..too many choices!!

[Stubod]

Hi all,
I recently posted a thread regarding belt v chain and derailleur v hub. After I had the replies I had convinced myself I wanted a Bosch hub rive with Nexus hub and chain as this seemed to offer the best compromise. However the bike I selected that matched this criteria is no longer available, (Raleigh Motus GT open frame). So I am having a rethink. I am still looking at a budget of around £2.5k. Minimum is hub drive and 500 battery, (and preferably hub drive).

There is a dealer (very) local to us that sells Volt bikes, however these seem to be fitted with a Shimano drive system? Is there much to choose between Shimano and Bosch? Internet research suggests the latest Bosch may be the better system?

Also nearly all the bikes I see only seem to offer derailleur, which while not being a deal breaker is still not my preferred option. I am starting to think that perhaps the "standard" Nexus 7 speed hub gear is causing problems so manufacturers are staying with the derailleur option?

I accept that as I have plenty of time to think about this given "lockdown" I am probably over thinking things. While I am really keen to get an e-bike I am reluctant to buy over the 'tinternet without having a test ride first and all our local dealers are closed and I accept it's not really an essential journey at the mo so will have to wait until restrictions are lifted.

 

[Muddyfox]

..well it finally landed today and I have spent a good couple of hours getting it set up / adjusting things to suit me.
I originally wanted the "mid size", (they do small, medium and large). The "medium size" is for around 5ft 9 to 6ft 2, (or thereabouts) and I am just over 5ft 9. However when I went to purchase the bike all the mid sized ones had sold out with no more due in until October! I therefore took a bit of a risk and went for the "small" size. Must admit I am glad I did as with my feet on the floor the cross bar is very close to a certain region, (I am too old for kids anyway).
It was an absolute pig to the battery cover off and the battery out, (broke a nail). But once I did get it out and applied a bit of oil it seems to be a bit more straightforward. (Probably "too new")
So far I have only cycled up and down our bit of road while I get the seat height, handlebars and levers etc set up to suit. Already noted how smooth and quite the belt drive system is, and the 8 speed Nexus gears seem very smooth!

The Bosch intuvia system is great and seems simple enough to use, (not sure of the purpose of the USB port but I guess I will have to have a google).

General quality of the bike seems OK. I took a punt on ordering online, I would have much preferred to "see and feel" before parting with that sort of cash.

My first choice was going to be the Raliegh Motus GT, but I could not find one with a crossbar and hub drive. However the Centros was advertised with £500+ off list so it was more or less the same price the same price as the Motus.

Battery on charge tonight and planning maiden voyage tomorrow if the weather is OK. (OH will be on her Giant Prime as a comparison). Will report back after our first ride!

Intuvia charges your smartphone via the USB port, for example, while you are riding.

 

[Stubod]

OK, so since unpacking and setting up I have now completed 2 "rides", both my usual 12 mile route up to now I have been doing on my OHs Giant Prime e-bike, and so far so good!

The Centros (Bosch) motor system combined with a Nexus hub and belt is really quite, and I am pleased (at least at the moment!), that I opted for this option.

As expected the "quoted" range (225k) is probably based on a processional cyclist weighing 7 stone, cycling on the flat with a following wind. I am not sure how the system calculates "range left" but I think it is probably only based on the last mile or two of cycling. After my first trip, (flatish but with a couple of small rises) it was saying 80 miles left.
When I started my second trip after the first couple of miles it had dropped by 25 miles (showing a range of 55miles, initially a gentle incline but a fairly strong wind), however at the end of the trip it was indicating 70 miles left? So probably not that much use a s a guide and I would prefer a simple "percentage left" as per the Giant display. The battery indicator dropped its first (of 5 bars) around 23 miles. As recommended, I will try and flatten the battery before it has it's first re-charge so I will have a better idea of range after this.

Most of my journeys are on "ECO" setting with the occasional hill warranting a boost to the 3 (of 4) power settings. ECO mode still requires a reasonable degree of input, but the short time I did try the second (Tour?) setting things got noticeably easier! For the steep bits it didn't seem to quite match the performance (torque) of the Giant (Yamaha motor), but still perfectly OK.

I am finding the bike very comfortable even with the standard sadle, which at the moment I don't think I will change.

The Intuvia display and controls both seem to work really well and the system is very intuitive, (haven't even read the manual yet!).

All the fittings seem to be of good quality, but I am still surprised they don't fit a wing mirror? I got one of Amazon that mounts in the end of the handlebar.

