1-1-2016 Today's Change in the Law.

[anotherkiwi]

Have any trade members explained to the Chinese that a controller/LCD combo that does not have user selectable wheel size and max speed settings would be required for EN15194 approval?

While we are on it a one button trip reset, a light switch and assistance level selector are all that we need other than the on/off switch. Double button presses after waiting five seconds are getting really boring...

 

[flecc]

Are there no trade regulations requiring that items are appropriately marked and meet standards?

There is a requirement for pedelecs to be labelled with certain details, but of course that only applies if a bike is claimed to be a pedelec. In addition this labelling requirement is almost universally ignored and always has been.

Odd though it might seem, almost all e-bikes sold since 1983 have been illegal as EAPCs on the manufacturer labelling requirement alone. The same is true in the mainland EU since October 2003.

We pedelecers live in a lawless world!
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[Ruadh495]

Does that mean home-builds are actually more likely to be legal? Since the "manufacturer" can make up a label to the letter of the regulations. I believe the 2015 amendment removed the word "plate" and so a sticky label will do...

Though the sticky label the manufacturer of my kit provided reads 14.5mph. Not sure if they are the legal "manufacturer" or I am anyway. So mine has two labels. Doesn't say there can't be any other markings...

 

[anotherkiwi]

Does that mean home-builds are actually more likely to be legal? Since the "manufacturer" can make up a label to the letter of the regulations. I believe the 2015 amendment removed the word "plate" and so a sticky label will do...

Though the sticky label the manufacturer of my kit provided reads 14.5mph. Not sure if they are the legal "manufacturer" or I am anyway. So mine has two labels. Doesn't say there can't be any other markings...

No because you can go into the LCD settings and change the MAX speed and or wheel size. According to EN 15194 there has to be a way of preventing the user from doing this. "Permanently fixed to the frame" is the wording used. You are the manufacturer - you have assembled two different products into one.

 

[Ruadh495]

No because you can go into the LCD settings and change the MAX speed and or wheel size. According to EN 15194 there has to be a way of preventing the user from doing this. "Permanently fixed to the frame" is the wording used. You are the manufacturer - you have assembled two different products into one.

As the "manufacturer" I may have access to the settlings, surely?

I'm pretty sure EN15194 is only relevant to sales, not use. Unless your local equivalent of the UK EAPC regulations contain the words "conforming to EN15194". The reported behaviour of the Spanish police suggests that Spain's do. The U.K's do not. France?

 

[anotherkiwi]

Haven't talked to any yet. Some have looked sideways but they are too busy with drug runners and cigarette smugglers or drivers using their mobile phones...

 

[Quarryjmiller]

So, trying to cut through all of the various debates & discussions on here, I am looking at a bike with an EN15194 sticker on it and a 6kmh start assist twist throttle, I want to be able to ride it here at home and in France and Spain, I don't think there is much chance of my being encarcerated or even caught but I would still like to know, is it legal?

 

[anotherkiwi]

No, start assist throttle is not legal, yes walk along is.

All the French, Italian and Spanish web shops sell throttles, I guess that if they have them in stock people are mounting them. The shops do kindly point out that the throttles are illegal on the open road, how nice of them!

French police have started looking at me as I go by, maybe there has been some kind of internal information passed down to them? The Spanish police are clamping down on lack of helmets, riding on the footpath etc. after some incidents involving elderly pedestrians. I wouldn't be seen by them starting off without pedalling if I were you, they are not known for having a fabulous sense of humour...

 

[craiggor]

watch out there's a dyno about.

 

[flecc]

So, trying to cut through all of the various debates & discussions on here, I am looking at a bike with an EN15194 sticker on it and a 6kmh start assist twist throttle, I want to be able to ride it here at home and in France and Spain, I don't think there is much chance of my being encarcerated or even caught but I would still like to know, is it legal?

As another kiwi says, it's a walk assist throttle, not for start assistance. The law allows it to be used when walking alongside up a hill too steep for riding up for example, but not when riding.
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[Quarryjmiller]

As another kiwi says, it's a walk assist throttle, not for start assistance. The law allows it to be used when walking alongside up a hill too steep for riding up for example, but not when riding.
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Thanks Flecc, the Dec 15 DfT document specifically says 'to help start up' that is why I am confused.

The throttle in Spain thing is interesting, stayed for a week in Barcelona in January this year, throngs of people riding electric scooters, no pedals just scooters, saw two shops hiring them out, very few pedelecs about but loads of those scooters, is there an exemption because it makes a mockery of the twist and go throttle 'ban' if that is the case.

 

[anotherkiwi]

You know that Barcelona isn't in Spain any more don't you? A bit like Britain and the EU

Did they have number plates? If so then they are registered as mopeds. People weren't wearing helmets? Well if the police really want to they could fine the rider 200€ (100€ if you pay within a certain delay) exactly the same amount for not wearing one on your bike.

 

[trex]

No because you can go into the LCD settings and change the MAX speed and or wheel size. According to EN 15194 there has to be a way of preventing the user from doing this. "Permanently fixed to the frame" is the wording used. You are the manufacturer - you have assembled two different products into one.

most LCDs do have facility to password protect the settings.
I suspect suppliers don't particularly want to set a password.

 

[flecc]

Thanks Flecc, the Dec 15 DfT document specifically says 'to help start up' that is why I am confused.

