Pedelecs UK Electric Bike Challenge - "Power to Work....Ride Home"

[rsscott]

Hi everyone,

following on from the 'Beyond Presteigne.." thread, Richard and I are planning our very own Pedelecs event We are still very much in the ideas phase, but the plan was to come up with something that we can use to promote electric bikes as a viable alternative form of transport.

With current topical events such as road charging, congestion and so forth, we have come up with an idea whereby we will pit an electric bike against a car in a number of cities throughout the UK. The purpose of the journey will be a commute and the electric bike will be used to show that it provides the rider with a means of getting to work sweat free (almost!) along with the other benefits such as lower pollution etc.

Obviously the idea is not entirely new as the Suitable Transport ride in Australia has done the "riding in a suit" aspect and also filmed a "car v bike" journey, but we feel the time is right to have our very own UK version!

What we'd like to do now is open the idea up to the forum so we can gather input from everyone to enable us to finalise the event and get it into motion. We haven't decided how many cities to cover but some on the government road charging hit-list would be obvious candidates and therefore we will be looking for volunteers in those cities who would be willing to ride a bike and be filmed.

So, over to you. What do you think ?

cheers
Russ.

Russell Scott
Pedelecs UK
​

 

[flecc]

This has been done a number of times with bicycles in London Russ. I remember at least two occasions when TV has done it, once definitely BBC, either London news or the "inside" program that sometimes follows shortly after, the other might have been ITV's equivalent. It's also been done by London papers, and in my Croydon area it was done by the local Guardian newspaper.

In each of these it was usually a three way challenge, one on public transport, one in a car and one on a bike, and of course the bike always wins, although the car has got close occasionally, public transport always a sorry third.

Of course it's been Congestion Charging that's been the stimulus for most of these London events.

I think therefore your efforts would be best in other cities where it's not "old news" as such, although it's worth checking in each case whether they've already done this as well.
.

 

[rsscott]

That's right Flecc, the car v bike challenge is not new and as you say, London has heavily featured in this type of contest. What we are looking for though is a slant towards promoting electric bikes over say a normal pedal bike. What is it that could encourage someone to ditch the car?

Maybe the events could combine several challenges, not just who gets from A to B the quickest. There is obviously the sweat-free benefit of using an electric bike to ride to work, but perhaps some errands or hills etc thrown into the mix to show how versatile these machines are. Many people I know are hesitant to jump from a car to a bike especially if they haven't ridden a bike for years or are unfit. An electric bike can bridge the gap.

Also by holding a number of challenges throughout the UK, maybe we can build a bigger picture or some useful statistics.

Finally it should be fun!

cheers
Russ

Russell Scott
Pedelecs UK
​

 

[flecc]

That's true Russ, I just didn't know how much Joe Public would differentiate. I just have the feeling it's more than just the effort of cycling, the image seems to come into it a lot, especially amongst some of the ethnic groups who make up such a large part of our London population now.

Still, nothing ventured, nothing gained, so I wish it well.
.

 

[coops]

some ideas, suggestions & information...

Hi Russ, Richard & Flecc

Sorry for the delayed response on the subject, but its not due to any lack of consideration or underestimation of its importance

I like the idea of adding the new ebike "twist" ('scuse the pun!) to the bike vs car "challenge"; if it publicises ebikes' existence (almost unknown I'd say) and their pluses over pedalbikes (easier ("no sweat"! - you can use that if you want! ) esp. on hills) aswell as cars etc. (clean, quiet, more manoeuvreable, less space needed etc.) then its good.

Here's some ideas, suggestions & information for you:

It should be as comprehensive and realistic as possible: highlighting downsides of each mode aswell, such as range limits of ebikes and dangers from motor vehicles on shared roads; pressure on car drivers to exceed 30mph speed limits so as not to cause tailbacks etc.

The car should be driven within the speed limit for the challenge: it would be interesting to see how that affects the outcome, since I think that would be quite stressful & not easy, and would tend to equalise the journey times: its well known that in central London around 9-10mph maximum average speed is normal I will post in more detail elsewhere, but it may be of interest here that DfT data says average speeds in the 18 largest UK urban areas in 2004, excluding motorways, were around 17-18mph at peak times and 20-22mph off-peak, and that was with 58% of cars exceeding 30mph limits (2003)! - around one third of journey time is spent at or near stationary.

I've found traffic lights to be the biggest rate-determining factor in cross-city-centre trips, but still manage around 13mph minimum average journey speed over 4.5 miles by ebike.

I know I hardly need to say it here, but my main concern would be that any exercise of this type should be done in a factual & informative way: presentation is up to the individual, but it should be informative rather than "showy" or a "stunt" done for effect only: there's more than enough of that sort of rubbish in the world already!

There's a "love your bike" campaign in Manchester promoting bike use, run by friends of the earth with Manchester city council support, but I've not read yet of a bike/car comparison here, let alone ebike/car! But you never know...

