Smaller, subtle 48v battery options?

[Nealh]

The article is about transporting/supplying batteries on or off a bike and not their actual use by the end user.


"If any company handles, packs and labels dangerous goods, such as Lithium-Ion batteries at their own premises, a trained “Dangerous Goods Advisor” is required onsite to oversee that this is done in full compliance with the rules and to declare the goods safe to travel. If you have no member of staff which has received the above training, you must hire a specialist company to handle, pack and label the goods and to fill out a “Dangerous Goods Note”. It is compulsory for Dangerous Goods shipments to be accompanied by this document"

 

[Woosh]

If you don't believe me, just google "do e-bikes batteries have to be UN38.3 certified"

There have been plenty of threads on here about 38.3 over the years.

BTW, soon I won't be allowed to repair batteries because a faulty battery cannot be moved unless to the tip. Batteries are made nowadays unrepairable by design.

QUOTE:

As of 1 May 2012, battery packs – including those intended for use in medical products – must be evaluated for full compliance to IEC 62133.

The International Electrotechnical Commission (IEC), a non profit standards organisation, writes international standards for all electrical, electronics and related technologies, including batteries. For lithium batteries, the key standards are IEC 62133, the IEC 60086 suite, IEC 61960 and IEC 62281 (the IEC version of UN 38.3)
...

“Is the Battery UN38.3 certified?”
If not it cannot be legally handled in the UK and why is someone selling an uncertified lithium battery? You’d be surprised how often we hear of unapproved batteries coming in from places like China. The problem is you can’t legally move them. The regulations around battery movement are pretty tight these days and you need to have the right certificate and the right box to transport them in. If it doesn’t have these and you want to send it in for repair, how are you going to do that?

UN38.3 certification has been specifically set up to cover the safe storage and shipping of lithium batteries.

Lithium ion electric bike batteries are safe as long as they have been built to the correct standard.

 

[anotherkiwi]

This is what my battery box looks like at the moment.

This car has a certified battery...

 

[Woosh]

for a long time, I wanted to make a kit for the Brompton but because the Brompton is rather 'bijoux', a custom battery is needed. I bumped into so many regulatory issues that need to be sorted before I can get product liability insurance, that project is still on the drawing board.

 

[anotherkiwi]

https://www.ciclotekstore.eu/b2c/producto/9821052/2/vintage-black-36v-12-8-ah-battery-set

 

[Woosh]

thank you for the link, AKW.

 

[richardg6paj]

To quote you Mr. Woosh. "These rules do not only concern transport of batteries for instance from manufacturer to dealer, but all transport except transport for private purposes. There are an awful lot of lead-acid batteries on the road in all manner of vehicles which are possibly a bigger hazard than ebike batteries. Regulations are for shipping were due to a few LiPo batteries misbehaving in aircraft and quite rightly so, but for use is ridiculous. However, I can see your point of view where you are the seller and have to rely on couriers to deliver.

 

[Woosh]

all the big couriers (UPS, DPD etc) insist on certifications, DG9 labelling, UN 4G cartons and also on extra insurance to indemnify them against any accident for all batteries greater than 100WH which all e-bike batteries are.

 

[richardg6paj]

all the big couriers (UPS, DPD etc) insist on certifications, DG9 labelling, UN 4G cartons and also on extra insurance to indemnify them against any accident for all batteries greater than 100WH which all e-bike batteries are.

Just out of interest Mr Woosh, how do I know that the battery that came with my ebike from you is UN38.3 certified? The battery is an HL 36v 15ah. attached to a RioFB.

