Panasonic 18 Ah battery?

[magnuken]

Hi,
I have a German made Rixe Nancy S pedelec (same as Kalkhoff Pro Connect S) but only with a 10 Ah Panasonic battery. In my country (Finland) the new Panasonic 18 Ah battery cost 700 euros!

Please advice me if it is possible to by this 18 Ah Panasonic battery from somewhere to a more reasonable price?

I mean this battery:

 

[andyh2]

Not sure about postage cost, but 50Cycles
Accessories - Batteries and Chargers - Kalkhoff 18Ah Lithium B...
do them for £525 (about 600 Euro) including UK postage

 

[magnuken]

Not sure about postage cost, but 50Cycles
Accessories - Batteries and Chargers - Kalkhoff 18Ah Lithium B...
do them for £525 (about 600 Euro) including UK postage

Thank you for your advices. But I think this battery ordered from Britain is still very expensive. The delivery to Finland is £50, so the total cost is still round 650 €.

 

[Fordulike]

Thank you for your advices. But I think this battery ordered from Britain is still very expensive. The delivery to Finland is £50, so the total cost is still round 650 €.

If the 3.1kg weight is correct, for the technology, manufacturer prestige and battery capacity, I think you're getting a bargain there

 

[flecc]

It's not especially expensive, it's comparable with other top quality e-bike lithium polymer battery prices.

Of course in absolute terms it's a lot of money for a battery, but that's the price of e-biking and a major reason why e-biking is not more popular.

 

[lemmy]

Of course in absolute terms it's a lot of money for a battery, but that's the price of e-biking and a major reason why e-biking is not more popular.

It seems less good value than it is largely because you have to pay for it up front. Petrol would look even more expensive if you paid all at once yearly in advance.

I was wondering if it would be better to rent a battery, thus spreading the cost but I suppose in the end a battery costs what it costs and renting it wouldn't change that.

When I lived in rural France, we used cylinders of gas for the cooker, you'd pay a fee to 'buy' two cylinders, then when one was used, swap to the spare and swap the empty for a full one, paying for the gas only from then on. You could get full gas cyclinders 24/7 from any automated storage point.

I wonder if something similar could work with our batteries?

 

[gerryscott]

1 think it will be a bargain if it is proved on the long run about its life capacity and mileage claim.

 

[flecc]

When I lived in rural France, we used cylinders of gas for the cooker, you'd pay a fee to 'buy' two cylinders, then when one was used, swap to the spare and swap the empty for a full one, paying for the gas only from then on. You could get full gas cyclinders 24/7 from any automated storage point.

I wonder if something similar could work with our batteries?

We have this in Britain too with Calor Gas, BOC et al.

The problem with batteries is the decline in quality and performance over time, unlike gas cylinders which are always consistent.

The first battery you pick up might be at start of life and give a 30 plus mile range, the next one under 20 miles and strand you.

 

[amigafan2003]

If the 3.1kg weight is correct, for the technology, manufacturer prestige and battery capacity, I think you're getting a bargain there

Not really - it's only 25.2 v so 454 watts (25.2x18). I have a Lipo pack of 444 watts (44.4*10) that cost £100 and weighs 2.8kg.

 

[Deleted member 4366]

Not really - it's only 25.2 v so 454 watts (25.2x18). I have a Lipo pack of 444 watts (44.4*10) that cost £100 and weighs 2.8kg.

I was going to say the same thing. My 760 wH Ping battery only cost just over £300 and Li Ping is one of the most respected battery makers in the industry.

 

[oigoi]

I think the high battery prices are part of the marketing strategy to encourage you to trade in your bike and buy a new one

 

[indalo]

These battery prices, whatever your view of them, are the singlemost reason why the ebike market will never grow in the way it should.

Off-putting and quite simply unaffordable for many, especially the elderly, I can't see it changing any time soon. All forms of cycling should be encouraged and cycling should be cheap travel, even battery assisted cycling.

Indalo

 

[funkylyn]

These battery prices, whatever your view of them, are the singlemost reason why the ebike market will never grow in the way it should.

Off-putting and quite simply unaffordable for many, especially the elderly, I can't see it changing any time soon. All forms of cycling should be encouraged and cycling should be cheap travel, even battery assisted cycling.

Indalo

Totally agree.....maybe they should hand out free battery vouchers when we reach retirement age.....mind you, the way that is rising........make that a ''reaching 60 bonus'' perhaps

Sorry all you youngsters.....but there has to be SOME advantages to reaching 60

Lynda

 

[NRG]

I agree these batteries are expensive and the Ping battery is a good example of a quality battery at a reasonable cost, however, you can't equate a £100 worth of Lipos to the Panasonic battery.

Firstly theres economies of scale: RC Lipos are produced in their thousands, don't come in a casing to suit the bike, have no BMS or LVC protection and for the owner of the bike are definitely not plug 'n' play....factor in a less than simple plug 'n' charge scheme and the comparison does not add up.

Also, there are other factors to be added like import duty, VAT and the cost of stocking the batteries plus the contentious dealer markup.

Having said that I find the difference in price between the Panasonic 10Ah and 18Ah batteries somewhat baffling...

 

[flecc]

Having said that I find the difference in price between the Panasonic 10Ah and 18Ah batteries somewhat baffling...

The 10 Ah is a Japanese Panasonic product, the 18 Ah is a German BMZ battery company product for Kalkhoff. This introduces many variants of course, such as import duty, transport, taxation, base manufacturing costs etc, so they are likely to be inconsistent.

 

[amigafan2003]

Oh, I'm certainlt not saying £100 of lipo is comparble to £525 worth of ready packaged battery - but does a hard case, single charge method, construction and import duty really add £425 of value?

 

[tillson]

Oh, I'm certainlt not saying £100 of lipo is comparble to £525 worth of ready packaged battery - but does a hard case, single charge method, construction and import duty really add £425 of value?

Almost certainly not.

 

[NRG]

The 10 Ah is a Japanese Panasonic product, the 18 Ah is a German BMZ battery company product for Kalkhoff. This introduces many variants of course, such as import duty, transport, taxation, base manufacturing costs etc, so they are likely to be inconsistent.

Good point Flecc.

 

[NRG]

Oh, I'm certainlt not saying £100 of lipo is comparble to £525 worth of ready packaged battery - but does a hard case, single charge method, construction and import duty really add £425 of value?

Almost certainly not.

Well, hold on a moment....there's also the cost of 2 year warranty to add in as well that costs money, try sending your lipos back to hobbyking...plus the unit fits the bike. Sure somebody with a bit of know-how can save money and cobble together a third party battery replacement but you can't hold that up as a comparison. I agree theres a markup in there, there has to be....dealers need to make money so really it comes down to wether or not they are milking it...

 

[Kenny]

For capacity per £ the Kalkhoff battery is on par with any of the main manufacturers.
I think the "half a grand" price makes people gulp but if it proves as reliable and long lasting as my original Panasonic battery, I consider it good value.