Also not really keen on the "revers pedal brake", (did not realise it had this), but probably just need to get used to it.

Would I buy one again? Probably not at the original RRP but with the discount it has made it more attractive. So at the moment I am happy with it and I hope it proves to be reliable.

 

[Crazyj]

OK, so since unpacking and setting up I have now completed 2 "rides", both my usual 12 mile route up to now I have been doing on my OHs Giant Prime e-bike, and so far so good!

The Centros (Bosch) motor system combined with a Nexus hub and belt is really quite, and I am pleased (at least at the moment!), that I opted for this option.

As expected the "quoted" range (225k) is probably based on a processional cyclist weighing 7 stone, cycling on the flat with a following wind. I am not sure how the system calculates "range left" but I think it is probably only based on the last mile or two of cycling. After my first trip, (flatish but with a couple of small rises) it was saying 80 miles left.
When I started my second trip after the first couple of miles it had dropped by 25 miles (showing a range of 55miles, initially a gentle incline but a fairly strong wind), however at the end of the trip it was indicating 70 miles left? So probably not that much use a s a guide and I would prefer a simple "percentage left" as per the Giant display. The battery indicator dropped its first (of 5 bars) around 23 miles. As recommended, I will try and flatten the battery before it has it's first re-charge so I will have a better idea of range after this.

Most of my journeys are on "ECO" setting with the occasional hill warranting a boost to the 3 (of 4) power settings. ECO mode still requires a reasonable degree of input, but the short time I did try the second (Tour?) setting things got noticeably easier! For the steep bits it didn't seem to quite match the performance (torque) of the Giant (Yamaha motor), but still perfectly OK.

I am finding the bike very comfortable even with the standard sadle, which at the moment I don't think I will change.

The Intuvia display and controls both seem to work really well and the system is very intuitive, (haven't even read the manual yet!).

All the fittings seem to be of good quality, but I am still surprised they don't fit a wing mirror? I got one of Amazon that mounts in the end of the handlebar.

Also not really keen on the "revers pedal brake", (did not realise it had this), but probably just need to get used to it.

Would I buy one again? Probably not at the original RRP but with the discount it has made it more attractive. So at the moment I am happy with it and I hope it proves to be reliable.

Be great to see some pics!

 

[budsy]

Hi Stubod,
Just read up on this thread and also learns others re-ebikes , as i admit i dont know anything about e bikes at all , but im for now trying to get to know some things about them , and this site i just joined shall be of help .

Also im in the search as looking to purchase an e bike , although not in any great rush but is good of you posting as lets others also see how people get on with
their bike/s that they have purchased , and good to get to know how
they get along in time with their e bike/s in the future ?

Hopefully all goes smooth riding for you and be good to know how things
went, meanwhile all the best of riding .

 

[Stubod]

Hi Stubod,
Just read up on this thread and also learns others re-ebikes , as i admit i dont know anything about e bikes at all , but im for now trying to get to know some things about them , and this site i just joined shall be of help .

Also im in the search as looking to purchase an e bike , although not in any great rush but is good of you posting as lets others also see how people get on with
their bike/s that they have purchased , and good to get to know how
they get along in time with their e bike/s in the future ?

Hopefully all goes smooth riding for you and be good to know how things
went, meanwhile all the best of riding .

ta for the reply. I guess the starting point for most is "how much do you want to spend". My original budget was going to be around £1.5k, but could not find the spec I wanted in that price range, (Crank motor with Bosch Active line / Intuvia control / hub gears, and later on a belt drive!).

E-bikes do seem very expensive for what they are, especially when you can by a "normal" bike for less than £200, but I guess the tech probably costs quite a bit, and I realise the larger capacity batteries alone are north of £500.

The other problem once you establish your budget is the simply massive choice! And you can't really road test them all, so it helps if you know somebody who has one that they recommend. Depending on your budget and my (somewhat limited) experience to date I would certainly consider hub gears with a "belt" if the budget allows.

There was a very comprehensive article that I found somewhere on 'tinternet comparing hub gears with derailleur, and the conclusion was that unless you are into competitive cycling the hub gears seem to be the better option for "commuting" type cycling. But I guess you pays your money ...etc.

Happy hunting...

 

[budsy]

ta for the reply. I guess the starting point for most is "how much do you want to spend". My original budget was going to be around £1.5k, but could not find the spec I wanted in that price range, (Crank motor with Bosch Active line / Intuvia control / hub gears, and later on a belt drive!).

