February 22, 200917 yr Hi. I am thinking of getting an electric bike and obviously need to choose which one. In short, my needs are: A bike frame to suit my 6'8" 14+ stone frame Purchased through cyclescheme (my employer's choice) limit of £1000 as I dont want to make a 100% contribution to the portion above it 5 mile daily round trip to work with moderate inclines in both directions So far, I have narrowed it down to the Powabyke X-6 or X-24 or the Powacycle Salisbury. Obviously the the Salisbury appeals on price at RRP of £699 but I am happy to pay up to £1000, so long as its the best fit for my needs. Is it worth investing in the £829 RRP of the X-6 or even the £929 of the X-24? Although my needs above seem fairly straight forward, if I really take to my bike, I may want to use it for longer journeys so am happy to pay a bit extra for something beyond the needs stated above, if its worth it. I have had difficulty trying to work out the frame size of the salisbury as sites often list is as N/A!?! Also, I am not sure how important the suspension is on the X-24, or whether the extra gears would prove useful. Does anyone know under what conditions the extra gears would be beneficial? I notice that one difference between the Salibury and the X-bykes is the battery being a Li-Pol vs a Li-ion. From what I have read here, Li-Pol batteries are better but I can not find a replacement battery price for either the x-byke or the salisbury. However, I did find mention of a battery recycling programme - is this smething that Powabyke do and does it make a replacement battery cheaper? On the topc of batteries, I wondered if it was worthwhile getting a cheaper bike so I could afford to have two batteries? As you can see I have many questions so any feedback would be helpful. I am sure many of my questions are probably answered in one way or another on the forums and I have done many searches but would appreciate feedback on the direct comparisons of the above and how you feel they would suit my particuylar needs. One final thing... If there are any other recommendations, I am happy to consider them. I am aware of the popularity of the wispers but this appears a bit small for me, not to mention the £1000+ price tag putting it out of my reach. This also applies to the Agattu and Cytronex also. Thanks in advance.
February 22, 200917 yr I wouldn't worry too much about the number of gears, I think that e-bike sellers only include 24 speed models as a selling poing because before riding an electric bike extensively most people (including me) don't realise that you only really need 3 gears (at least on hub motor bikes). I don't know much about those bikes, I did test drive a Powabyke 24 speed commuter (with SLA bateries) and found it slow, heavy and hard to provide much pedal assistance. All of the bikes restricted to 15.5 mph I've tried seem just too slow to have any real purpose to me though anyway so my opinion probably may not be so useful.
February 22, 200917 yr A replacement battery for the Powacycle Salisbury is shown as £249 on their site (the price increased last year but there have been no further increases). I would think you would will also find the frame to be "small" for at your height. I am short (5'5" and have to raise the seatpost a fair bit - you can however get longer seatposts and handlebar stems from the bike shop) What put me off the Powabyke X series was the smaller capacity of the batteries for the price. I've not had any problem with only 6 gears.... I get 26 miles out of the Powacycle batteries across hilly terrain with two bars still left on the meter - however I am just under 11 stone weight and was comfortably riding this distance on a unpowered pushbike previously. it is also not the most powerful of ebikes but it does the job and the assistance is welcome though, particularly on the return journey!
February 22, 200917 yr Hi, I own an X6 and I'm around 15 stone :o and 6' 1". I think it has plenty of power and I find it really comfortable. The only downside for me is range - realistically around 10 miles with moderate pedalling. I'm happy with 6 gears, I wouldn't lay out the extra on 24. I was surprised at the price though, I thought they were £750? Paul
February 22, 200917 yr Hi I'm waiting for the Cyclescheme paperwork to go through so that I can get my hands on the X6 that's waiting for me in the local bikeshop. I was able to take it for a 10 mile test ride up a hill and the 6 gears were fine. 24 gears are great if you're a cycling enthusiast trying to get the best performance out of your bike over varied terrain. For a commuter on normal roads it's overkill even on an unassisted bike, and can be pretty pointless when you're using a motor. It also adds an extra layer of complexity to your gears, giving you more to maintain and more to go wrong. Having said that, having 24 gears can have its uses, the lowest gears are good for starting on steep hills, and the top gears are good if you want to go signficantly faster than 15.5 mph (the motor will cut out at these speeds so you'll be cycling unassisted). If you go to Powabyke's dealer page (Where to buy, How to buy Powabykes : Electric Bikes & Electric Scooters) and put in your details they'll point you in the direction of the nearest dealer for you to go for a test ride. By the way, don't forget to add the cost of accessories to your calculations. If you get them at the same time as your bike you can put them through cyclesheme as well. Patrick Edited February 22, 200917 yr by Patrick
February 22, 200917 yr are the X series 700c wheel bikes? (they look like they are). This might mean the frames are larger and better for taller people....
