Minefild

[Rustienuts]

Hi, I'm totaly new to pedelecs. I used to ride quite a lot but illness put a stop to this.
Now I'm feeling much better and in my early 50s. Got my trance x2 mountain bike out again and nearly had a heart attack haha. The hills killed me. Haha, couldn't believe that a once very fit man could become so unfit. Absolutely sole destroying.
I got out my old Raleigh Ogre Max that I never got round to getting rid of, stuck on some slimmer 80 psi road tyres and had a few short spins. Rode really well and helped me get back some enthusiasm. I'm sure you've heard it all before so won't go on about struggling with longer rides etc.
Anyway, recently I saw an older woman ride her bike up quite a steep hill in Richmond north York's and then I saw the light haha. Came across Pedelecs, as you do, and noticed loads of people with the same in common so am now seriously interested in an electrically assisted bike.

MINEFIELD.
After the last few days reading my head is exploding. It's a minefield out there. Maybe a little unfair but jeeze.
Do I spend a fortune and get a road type commuter, Kalkhoff pro connect xion x27 took my eye because of the long range, and keep up with my mates and use it for work. 34 mile round trip. Then I saw the Joule Prism where off roading and possibly commuting too may be possible. Then I was thinking if it's possible to convert my old Raleigh Ogre Max for a fraction of the price?
Then I saw all the different prices mainly from about £400 up to nearly a £1000 for a conversion kit. The Ogre is still in good nick, quite light and rides good enough for me at 13mph. Then I'd really like the range for work at 34 miles and fairly flat with just a few small hills. Don't fancy the battery on the back but don't think there's a bottle type big enough.
I think the idea of getting people out and about without have to spend a day in bed to recover is class.
Just one gripe. Why is the Kalkhoff pro connect xion x 27 £2195 in the uk but only 1995 dollars in the USA? The gap is even greater if you take into consideration the exchange rate. Don't get me wrong but I want people to make a reasonable profit but are the uk sellers being made to buy wholesale at a much higher cost that the Americans or just making a much bigger profit? What do they cost in Germany?
So many possibilties............Should be gratefull really but I'm Mr indecisive.
P.s. Im 6ft and 102kgs. Intend to get down to about 93kgs.
Thanks for reading.

 

[peerjay56]

Hi, I'm totaly new to pedelecs. I used to ride quite a lot but illness put a stop to this.
Now I'm feeling much better and in my early 50s. Got my trance x2 mountain bike out again and nearly had a heart attack haha. The hills killed me. Haha, couldn't believe that a once very fit man could become so unfit. Absolutely sole destroying.
I got out my old Raleigh Ogre Max that I never got round to getting rid of, stuck on some slimmer 80 psi road tyres and had a few short spins. Rode really well and helped me get back some enthusiasm. I'm sure you've heard it all before so won't go on about struggling with longer rides etc.
Anyway, recently I saw an older woman ride her bike up quite a steep hill in Richmond north York's and then I saw the light haha. Came across Pedelecs, as you do, and noticed loads of people with the same in common so am now seriously interested in an electrically assisted bike.

MINEFIELD.
After the last few days reading my head is exploding. It's a minefield out there. Maybe a little unfair but jeeze.
Do I spend a fortune and get a road type commuter, Kalkhoff pro connect xion x27 took my eye because of the long range, and keep up with my mates and use it for work. 34 mile round trip. Then I saw the Joule Prism where off roading and possibly commuting too may be possible. Then I was thinking if it's possible to convert my old Raleigh Ogre Max for a fraction of the price?
Then I saw all the different prices mainly from about £400 up to nearly a £1000 for a conversion kit. The Ogre is still in good nick, quite light and rides good enough for me at 13mph. Then I'd really like the range for work at 34 miles and fairly flat with just a few small hills. Don't fancy the battery on the back but don't think there's a bottle type big enough.
I think the idea of getting people out and about without have to spend a day in bed to recover is class.
Just one gripe. Why is the Kalkhoff pro connect xion x 27 £2195 in the uk but only 1995 dollars in the USA? The gap is even greater if you take into consideration the exchange rate. Don't get me wrong but I want people to make a reasonable profit but are the uk sellers being made to buy wholesale at a much higher cost that the Americans or just making a much bigger profit? What do they cost in Germany?
So many possibilties............Should be gratefull really but I'm Mr indecisive.
P.s. Im 6ft and 102kgs. Intend to get down to about 93kgs.
Thanks for reading.