E-bikes do seem very expensive for what they are, especially when you can by a "normal" bike for less than £200, but I guess the tech probably costs quite a bit, and I realise the larger capacity batteries alone are north of £500.

The other problem once you establish your budget is the simply massive choice! And you can't really road test them all, so it helps if you know somebody who has one that they recommend. Depending on your budget and my (somewhat limited) experience to date I would certainly consider hub gears with a "belt" if the budget allows.

There was a very comprehensive article that I found somewhere on 'tinternet comparing hub gears with derailleur, and the conclusion was that unless you are into competitive cycling the hub gears seem to be the better option for "commuting" type cycling. But I guess you pays your money ...etc.

Happy hunting...

Cheers for yer answer back appreciated .

Hub gears is what I have on the bike I have at present , this bike
is a Raleigh Freedom 600 as seen on my avatar pic ..never had any problem with them gears and had it some yrs now , is 7 speed gears with gearing inside back wheel of bike as was taken and done in the Dutch style of braking also .

I used to have the old style Dutch cruiser where u back peddled to brake
but I sold it to someone who kept at me I recall to sell .

but was a heavy bike and also this Raleigh freedom is a steel frame and so also is heavy
so I much would prefer a lighter frame now ..I reckon aluminium would b ok as much lighter but with an e bike the battery attached shall make it heavy..though be so much easier and better uphills on roads which would b a good thing although a little put off is the reading up regards maintenance needed for ebikes a touch as could be a costly adventure if things mess up back forth . I recallway back now when the Sinclair revolution of bikes began many yrs back now and had thought about one but it never came to fruition ..but today with the ebikes out nowadays they sound as if things have come a long way ..I think I shall buy one but looking around for now ..

I ask about what are belts , sound silly and most probs is m asking this Q/ lol
also what is a Crank otor with Bosch Active line and Intuivia control hub gears ?
hope u don't mind ..but whatever enjoy your new bike sounds a good one .

 

[sjpt]

A few answers.

Belts are instead of chain; they only work with single speed or hub gears. Cleaner and with luck longer lasting and quieter than chains. Generally only on pretty expensive bikes.

Crank motor is a motor at the crank (as opposed to in front or back hub). Bosh are a common maker of these for mid to high priced bikes. The Intuvia is a Bosch display used with some Bosch bikes. You can't buy Bosch systems as kits, only with ready made bikes. Repairs and replacement batteries are expensive.

Sinclair's electric bikes were compromised in many ways; basically rubbish (like many things he designed). Modern ebikes are pretty reliable, with a few sad exceptions.

The weight is not so important with ebikes as there is the motor to help. Quite a few high quality ebikes are still pretty heavy (eg 25kg). There are much lighter ones too, but mostly pretty expensive and with limited assist and/or range. Which is best for you depends on your style of riding and your budget. You may find a conversion of yours isn't that much heavier than a reasonably priced replacement.

 

[budsy]

A few answers.

Belts are instead of chain; they only work with single speed or hub gears. Cleaner and with luck longer lasting and quieter than chains. Generally only on pretty expensive bikes.

Crank motor is a motor at the crank (as opposed to in front or back hub). Bosh are a common maker of these for mid to high priced bikes. The Intuvia is a Bosch display used with some Bosch bikes. You can't buy Bosch systems as kits, only with ready made bikes. Repairs and replacement batteries are expensive.

Sinclair's electric bikes were compromised in many ways; basically rubbish (like many things he designed). Modern ebikes are pretty reliable, with a few sad exceptions.

The weight is not so important with ebikes as there is the motor to help. Quite a few high quality ebikes are still pretty heavy (eg 25kg). There are much lighter ones too, but mostly pretty expensive and with limited assist and/or range. Which is best for you depends on your style of riding and your budget. You may find a conversion of yours isn't that much heavier than a reasonably priced replacement.

@sjpt - Cheers for reply and sounds good ^ so id be ok with bike I have to get a motor/battery put into it instead possibly ? Belt sounds good to me
being as work with hub gearing .

 

[sjpt]

I'm not sure you'll find a belt drive conversion kit very easily. Chain is fine and you've already got it, just needs cleaning and lubing more.
Probably worth weighing your bike; then look at the weight of possible kits and see how that adds up compared to weight of a new ebike in your price bracket.

If you go for a kit I'd recommend Woosh (https://wooshbikes.co.uk/), or Yose are a little cheaper.