I hope some of that is useful.

 

[rsscott]

thanks for that coops, I also find this link on the net where an electric bike was pitted against a bus, park and ride, car, electric car and a conventional cycle:

Electric bikes | Shropshire County Council

So we will need to come up with something unique that hasn't been done before.

cheers
Russ.

Russell Scott
Pedelecs UK
​

 

[JohnInStockie]

Hi everyone

I think that this is the critically most important aspect of electric bikes and the UK commuter problem in general, and the one that most people will struggle with.

Firstly and most importantly, you have to prove that the difficulties of all-weather cycling can be overcome in the UK otherwise people will not give up the car. This is critical and the main reason everyone has for not cycling that I have spoken too.

If you can prove that someone can get to work in all-weathers, and arrive feeling fitter, heathier, warm and dry then I think more people will take up the idea of electric bikes as a serious mode of transport.

As someone who has done just this (currently in the process of selling my car), I had to prove it could be done whatever the weather, and this is an area where more could be done by the manufacturers of e-bikes. As you all know, finding good kit, or reviews of good kit for commuters is not easy, as most reviews tend to focus on either road racers or MTBs.

This is where I think more should be done. Whats needed is comprehensive factual information on commuter accessories, where to get them pros and cons, and not the 'everything is great, just buy it' that we get on most cycle websites (For me, Icebike.com was what proved it could be done, if they can do it in that...).

I have spent a lot of time and a lot of money trying to get his right, but I am still not 100% happy with it, I can still see shortfalls in my kit.

However now that I am close to having the kit I need, and discouting initial startup costs for both the car and the bike (Car £5000, e-bike + accessories costs now £2200), I can look at the annual running costs very practically.

Running costs per annum.

Car vs eBike
------------------------------------
Miles 6440 vs 5060
Avg Spd(mpg) 18.6 vs 13.5
Fuel cost £1,250 vs £3.00
Mot £200 vs £0
Tax £185 vs £0
Insurance £500 vs £0
Maint & Serv. £400 vs £100
------------------------------------
£2535 vs £103

So financially its an absolute no brainer (no surprise here). It works out that I could buy a brand new bike every year and still save over a £1000 pa.

Additionally the exercise has to be considered. Where I work, over half have gym memberships of some sort or other, usually costing £30 - £40 a month. Thats another £400 a year they are paying, but most of them only get there at weekends for 1 or 2 visits if that. I am getting exercise every day of the week, twice a day. Light exercise in the morning, and moderate in the evening.

Thats why for me this isnt about cycles with assistance, its about a change to the status quo, and about promoting e-bikes as an alternative to the car, not a bicycle thats easier to ride.

John

 

[flecc]

The car should be driven within the speed limit for the challenge: it would be interesting to see how that affects the outcome, since I think that would be quite stressful & not easy

You're right there Stuart, in London someone could get lynched for trying it!

Commute starts are often very early here and consist of a series of high speed races between lights etc. I remember getting pulled over at nearly 7 am for 68 mph (30 limit) and a warning, the police officer politely saying that it was getting a bit late for that, remarking that half an hour earlier he wouldn't have bothered.
.

 

[coops]

Thats why for me this isnt about cycles with assistance, its about a change to the status quo, and about promoting e-bikes as an alternative to the car, not a bicycle thats easier to ride.

Well said John and to me a vital point too, only I couldn't put my ideas into words like you did

The cost, health & even speed benefits are fairly clear; if someone with experience of all-weather cycling & equipped to deal with it were to make this point convincingly, that would be the icing on the cake and hopefully the occasional slight discomfort of inclement weather travel (when properly equipped) may be sweetened by those benefits, especially costs .

Its one thing to cycle to work, in a suit if necessary, but to be able to do so in all-weather, however inclement, and arrive dry (from outside & no sweat!), in relative comfort, and in good time would be a coup for alternative transport in the UK!

Even those who still have a car for other trips could minimise its use in bad weather if they are persuaded bikes are still viable in those conditions, especially if a congestion charge may be levied if they don't!

Thanks Russ for the ebike test link: only other ebike vs car etc. test I've seen is this irish urbanmover field test - some of the detail is unclear, but more information than the shropshire test (would be interesting to know what bike they used, but not essential). Both tests also show the timesaving advantage of ease of parking of ebikes.

Thats another concern of bike use - security from theft -and if that was to be somehow included in the "test" it would make it more complete: many practical ways to protect from theft have been covered on this forum and if more ways were explored & implemented on ebikes either as aftermarket measures or by manufacturers themselves, maybe as options, that would help confidence in ebikes.

 

[Beeping-Sleauty]

Thats why for me this isnt about cycles with assistance, its about a change to the status quo, and about promoting e-bikes as an alternative to the car, not a bicycle thats easier to ride.

