit the Stealth Reverb seat post. I was pretty shocked at the state of the oil within it, so a note to myself it to adhere to the manufacturers rebuild time, well perhaps not at every 50hrs, but I don't mind carrying out a rebuild at least a couple of times a year. 16 months with no rebuild was definitely far too long.

I do the same for my brakes a couple of times a year, so I can just programme this in as well at the same time.

The only other thing that I have done, is just to add a bit more 3M helitape, and note a further improvement to the frame. KTM have moved the frame number position to a far better and more visible place.

Beyond the above, nothing more to report.

 

[Paul smith]

...only nuts n bolts?..aye ok.....topman.

 

[EddiePJ]

I'm used to it.

I seem to have a natural ability where by I can strip something down to full component stage, leave it pieces for three years or so, and still remember where every single nut and bolt went.

Just two examples.

 

[Deere John]

Great Eddie! Now we would like to see it electrified! Would be most awesome. Tank as battery [emoji2]

Sent from my LG-H815 using Tapatalk

 

[EddiePJ]

Sambal, sadly my motorcycle ownership days are very much in the past.


The weekend finally provided a chance to get out and use the bike, with Sunday being a very short shake down ride, and then Monday providing a 50 mile ride on the South Downs.

First impressions, are that the bike is quite phenomenal, and I am very much looking forward to exploring it’s abilities as time passes by.

First off is the frame size. The previous KTM Macina Race hardtail and current full suspension bike, a KTM Macina Lycan GPS+ both had 21” frames, which suited my height of 5’10” perfectly. I prefer to run a frame size slightly larger. What I hadn’t taken into account this time, was the plus size tyres, which take the OD to 29” A slight woops on my part, but I can’t say that it caused me any issues, but for anyone considering plus size, bear that in mind when viewing/choosing a bike.

Other than minor adjustments yesterday, all was just as I had expected it to be today.

Climbing away from Alfriston the first thing that struck me was just how fast that the bike rolled along and climbed. The extra diameter that plus gives, seems to make a massive difference, as I can’t think what else it could be. Once on level ground, the speed was in a different league to both of the other bikes, and oddly it seemed a lot easier to pedal unassisted. All that without even using the full and available range of gears from the 11-48 cassette. For my riding at least, the 16T front sprocket is also perfect.

Sticking to the subject of tyre sizes, I was already a convert to plus size after riding a Cube eMTB in the Swiss Alps that had them fitted. I couldn’t believe just how well that they not only rolled, which came as a surprise, but also how they grip.

Riding today, reminded me of this again, and the tyres offered limpet like traction, and that was despite running a slightly higher tyre pressure range than might possibly be expected, 18psi front 22psi rear. Chosen as a starting point, after talking to other local plus size eMTB riders. I needed a starting point, and it seemed to work very well. It was actually the first time that I have ridden the chalk/flint bridleways with no concern being given towards punctures and pinch flats.

The bike rode as though it was on rails, tracking exactly where I pointed it, and never once giving concern, even when I intentionally tried to cross rut it and scrap the side walls against the ruts left by farm traffic. It was also ridiculously fast downhill, and just seem to dig into the corners and shrugged off my intentional harsh use. I always felt that the Macina Race was easy to bunny hop and get air born, but this bike seems even easier in that respect. This seems to be one very confidence inspiring, well sorted package.

Keeping contact with riders in both Austria and Germany that run Boltron front forks, I had been made aware that they have a characteristic of pulling slightly to left when braking heavily. I did notice this yesterday when riding on the road, but wasn’t once aware of it riding off road, and gave no thought to it today. It was quite obvious on road though. As said previously these forks are very much an experiment for me, but road manners aside, the first impressions are very good.

For anyone reading this who currently use a set of Boltron front forks, here is the owners manual. http://www.magura.com/media/922396/boltron_2017_en.pdf

Other than eMTB mode which I still don't like, my one and only negative to date, is not so much about the bike, but an accessory that I bought for it. I bought a neoprene battery cover and because of the semi integration, as hard as I try, the battery won’t fit with the cover on.

On a comfort note, when I first saw the Fizik Gobi M7 saddle that the bike came with, I thought "no chance" without even taking it out of the bag. I stupidly ordered the wrong colour Ragley Tracker saddle, so was then forced to use the Fizik instead. I'm now not so sure that I want to use the Ragley at all, as the Fizik is just about perfect for me.