Do NOT go for the big heavy direct drive motors advertised for not much over £100 on ebay; they are inefficient for most uses so need a hefty battery which more than offsets the saving on the motor. (Look at several other threads on this forum, many from people who bought the motor then wondered what to do next.)

 

[budsy]

I'm not sure you'll find a belt drive conversion kit very easily. Chain is fine and you've already got it, just needs cleaning and lubing more.
Probably worth weighing your bike; then look at the weight of possible kits and see how that adds up compared to weight of a new ebike in your price bracket.

If you go for a kit I'd recommend Woosh (https://wooshbikes.co.uk/), or Yose are a little cheaper.

Do NOT go for the big heavy direct drive motors advertised for not much over £100 on ebay; they are inefficient for most uses so need a hefty battery which more than offsets the saving on the motor. (Look at several other threads on this forum, many from people who bought the motor then wondered what to do next.)

Cheers for answer , Think id go for the Rambla bike ..but again im not nowadays one for buying a bike online , as ive heard of people paying for expensive things and not receiving which many people have been done for in past and online just with some things seems iffy to me .

and ye I should weigh the bike I have , and shall although I know its a heavy bike frame as is steel not aluminium ..my last bike before this was old style dutch cruiser (again a heavy bike ) with back pedal to brake .

This Raleigh freedom 600 was taken from that way with braking system in back hub wheel
of the bike which is all fine and bike runs perfectly as been looked after
and always oiled before put away in winter and odd time taken out
put upside down and checked out by running the wheels around for a minute or 2 and put back in shed and just kept it looked after ..good running bike just up hills them days are taking their toll on me ..Was on bike around 2 wks ago in nice weather and went a run and I came across a steep hilly part and thought to myself im cycling up this as I used to and I did ven when half way was feeling it and felt my heart pumping but also kept with my breathing to keep me right until I reached top then got off bike and sat down for 10 mins before I headed off , just was tired out with that steep hill and was following day I was away for walk and to same area and was chatting to a guy on his bike at exactly same part although we were stood on top of hilly part when a woman came from bottom of hill on her bike and seemed to do such at ease with a wry smile upon her face lol ..I never then knew about ebikes and guy said that's an e bike she was on and said theyre good but expensive and he is right ..why so expensive ? a money racket it is like everything they know people many are feeling it when getting older in age and shall go for something which makes cycling more at ease and enjoyment in the country .

Said to be a good wkend this wkend going by weather , bike weather fir sure > but for them hills

 

[budsy]

..well it finally landed today and I have spent a good couple of hours getting it set up / adjusting things to suit me.
I originally wanted the "mid size", (they do small, medium and large). The "medium size" is for around 5ft 9 to 6ft 2, (or thereabouts) and I am just over 5ft 9. However when I went to purchase the bike all the mid sized ones had sold out with no more due in until October! I therefore took a bit of a risk and went for the "small" size. Must admit I am glad I did as with my feet on the floor the cross bar is very close to a certain region, (I am too old for kids anyway).
It was an absolute pig to the battery cover off and the battery out, (broke a nail). But once I did get it out and applied a bit of oil it seems to be a bit more straightforward. (Probably "too new")
So far I have only cycled up and down our bit of road while I get the seat height, handlebars and levers etc set up to suit. Already noted how smooth and quite the belt drive system is, and the 8 speed Nexus gears seem very smooth!

The Bosch intuvia system is great and seems simple enough to use, (not sure of the purpose of the USB port but I guess I will have to have a google).

General quality of the bike seems OK. I took a punt on ordering online, I would have much preferred to "see and feel" before parting with that sort of cash.

My first choice was going to be the Raliegh Motus GT, but I could not find one with a crossbar and hub drive. However the Centros was advertised with £500+ off list so it was more or less the same price the same price as the Motus.

Battery on charge tonight and planning maiden voyage tomorrow if the weather is OK. (OH will be on her Giant Prime as a comparison). Will report back after our first ride!

Be cool to see some pics of bike if u have time when able ..

 

[Stubod]

Be cool to see some pics of bike if u have time when able ..

As requested a pic of the new toy. Another 20 miler yesterday in the glorious sunshine. (I have a hunch the good weather will finally end when lockdown does!)

Bringing the total distance to date on the first charge to 66 miles and still "2 bars" left on the battery (40% assuming 5 bars in total, and so far about 22 "miles per bar"). Predicted range left 30 miles, but as per above take with a pinch of salt. Probably 90% in "ECO" mode with the occasional "blip" up to the 3rd setting for some steep bits.