Welcome Rustie,
I'm sure you'll get loads of advice, but here's my twopen'orth.
If you've got a bike you're happy with, and are confident enough to do a bit of work, seriously consider a kit - you can get 11.6aH bottle batteries now that fit to the frame where your waterbottle normally mounts (so long as there's room in the frame triangle) 10aH would be enough to complete your commute without a halfway recharge, in my experience, so long as you contribute to the power. Cyclotricity (mine), 8fun make reasonably priced kits, or you can buy direct from China and save a fortune, but no warranty.
If you decide to buy a ready built bike - test ride first (it should the law!! or at least lore).
As to price differentials - it's not uncommon for commodity prices in dollars to match the pound price, by the time import duties and taxes and of course the traders cut, is included. I think that if you bought the US version, by the time you've imported it you will have paid at least £2195 if not more. Also, are you sure you are comparing like with like? May the US price be for an older model of the same bike? Difficult to say without links etc.
Whatever you do, remember that there is a wealth of experience here to help you out. Good luck.

ps Do you live near Richmond? I'm N. Yorks, but further west.

 

[filsgreen]

Hi Rustie and welcome to the forum. I'm sure there will soon be a few members along to offer advice, but I'll give you my thoughts in the meantime. I was in the same position as you a month ago and asked the same questions. However, within a few days I had made up my mind and opted for the Pro Connect Xion 24. This has got the smaller 15.5 amh battery with a smaller range. However, it is the same bike as the Xion 27, but £500 cheaper. On my rides it is smooth, silent and I can ride at 15.5 MPH for at least 50 miles on the eco setting. Also 50 cycles gives great after care and although I was too late, they offered 20% discount on the rest of the Kalkhoff range on black Friday. Although I don't think they offer it on the Pro Connect. Yesterday they were offering 15%, I'm sure they would do a deal with you. I used to live in Scarborough, so I know the what the hills are like in North Yorks. I would be confident that the Pro Connect would deal with them.

Phil

 

[Deleted member 4366]

If you're unfit, and have a long commute, you'd probably be more comfortable with a speed control system rather than the torque control system. Most of the more expensive bikes have torque control, and most of the kits and cheaper ready-made electric bikes have speed control. The main difference is that with speed control systems, you can pedal without effort to give your legs a rest, or even use a throttle so you don't have to pedal at all, while as torque control systems multiply your effort, so you always have to put in some effort, hence the longer ranges that people get from them. You can't get something for nothing.

36miles is about on the limit for a 10aH battery and an unfit rider, but, after a week or so, your legs will strengthen, so you should be able to do it without re-charging half-way. there's some relatively cheap bikes from Woosh that have 15 aH batteries, like the Sirocco 2.

If you convert your bike with a kit, the cheaper ones from the UK have 9 or 10 aH batteries. If you want a bigger battery,you have to pay a lot more or by your stuff from China, where you can tailor your conversion with any power and distance you want.

 

[jackhandy]

Morning Rustie,

Try Lots of bikes Before you buy anything!

In your area, at 100kg & "of a certain age", I can't see you being happy with a bog standard 8fun or similar kit.

I've recently gone from an 8fun kit on a Carrera Kraken to a Cyclezee kit on a Trek Mamba...

Chalk & cheese - Don't get me wrong; the 8fun has been greatfun for the last year or so, but the Cyclezee has been a revelation.

I'd invite you to have a ride on my 2, but I live in Cornwall - A tad far for a day out

The other thing that's become obvious is that a 29er is vastly superior to a 26er for trecking on Cornish lanes & trails.

There are some great bikes out there, but Try Before you Buy.

 

[Electrifying Cycles]

Welcome to the forum. I would as everyone has suggested try a range of bikes including both hub drives and crank drives. In terms of high end bikes I would recommend trying a Bosch powered bike as well as panasonic hub drive (mainly featured on KTM's) which recently won a German test in a mountinous region.

Also nothing wrong with kits it just depends what you are after.

 

[Rustienuts]

Wow, thanks for the welcomes and all the help. What a friendly site.
Tried to find the link for the USA site where the Kalkhoff pro connect 27 was priced at 1995 dollars just for the comparison but had no luck and then came across another usa site selling them for 3499 dollars so looks like peerjay was right there haha. You get what you pay for
I’ll definitely take all your advice and test ride first. Need to find some shops up hear in the north east. Think there’s one somewhere in South Shields and sure I saw someone mention testing a pedelec at Penrith.
I live near to Darlington.
Kits? Where do I start? Looked at Cycleze and they say, (if I’m not wrong), they have kits from £500 to £2000 and kits vary in quality. Like everything I’d expect this and often it’s “buy cheap pay twice” even though there are usually some exceptions. Which kit did you buy please Jackhandy? It’s a shame my sister has just moved north from Kingsbridge in Devon or I’d have nipped down haha.
I read a thread that suggested getting a battery pack big enough so that you still have the required distance/range when they lose their storage capacity as they get older. Is this a factor?
Also looked at the Oxygen electric bike kit but couldn’t see a price and it was only 9Ah so not high enough as you people suggested.
I really like the look of the bottle battery on the kits and hate the look of those on a back rack.
I’d really have to do my research before I’d dare configure to order a kit from China.