I guess that I had better go and wash of the mix of sheep and cow poo. Nothing changes!

More photos can be found here. https://www.facebook.com/edwardpeterjefferies/

Two photos from yesterday.

And today's ride on the South Downs.

 

[Trevormonty]

What do you think of EX1 drive train?

 

[EddiePJ]

A very interesting question Trevor, and one that I was actually thinking about during the ride yesterday.

Firstly, I think that when it comes to groupsets, we all generally have a favoured manufacturer, and usually that will either be Shimano or SRAM. I’m no different, and have in the past generally favoured Shimano.

I’ll explain the reason why, before continuing in respect of the SRAM EX1 groupset.

Much of my local riding consists of following narrow trails created by deer and such like, which involves traveling through very often long grass and bracken. Clearly both of which inevitably get caught up on various components of the bike, including around the cassette and the derailleur jockey wheels.

Now this is just my own experience, but I have found that the Shimano system tends to become less clogged and less problematic. The reason being that SRAM tend to use a more open cassette and open jockey wheel design, which inevitably makes it easy for material to become trapped. The same seems to apply when conditions become very muddy, with mud and debris filling the holes, and building up.

The second reason is that I like the simplicity of Shimano Derailleurs, and have dismantled many in the past, and feel competent about doing so. The only reason in reality to take them apart is routine maintenance of the clutch, not reliability.

I haven’t used a SRAM set up long enough to delve into this aspect of maintenance, but really should ask my bike shop owning friend if I could scrounge some old SRAM derailleurs to have a play. For some reason, I feel loathe to strip my own one, as whilst I love doing so, there is a distinct lack of tutorials should I get it wrong. Info about Shimano systems can be found with no effort required.

Now to your question….

Since the EX1 system has been available, I haven’t been backwards in respect of contacting eMTB owners when I note that they are using it, to ask their thoughts. I had no idea that I would also end up owning the system, but I do enjoy research.

I had struggled with the concept of an 8 speed cassette with such a wide range of gears, and especially such a leap from 40 to 48. My brain couldn’t comprehend that this could possibly be achieved with any form of smoothness. How very wrong that I was to be concerned, as the system shifts probably smoother and easier than anything else that I have tried. I still struggle to understand how though!

My other concern was with the one shift at a time gear selection. Again, I have no idea why, but this I felt could be a slight issue when changing up through the gears quickly. Once again, I had no cause for concern, as the system didn’t feel or operate any differently to any of my other set ups. Whilst I do tend to treat my bikes as tool for a job, I do have mechanical empathy in use, so evidently I must already be using my gear systems on a one gear change at a time riding style.

My ride yesterday didn’t exactly tax me or the system, and I didn’t really find that I needed the 40t sprocket, and certainly not the 48t. I did intentionally use both a few times though, just to see and feel how things operated. Realistically, unless I am perhaps riding without pedal assist, the 48t will remain very much redundant for UK riding use. Riding in the Alps would be totally different though, and I’d love to be climbing walls with it then. My only slight reservation was that I kind of missed not having a greater selection of gears, but I'm sure that I shall get used to that.

Clearly, it is too early for me to format a proper and concise opinion, but from my first ride use, it is super smooth in operation both when shifting up and down through the range of gears, with none of the clunks that I seem to experience with other set ups. It is possibly the most precise system that I have tried.

The quality of all components of the groupset is also exceptionally good, but then it should be given the cost.

For reference purposes, here is some additional info for anyone that is interested in the EX1 eMTB specific groupset.

https://www.sram.com/sram/mountain/family/ex1#sm.001uosnxentze9o10ja1lu7kx42eo

 

[anotherkiwi]

I wish they would make one for trekking bikes with say a 44 or 46. If you have ever ridden in Navarra you would know why... That would allow a Patterson Metropolis with a 36 chainring and thus a 58 overdrive. Or with a mid drive a 36-53 road double on a 130 BCD spider.

 

[Trevormonty]

I'm currently running factory 11spd with 11-42 and 15t chainring. Have new Sunrace 11-46 and 14t waiting to be fitted, this weekend maybe. I spent most of my time climbing single tracks in eco using 36 or 42 which is wearing out because it is aluminium.
With setup should be able to spread wear between 3-4 lower gears. Hoping lower gearing give me more range for long days.