I know the document you mean, it was Guidance issued in December 2015 and in section 1, subsection 1.2 they state there's an exemption for start up assistance. Unfortunately they've issued several guideline documents and information sheets in the last few months and that is the only one stating this.

I think it's the DfT who are confused, partly because of the complexity of the changes in the law, partly because this isn't an area of the law that concerns them much (last time was 1983!), and partly because there are continuing discussions in the EU about the provisions for throttle controlled vehicles.

It's the actual law that counts and this is the law amending the old 1983 regulations:

The Pedal Cycles (Construction and Use) (Amendment)
Regulations 2015

Made - - - - 3rd March 2015
Laid before Parliament 5th March 2015
Coming into force - - 6th April 2015

It stipulates within that compliance with the EU wide type approval legislation 168/2013 is necessary and that contains the conditions for exemption from motor vehicle law. Here's the relevant paragraph copied and pasted from 168/2013:

(h) pedal cycles with pedal assistance which are equipped with an auxiliary electric motor having a maximum continuous rated power of less than or equal to 250 W, where the output of the motor is cut off when the cyclist stops pedalling and is otherwise progressively reduced and finally cut off before the vehicle speed reaches 25 km/h;

As you can see, that clearly states that power must cut off if the rider stops pedalling. The walk alongside throttle operates without pedalling so isn't legal when riding. What makes that throttle legal are the Pedestrian Controlled Vehicle regulations of 1963 and similar law in Europe, and if someone is riding they are no longer a pedestrian of course.

However, it's a minor point and if you pedal as well when setting off, no-one is going to bother you since that disguises that power is available without pedalling.
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[shemozzle999]

So, trying to cut through all of the various debates & discussions on here, I am looking at a bike with an EN15194 sticker on it and a 6kmh start assist twist throttle, I want to be able to ride it here at home and in France and Spain, I don't think there is much chance of my being encarcerated or even caught but I would still like to know, is it legal?

The throttle position is still unclear - awaiting the publication of the December 2015 minutes of the EU working group - due at the end of this month together with the agenda for the April 2016 meeting.

 

[anotherkiwi]

most LCDs do have facility to password protect the settings.
I suspect suppliers don't particularly want to set a password.

Maybe I have misunderstood the Chinglish the instructions are written in? On the LCD-3 does the password prevent you from getting to all the configuration screens?

I was under the impression (probably false) that it protected the two advanced levels of configuration.

 

[trex]

the bike suppliers need to ask the factory to turn on and set the default password in the LCD (usually 0512) for basic settings except the clock. The facility is there but only Volt and Cyclotricity do so as far as I am aware.

 

[anotherkiwi]

I read the Chingrish again and on the KT-LCD3 there is a start-up password setting at C9. It looks like it prevents the user from riding off before entering a password. Could be a reasonable casual theft prevention measure.

 

[Quarryjmiller]

You know that Barcelona isn't in Spain any more don't you? A bit like Britain and the EU

Did they have number plates? If so then they are registered as mopeds. People weren't wearing helmets? Well if the police really want to they could fine the rider 200€ (100€ if you pay within a certain delay) exactly the same amount for not wearing one on your bike.

These were like large skateboards complete with handlebars and a saddle, made by a German company Tante Paula, didn't see many pedelecs but there were loads of these on and off the pavements, looked like great fun, there are always loads of police down at the port but they just ignored them when I was there.
Not really surprised, it's a bit like a lottery I suppose, the law only applies to those of us who want to comply or who the police can be bothered to bother.
I don't want a hand throttle or start assist but I am suspicious of eu regs that affect cheaper Chinese imports, if a large German manufacturer built motors and systems with hand throttles you can bet your bottom dollar that hand throttles would be accommodated in the eu regs.

 

[Quarryjmiller]

I know the document you mean, it was Guidance issued in December 2015 and in section 1, subsection 1.2 they state there's an exemption for start up assistance. Unfortunately they've issued several guideline documents and information sheets in the last few months and that is the only one stating this.

I think it's the DfT who are confused, partly because of the complexity of the changes in the law, partly because this isn't an area of the law that concerns them much (last time was 1983!), and partly because there are continuing discussions in the EU about the provisions for throttle controlled vehicles.

It's the actual law that counts and this is the law amending the old 1983 regulations:

The Pedal Cycles (Construction and Use) (Amendment)
Regulations 2015

Made - - - - 3rd March 2015
Laid before Parliament 5th March 2015
Coming into force - - 6th April 2015

It stipulates within that compliance with the EU wide type approval legislation 168/2013 is necessary and that contains the conditions for exemption from motor vehicle law. Here's the relevant paragraph copied and pasted from 168/2013:

(h) pedal cycles with pedal assistance which are equipped with an auxiliary electric motor having a maximum continuous rated power of less than or equal to 250 W, where the output of the motor is cut off when the cyclist stops pedalling and is otherwise progressively reduced and finally cut off before the vehicle speed reaches 25 km/h;

As you can see, that clearly states that power must cut off if the rider stops pedalling. The walk alongside throttle operates without pedalling so isn't legal when riding. What makes that throttle legal are the Pedestrian Controlled Vehicle regulations of 1963 and similar law in Europe, and if someone is riding they are no longer a pedestrian of course.

However, it's a minor point and if you pedal as well when setting off, no-one is going to bother you since that disguises that power is available without pedalling.
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Many thanks Flecc