John

Absolutely spot on John,


and, with the uptake of bikes in London over the past couple of years, drivers have had to contend with more cyclists and drive accordingly, i did see some stats recently, i think it was CTC, showing that accidents involving vehicles & cyclists were considerably down, when expressed as a percentage.

 

[flecc]

i think it was CTC, showing that accidents involving vehicles & cyclists were considerably down, when expressed as a percentage.

It was TFL (Transport for London) who reported this in The Londoner paper originally. I can't remember the numbers, but it was a statement on the cycling increase from 2000 to 2006, and the very much smaller increase in accidents over the same period.

 

[Beeping-Sleauty]

and more good news...

It was TFL (Transport for London) who reported this in The Londoner paper originally. I can't remember the numbers, but it was a statement on the cycling increase from 2000 to 2006, and the very much smaller increase in accidents over the same period.

Yes Flecc, thanks for that reminder,

did you also see this:

Department for Transport - Sustainable travel demonstration towns
sustainabletraveldemonstrati5772

things are looking up,

beeps

 

[flecc]

Thanks for that link Beeps, that's really encouraging, good to know that it's not only London with the congestion charge and it's cycling improvements getting better.

A good thing with this approach is that if it spreads, the natural inclination of local authorities to compete with each other could lead to an escalation in the rate of improvements.

 

[Mandy]

speed restrictions

I saw on the news today that they are putting forward a bill to restrict petrol/diesel driven vehicles from going more than 20mph in Oxford city!
It may catch on and the cyclists will be overtaking the cars
Way to go

 

[Tiberius]

Hi Mandy,

That's very opportune of you to revive this thread at the same time as the Tour of Britain thread is running.

Maybe it all suddenly falls into place. The Pedelecs.co.uk Challenge could be a re-run of one of the Tour of Britain stages.

It complements the Presteigne event nicely:
Its at the other end of the summer,
Its a different challenge - endurance/distance rather than how far can you go in an hour,
Its not trivial, but its not impossible either, so it can cater for a wide range of bikes and riders.

Over to you, Russ.

Nick

 

[john]

This is where I think more should be done. Whats needed is comprehensive factual information on commuter accessories, where to get them pros and cons, and not the 'everything is great, just buy it' that we get on most cycle websites (For me, Icebike.com was what proved it could be done, if they can do it in that...).

I have spent a lot of time and a lot of money trying to get his right, but I am still not 100% happy with it, I can still see shortfalls in my kit.

I'd be very interested in what kit you found works for you and what doesn't. Please let us know. Perhaps there is already a thread on good/bad kit.

 

[Conal]

Electric Bike v Car

I ride an electric bike 6 miles from the end of the M11 to Hackney, one mile north of Bethnal Green Tube Station, and a few miles short of the Conjestion Zone. My alternative journey is the same length by car, via the A406 and the A12 (Eastway) past the Olympic park, parking five to ten minutes away from work and walking past the north side of Victoria Park to Mare Street.

I don't think this is sexy enough for you and has one major disadvantage: if the race is between a car and any bike; in peak hour traffic a bike would win easily.

The race could take place at a time of day when the times would be similar, 7:30am, and 6:30pm maybe, and it would be visually interesting. For the evening journey car would travel past Victoria Park and along the raised A12 past the construction site that will be the Olympic Park, before a short journey along the A406. Meanwhile the bike journey is through the busy centre of Hackney, down a small but steep hill, through South Millfields Recreation Ground (Park) before joining Leabridge Road at the Ice Rink and Riding Stables, and then through the Centre of Leyton (Bakers Arms) and out past Whipps Cross (the southern end of Epping Forest) to where I park my car near A406 at the Waterworks Roundabout just before the M11 north. The morning journey is the reverse of this.

The point about a normal bike verses an electric bike would be well illustrated as there is a usually a head wind against the cyclist in both directions (changes during the day?), and the steep hill on the way in would certainly start a sweat without power assist.

 

[Mandy]

Hi Mandy,

That's very opportune of you to revive this thread at the same time as the Tour of Britain thread is running.

Maybe it all suddenly falls into place. The Pedelecs.co.uk Challenge could be a re-run of one of the Tour of Britain stages.

It complements the Presteigne event nicely:
Its at the other end of the summer,
Its a different challenge - endurance/distance rather than how far can you go in an hour,
Its not trivial, but its not impossible either, so it can cater for a wide range of bikes and riders.

Over to you, Russ.

Nick

Hi Nick

I didn't notice that thread? I will have a looksy.
I just thought it was funny that they were restricting the speed limit in the city centre in Oxford, not that I am near there
Is it like a relay of leccy bikes across the country to include all?
Bike make against bike make or just endurance?
I must have a scout around but I would be up for it if it was that sort of thing?

 

[rsscott]

Amazing how quickly time flies, the original date of this thread was May last year! I probably won't have any time to organise anything this year now as my next job on the list is to completely revamp the main site.