February 22, 200917 yr Author Thanks for your feedback so far. The Maestro, I havent been on a bike in about 10 years so getting from A to B comfortably rather than fast is my main goal so i dont think the 15mph restriction will be a problem, at least to start with. Thanks Alex728 for the info on the price of the battery for the Salisbury.. now I just need to find out about the cost of the battery for the Powabyke. Also, yes the wheels are apaprently 700c Alloy CNC finish Accedo rims. pl1974, I am interested in your feedback about the range. Its a shame its so much lower than their advertised range. Although, I should be able to do 2 days commute before having to recharge as its less than a 5 mile round trip. Regarding the price, I am quoting RRP as per the Powabyke web site as I know many companies signed up with cyclescheme are forced to use the RRP due to the 10% ransom demanded by cyclescheme. However, i notice that electricbikes.org.uk (who are with cyclescheme) have it for £795 but add £25 shipping while all-about-the-bike.co.uk (not part of cyclescheme) have it for £744 including free shipping. I will try to speak to my employer to see if they are happy to use them instead. On this topic - does anyone know a retailer registered with cyclescheme that will sell the Powabyke X-6 at a good price? Patrick, I am also aware of the discount including accessories so thats another reason to keep the cost down as Im sure the essentials (helmet, lights, lock) will come in at around £100, but I havent got as far as thinking this out yet.
February 22, 200917 yr Author I am trying to work out Total Cost of Ownership so I can work out the cost savings against driving into work. If I charge the battery 5 times per week and it has a lifetime of 500 cycles, i figure I'll have to replace the battery every two years. This poses a couple of questions: How much is a replacement battery for the Powabyke X-6? How often do the brushes need replacing on the X-6 (I presume this is a servicable part?) How much is it to replaces the brushes on the motor?
February 22, 200917 yr Hi. 500 charges is full charges. If you charge before hitting 50% left you can extend that by quite a bit. Flecc will have more info on that as he is more confident of his figures. As to the brushes in the motor. My retired powabyke has done 7000+ miles and I reckon there's bags more in there (7,000+ more). Best regards. Vikki.
February 22, 200917 yr I am trying to work out Total Cost of Ownership so I can work out the cost savings against driving into work. If I charge the battery 5 times per week and it has a lifetime of 500 cycles, i figure I'll have to replace the battery every two years. This poses a couple of questions: How much is a replacement battery for the Powabyke X-6? How often do the brushes need replacing on the X-6 (I presume this is a servicable part?) How much is it to replaces the brushes on the motor? To go back to your first post. I STRONGLY suggest that if you are 6ft 8 that you try any bike out first. Most e-bikes are "one size fits all" frames, however I suspect that even with a longer seat post they might not fit you properly (check Sheldon Brown's seat pages for more info on how to get the right fit). For example I am a mere 6ft with 33" inseam, and with a 400mm seat post (the maximum that I could find) my Wisper (considered a fairly big bike) is only just big enough. I'm afraid you might not fit into the all category I don't know about the sizes of the other bikes you mention (I believe the Salisbury is on the small side) but one idea you might consider to get a good fit is getting a normal bike that you know fits you and then fitting an aftermarket kit. With £1000 you should be able to get one of the more expensive kits such as the Heinzmann or eZee. I believe the Electric Transport Shop also sell kit converted bikes built up. Battery replacement cycles depend on how far your commute is, how often you can charge it and of course on the battery technology and quality itself. With your commute 2 years sounds reasonable (though I'm sure flecc can provide a more definative answer), especially if you can charge it at each end (batteries don't like to be emptied, little and often is the best). Edited February 22, 200917 yr by torrent99