 

[Woosh]

the case is certified, the battery is certified. I always ask for UN certificates before I buy the battery. The company I bought the HL batteries from has a turnover of about 100 million dollars a year.
Go to alibaba, search for 'battery with un 38.3 certificate' - you will find hundreds of suppliers.
https://www.alibaba.com/trade/search?fsb=y&IndexArea=product_en&CatId=&SearchText=battery+with+un+38.3+certificate&viewtype=

 

[richardg6paj]

the case is certified, the battery is certified. I always ask for UN certificates before I buy the battery. The company I bought the HL batteries from has a turnover of about 100 million dollars a year.
Go to alibaba, search for 'battery with un 38.3 certificate' - you will find hundreds of suppliers.
https://www.alibaba.com/trade/search?fsb=y&IndexArea=product_en&CatId=&SearchText=battery+with+un+38.3+certificate&viewtype=

How do I know that the battery is certified, there are no marks on the case to say that it is, I have no certificate? To quote your earlier post. "The regulations around battery movement are pretty tight these days and you need to have the right certificate and the right box to transport them in. If it doesn’t have these and you want to send it in for repair, how are you going to do that?"

 

[Woosh]

transport of Lithium batteries are governed by the same UN 38.3 regulations, same in China. All the factories must have them because they are licensed by the Chinese government. There is no need for you to worry about.
There is a serial number imprinted on the case identifying which factory makes the battery.
If your battery causes an accident, your lawyer will ask me to show every certificate, for the cells and the case.

 

[richardg6paj]

transport of Lithium batteries are governed by the same UN 38.3 regulations, same in China. All the factories must have them because they are licensed by the Chinese government. There is no need for you to worry about.
There is a serial number imprinted on the case identifying which factory makes the battery.
If your battery causes an accident, your lawyer will ask me to show every certificate, for the cells and the case.

But your certificate is not linked to my battery, there is no serial number on my battery to link it to your certificate. For all I know the battery could be a Chinese copy or fake. Looks like the regulations are not very well implemented.

 

[Woosh]

the serial number is usually imprinted on the inner side of the case, next to the battery connector. There should also be a label on the battery.
Your bike is manufactured in one of the largest bike factories in Tianjin. They can trace the provenance of the components.

 

[richardg6paj]

the serial number is usually imprinted on the inner side of the case, next to the battery connector. There should also be a label on the battery.
Your bike is manufactured in one of the largest bike factories in Tianjin. They can trace the provenance of the components.

Yes, there's a sticky label with a number on it near the connector, but surely the serial number should be stamped into the case, (laser printed) the label is easily removed and could easily be reprinted. But anyway, thanks for your comments.

 

[Woosh]

labelling changes from factory to factory but the regulations don't change.
That's the reason why nobody bothers to include UN38.3 certificates with each bike.
This label is on our 13AH HL battery:

:

 

[richardg6paj]

labelling changes from factory to factory but the regulations don't change.
That's the reason why nobody bothers to include UN38.3 certificates with each bike.
This label is on our 13AH HL battery:

:

Yes, that looks ok, the serial number has been laser engraved into the plastic. Note the picture of mine.

 

[Benjahmin]

So, lets see if I've got this right.
I have an Insat battery made to my spec. It came to me encased in heatshrink, delivered by some courier or other. I put an extra layer of half inch HD foam around it, and I carry it in my pannier paralleled to my rack battery..
How many 'regulations' have been / are being broken?

 

[Woosh]

How many 'regulations' have been / are being broken?

Those I know of:

Low Voltage Directive 2014/35/EU
Electromagnetic Compatibility 2014/30/EU
EN 61000-6-1:2007
EN 61000-6-3:2007/A1:2011/AC:2012
EN 62133:2013
UN38.8
UN 3480 G4
CE marking

I have spent a fair amount of time reading up this stuff and still am a long way from being on top of it. Hatti spent hours reading up about UN 3480 G4, 1,200 pages, 3,500 dollars for a certificate. That's why small businesses that don't export are fed up with EU regulations, after a long day, how are you supposed to keep up with EU regulations? There are so many lawyers on no win no fee around.

 

[anotherkiwi]

Unfortunately UN38.8 isn't an EU norm, it is a UN norm. Most EU norms are based on ISO or other international norms. Sorry to disappoint you...