Still fairly impressed with the bike overall. It seems to have very little "rolling resistance" on the flat as I find it quite easy to out pedal the motor, (ie pedal to sustain a speed in excess of 15.5mph when on the flat).

I will report back on overall range once I have drained the battery for the first time...just need to be careful that I am close to home when this happens as it will be tough going "up hills" without any battery support!

 

[budsy]

View attachment 35518

As requested a pic of the new toy. Another 20 miler yesterday in the glorious sunshine. (I have a hunch the good weather will finally end when lockdown does!)

Bringing the total distance to date on the first charge to 66 miles and still "2 bars" left on the battery (40% assuming 5 bars in total, and so far about 22 "miles per bar"). Predicted range left 30 miles, but as per above take with a pinch of salt. Probably 90% in "ECO" mode with the occasional "blip" up to the 3rd setting for some steep bits.

Still fairly impressed with the bike overall. It seems to have very little "rolling resistance" on the flat as I find it quite easy to out pedal the motor, (ie pedal to sustain a speed in excess of 15.5mph when on the flat).

I will report back on overall range once I have drained the battery for the first time...just need to be careful that I am close to home when this happens as it will be tough going "up hills" without any battery support!

Sounds cool ^ and good looking bike , looks strong build and once you get more used
to it then all shall be fine for u ..Enjoy the bike and im sure you shall ..As for Usb port must b for fone charger possibly and "soundwave" at top of this thread tells u more about that .. Great weather was today Wednesday and to be fine again sure tomorrow and then some windy weather and odd shower or so to come from Friday I think

but meantime looks good the bike and a rack on the back is a handy thing
I always prefer also , guess its able to have a pannier bag affixed to the back on rack . . Whatever enjoy the bike and looks a good one .

 

[Stubod]

Sounds cool ^ and good looking bike , looks strong build and once you get more used
to it then all shall be fine for u ..Enjoy the bike and im sure you shall ..As for Usb port must b for fone charger possibly and "soundwave" at top of this thread tells u more about that .. Great weather was today Wednesday and to be fine again sure tomorrow and then some windy weather and odd shower or so to come from Friday I think

but meantime looks good the bike and a rack on the back is a handy thing
I always prefer also , guess its able to have a pannier bag affixed to the back on rack . . Whatever enjoy the bike and looks a good one .

..yep I have now attached one of my old panniers, and weather permitting I will be out riding again tomorrow..(would be great to get 100 miles out of one charge, but not hopeful!...)

 

[Stubod]

OK so I have now finally "emptied" the battery after completing 6 trips totaling 90 miles.

The battery dropped to one bar left at the 82 mile mark, and when I got home it was showing 3 mile range left.

Again the range indicator is a bit meaningless as on part of the rides I was not using any battery, and while I am happy with a nominal range of 90 miles it is somewhat short of the quoted range. I would guess that 90% + of my cycling was done in "ECO" mode with the occasional boost to "Sport (3rd power setting) to get up a couple of hilly bits.

I am unlikely to ever do 90 miles in one trip, but happy to work on each "bar" giving a safe range of about 15 miles, and will treat one bar as "reserve, so (hopefully) a safe range on a full charge of 60 miles, (I am planning a couple of 50 mile trips).

Only problem with the bike is that I noted the lower battery mounting bracket, (includes the lock mechanism) is held in place by 2 smallish screws and both had either come lose, or had not been correctly tightened on assembly resulting in the battery dropping and occasionally disconnecting itself over a bit of rough ground. Luckily spotted this when I was taking the battery out to charge it, (although you can charge it in situ). The screws are of the "security" type (ie with a pin sticking up to prevent the use of standard star drive bits). Luckily I had a set so was able to re-tighten them., but will be keeping an eye on them. (Surprised there are no spring washers fitted?).

 

[Albert12]

Enjoy

 

[Bobajob]

..decision made, just ordered a Raleigh Centros GT, hub gears and belt drive....hope it's the right choice!!

I feel although you can research every option, style,comfort, noise etc etc etc. its still a chance until crunch time when riding, but a lot better than no research at all.
I bought my bike after investigating every possible options etc. I had nearly all the options worked out. I can honestly say the crucial ones are spot on. My next bike I will tweak several things (puts it into the ‘just right’ category)which one only finds out after ownership and riding for several months.