February 22, 200917 yr It's probably best to stick with the two year estimate since lithium batteries age regardless of usage. We don't have enough years of experience with them to be really accurate and they are developing all the time. As Vikki says, the brushes are very long lasting and dealer replaceable when the time comes anyway, so not a cost to worry about. As for the battery price, these have fluctuated wildly recently due to the current economic situation and exchange rate changes. It's probably best to ask a Powabyke dealer, or if you don't know of one, fill in the form on this webpage, marking it for the X bike, and send it to find your nearest one. You can note your contact preferences at the foot of the page. . Edited February 22, 200917 yr by flecc
February 23, 200917 yr Author thanks again. I certainly will try some bikes out when i get the time. A local bike dealer visited our work with a sample of ebikes and i got to try the wisper 905 sport and was impressed though out of my range at £1300. that had a 16inch frame and i felt ok on it so am hoping a 21inch powabyke will do just fine. I have already contacted my local bike shop and am awaiting their price for the X-6. (off topic)As an aside, i have emailed many shops and had few responses. I would have thought that in these times, people would be grabbing any bit of potential business that comes their way. Ive also visited many web sites and found them woefully out of date. My local bike shop who have confirmed they do stock the X-byke range only have the commuter and euro models on their site. I wonder how many shops are missing out on trade directly as a result of not being a bit more savvy online (/off topic)
February 23, 200917 yr Author Hi. 500 charges is full charges. If you charge before hitting 50% left you can extend that by quite a bit. Flecc will have more info on that as he is more confident of his figures. As to the brushes in the motor. My retired powabyke has done 7000+ miles and I reckon there's bags more in there (7,000+ more). Best regards. Vikki. now youve retired your powabyke, what have you replaced it with? Also, as you mention the miles, is this an estimate or did you have a computer on it? I have heard its not possible to put a computer on the x-byke as the forks are too far from the wheel.
February 23, 200917 yr Hi, Range is short, with a fair amount of pedalling I've got toward 15miles. If you find out how much another battery is, I'd be interested too, considering a second for range. I got my bike for Leisure Lakes, they are in the cycle scheme currently £733! can't remember how much shipping was although I think you can get it to a local store. Powabyke X6 Electric Bike 2009 In respect of cycle computer - you can fit it to the forks, but its a bit of a pain, I've put a wooden spacer with cable ties - a bit of a bodge, but it works.. Paul
February 23, 200917 yr I had a bike computer on it. The wireless ones worked and I had suspension forks but it wasn't the original frame. At the first battery change I moved all the electrics to a fully suspended frame. There's a post about on here somewhere. I had the Euro 6. I have a Wisper now as it has a much bigger range compared to the Powabyke. Vikki.
February 23, 200917 yr If you do go for an x-6 (I wouldn't bother with the x-24 for a 5 mile journey) then have a look at whether you can get suspension forks for it. It is a very hard ride. I've had mine for 3 months now and while I've had a few niggles I'm still very happy with it. There are plenty of dealers about and I'd definitely recommend you tap one up for a test ride.
February 23, 200917 yr Author Hi, Range is short, with a fair amount of pedalling I've got toward 15miles. If you find out how much another battery is, I'd be interested too, considering a second for range. I got my bike for Leisure Lakes, they are in the cycle scheme currently £733! can't remember how much shipping was although I think you can get it to a local store. Powabyke X6 Electric Bike 2009 In respect of cycle computer - you can fit it to the forks, but its a bit of a pain, I've put a wooden spacer with cable ties - a bit of a bodge, but it works.. Paul Thanks Paul, There seems to be some great prices on that site. I have asked them for a quote for the bike and all the bits (helmet, lock, lights and computer) which all comes to £875 inlcuding £10 delivery. Only disappointing thing about them is they classify the electric bikes under 'Women's Road Bikes' I asked them about forks but said they couldnt do it. I figure I'll give it a year and may re-apply for another voucher next year to get spare battery, forks etc (assuming you can get more vouchers!?!)