Really fancied the Joule Prism too and it seems to be reasonably priced especially considering the Nuvinci gears. Little maintenance and just wash and go. A bit heavy though.
Saying that my mate paid a fortune for a carbon fibre over aluminium framed racing cycle to save a kilo. I could have lost a kilo in a few days and saved the money and he could do with losing one too.
It claims between 30 to 60 miles, (depending), and has, I think, the automatic pedal assist and independent throttle in case I feel like s%*t during a ride as D8veh suggested. Thanks for that.

The Roodog looked sexy too but what do I know.

I was also thinking that if I can’t manage my mountain bike off road any more then perhaps the Joule will allow me to get out again with my son? What do you think? Even though I still feel 21 inside I’ve got to be realistic and probably won’t get back to the fitness levels I once had. Heard that before haven’t you haha?
In all honesty I’m really undecided because I have literally only recently come across pedelecs.
I’ll definitely take on board all advice, (be stupid not to), and give myself to about Feb’ or March test ride and to make a firm decision on which route to take.
So thanks so much for bothering to reply. Really appreciate it.

Just one last thing; is my old Raleigh Ogre Max really viable for fitting a kit and which one?
As I previously said, the bike is still in good condition and I still potter around on it now and again.
It’s very firm on the road but rides ok. May be a set of suspension forks may soften the bumps but it’s not too bad. I don’t need to ride this too fast. Got a motorcycle for that.
Depending on advice, suggestions and price it may be worth giving China a go. If it doesn’t work out then I may get some of my money back and just buy an off the shelf bike. Where do I look for Chinese sites?
Feel a bit bad about that though because I’d really like to give British firms a chance. It’s hard enough for everyone as it is.
Thanks again, Rustienuts.

 

[holliday86]

Hi. I live in Newcastle and I've been to the electric bike shops in the area. There is electric cycle centre in Penrith, they sell and rent ebikes out and have a decent range in store. Best to email them first though to see what range they have in at any time.

The electric bike shed in south shields has about half a dozen actually in stock at any given time and although they are canny they tried to sell me a bike that they couldn't get in for me to test ride first... make of that what you will. There is team cycles at team valley and although they sell ebikes they don't actually stock them for you to test which is a bummer.

That's about it for the local area before you head to Whitby or Scotland. There are of course the likes of Halfords and other regular bike shops which stock ebikes .

Welcome to the forum (",)

 

[jackhandy]

Rustie - My kit, and the one I've just fitted for FalmouthDave, is the ezee mk2, rear wheel hub.

Runs out at about £850/950 depending on the choice of battery.

Lots of torque for the hills.

 

[Rustienuts]

Thanks jackhandy.
To the untrained eye and pure curiosity; does anyone know the difference between the Seagull E bike and the Joules Prism?
They look the almost the same to the naked eye.

If I wanted to get a bike to do some off roading, would a rear wheel hub drive be best?
I've ridden motor cycles on and off road most of my life and obviously they are rear wheel drive but a bike with a front hub drive like the Joule would surely feel awkard especially when light on the front when going up steep hills etc.

 

[trex]

Thanks jackhandy.
To the untrained eye and pure curiosity; does anyone know the difference between the Seagull E bike and the Joules Prism?
They look the almost the same to the naked eye.

If I wanted to get a bike to do some off roading, would a rear wheel hub drive be best?
I've ridden motor cycles on and off road most of my life and obviously they are rear wheel drive but a bike with a front hub drive like the Joule would surely feel awkard especially when light on the front when going up steep hills etc.

The Seagull bikes are made by Powfu Changzhou Haoling Motorcycle Parts Co., ltd--EEC Electric Scooter,Electric Scooter,Electric Bike,Motorcycle Parts,New Model Coming in 2013...
Powfu sells their frames to other Chinese assemblers, you may find them at Hangzhou Yabo for example Hangzhou Yabo Technology Co., Ltd. - Electric Scooter,Electric Bikes
I think Joule buy their bikes from these people and call them Prism.
For a little offroading, both front and rear hubs will side slip a little, chain drive is best.

 

[Rustienuts]

Thanks Trex.

 

[Cyclezee]

Kits? Where do I start? Looked at Cyclezee and they say, (if I’m not wrong), they have kits from £500 to £2000 and kits vary in quality. Rustienuts.

Hi Rustienuts.

Just to clarify, our kits range from the 8Fun BBS-01 at £350 excluding battery.

Complete kits including battery from Ansmann, eZee, Falco and Heinzmann range from £800 to £1700.