February 24, 200917 yr I got a second battery with my X6 at around £250. Never used and never will- my alternative solution is almost sorted now- meaning that I could have one battery (possibly 2 but I may be keeping one as an emergency standby) for sale. I did a similar thing with my cycle computer- a plastic spacer fashioned from a large chocolate block connector held on with insulation tape. I will replace it with one cut from a pencil eraser in due course- easily cut and profiled with a sharp knife. Hi, Range is short, with a fair amount of pedalling I've got toward 15miles. If you find out how much another battery is, I'd be interested too, considering a second for range. I got my bike for Leisure Lakes, they are in the cycle scheme currently £733! can't remember how much shipping was although I think you can get it to a local store. Powabyke X6 Electric Bike 2009 In respect of cycle computer - you can fit it to the forks, but its a bit of a pain, I've put a wooden spacer with cable ties - a bit of a bodge, but it works.. Paul
February 24, 200917 yr Author my alternative solution is almost sorted now What's your alternative solution? Presumably it doesnt involve the original batteries??
February 25, 200917 yr What's your alternative solution? Presumably it doesnt involve the original batteries?? I'm fitting a 20Ah Lithium Iron Phosphate (LiFePO4) set bought off eBay. That will give a far better range- three times or more and last longer (check out a few of the eBay ads for the claims). The connectors used by powabyke are standard connectors available for a few pounds at Maplin so will be an easy fit. Apart from more capacity the batteries also give more charge cycles so should last far longer than the other types. I just completed the purchase but have everything else in place for when it is received. Should only be a few weeks now..... Edited February 25, 200917 yr by alsmith
February 25, 200917 yr That's interesting Al. How much did you pay for the battery and how are you going to fit it to the bike?
February 26, 200917 yr Author I'm fitting a 20Ah Lithium Iron Phosphate (LiFePO4) set bought off eBay. That will give a far better range- three times or more and last longer (check out a few of the eBay ads for the claims). The connectors used by powabyke are standard connectors available for a few pounds at Maplin so will be an easy fit. Apart from more capacity the batteries also give more charge cycles so should last far longer than the other types. I just completed the purchase but have everything else in place for when it is received. Should only be a few weeks now..... Sounds fascinating! Would be interested to hear how you intend to fix it to the bike and perhaps some pics, if you'd be kind enough to oblige!
February 26, 200917 yr I paid around $470 including UPS shipping (bidding rather than buy now so saved a bit) for the 36V 20Ah battery. I got a small top box off eBay to fit it into, fits straight onto the standard rack. I had to add another refllector- the original is hidden by the strangely shaped box- it's not flat on the bottom so hangs over the back a little. It leaves some space between the seat and the box for a bit of luggage though. Since buying off eBay I've seen the same one for more money and with other names including Raleigh. It's like this on eBay The standard battery cable has been re-routed and fed through a hole drilled into the base of the top box (I drilled it large enough to feed the connector through rather than remove the connector from the cable and feeding the cable through a smaller hole. Maplin sell blanking and cable plugs to seal the hole to stop water ingress, I ended up using a blanking one but need to redo one, the first attempt works but could be improved.) Maybe removing the plug would have been better but this was easier. I got XLR connectors (Maplin) which are the battery connection ones on the standard battery and wiring to fit onto the LiFePO4 when it arrives leaving the X-Byke bits as standard so I can use the standard battery if needed. I'll post some pics when the battery arrives and it's all fitted. Edited February 26, 200917 yr by alsmith
February 26, 200917 yr Author Thanks, alsmith, I look forward to seeing them. Is this the sort of battery you ordered? This says its for 400-800W motors so do you think it would cause problems on the 250W Powabyke hub motor?
February 26, 200917 yr Thanks, alsmith, I look forward to seeing them. Is this the sort of battery you ordered? This says its for 400-800W motors so do you think it would cause problems on the 250W Powabyke hub motor? Yes. The motor draws the current it needs via the controller circuitry not the battery pushing out all it can all the time. If you look through various supplier ads they all have different suggested powers for the same capacity.
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