Legal EBIKE LOOPHOLES

[Ghost1951]

I dislike Mr F and would never vote for him, but i never heard hate cr@p from him.

He provides a perspective that chimes with about a third of the population's view.

 

[Ghost1951]

So does Kemi Badenoch.

There are a variety of perspectives in this country. They should all be aired and discussed.

 

[flecc]

Since the rise of Milton Freemans economic theories (MV=PT) western economies have been run with the intention of maintaining a certain level of unemployment although they dont shout about it, but its a major tool in restraining 'inflationary' pay growth..
So - in order to maximise 'happiness' why the hell not have all the folk who dont want to work take the Necessary unemployment slots.. Odd concept i know but...

We've moved on since then. We no longer call them necessary unemployment slots, now we call them Non-employed slots, people of working age who no longer want to work all their active lives.

I'm an early example. I made up my mind at the very young age of 16 that I intended to retire at around 50, achieved that in 1991 and retired for over 33 years since.

If I live for another three and a half years, I will have had as many years in paid retirement as years in work. That's a political nightmare, how can an economy pay for for that for everyone?
.

 

[thelarkbox]

While im pretty sure ive herd some unsavoury things from nigels lips on the news/utube etc.. i cant provide a link tho so will concede that it could have been mog, gove, or any one of a number of right wing gb news type pundits who raise my hackles on sight or sound. - they all kinda blend into the same talking head frothing at the mouth after a minute or two..

We've moved on since then. We no longer call them necessary unemployment slots, now we call them Non-employed slots, people of working age who no longer want to work all their active lives.

I'm an early example. I made up my mind at the very young age of 16 that I intended to retire at around 50, achieved that in 1991 and retired for over 33 years since.

If I live for another three and a half years, I will have had as many years in retirement as years in work. That's a political nightmare, how can an economy pay for for that for everyone?
.

Snap - ish - Unexpected redundancy and the death of a parent coincided to provide me with an opportunity im so glad i took -

 

[soundwave]

You claim benefits for as long as I remember. Nothing to do with bike crash.

jsa is not that much lol, i get pip because of what i have broken

 

[Ghost1951]

...comparing to what benefit frauds ride.

Ah yes - but of course, we went to work, day after day, decade after decade, and paid our taxes - LOTS and LOTS of taxes, for the likes of him, and of course because of all that toil and drudgery, we actually know the value of money, we remember the sweat of earning it, so we don't toss it around that lightly with the 'easy come, easy go' mentality, because it was never 'easy come' for us, was it.

 

[AndyBike]

Oh dear, this forum appears to be the Daily Mail readership central.

 

[Ghost1951]

Oh dear, this forum appears to be the Daily Mail readership central.

Don't you mean, 'Oh dear, this forum appears to have working age people boasting about how much money they can con out of the taxpayer, while advocating riding wildly illegal machines and boasting about their drug use and alcohol dependence?'

 

[Woosh]

Ah yes - but of course, we went to work, day after day, decade after decade, and paid our taxes - LOTS and LOTS of taxes, for the likes of him, and of course because of all that toil and drudgery, we actually know the value of money, we remember the sweat of earning it, so we don't toss it around that lightly with the 'easy come, easy go' mentality, because it was never 'easy come' for us, was it.

SW posted the x-ray pic of his leg. I am pretty convinced that he's entitled to pip. I don't see anything wrong.

 

[soundwave]

+ 4weeks in hospital 6hrs in the op and 6k worth of titanium in my leg and a few bolts.

 

[soundwave]

i cant paddle atm but i can push a button i just need ramrover armor and my 15kg 50mph ebike that can go that speed for 50 miles.

those will do tho

 

[AndyBike]

+ 4weeks in hospital 6hrs in the op and 6k worth of titanium in my leg and a few bolts.

I reckon you've been bloody lucky m8. I know of a cyclist who lost a leg in an offroad accident. Did so much damage they just couldn't save it.
And if you look into the numbers of cyclists who end up in a wheelchair, the numbers are shocking.

 

[Baz the balloon man]

Hi everyone
Again on the News BBC this morning a member of Motor Cycle Federation stating any pedelec with a throttle is illegal.

I have seen the threads on here stating a throttle that is limited to 4MPH without using pedals is legal.

Does any one have any legal documentation to prove this from someone like DVLA or is there government link we can access to prove this if stopped whilst using a throttle that is limited.
I suffer from Arthritis in my back Knees and hips at 60 years of age I like the little push off a throttle gives me but do not really use it after that.

plus I am now selling pedelec’s and do not want to give any customer the wrong advise.

I think it’s time for some one with a lot more experience than me to try straighten this out correctly on national news programs.

Cheers

Baz

 

[Az.]

EN 15194:2009 (E) 13 4.2.4.3 Start up assistance mode 4.2.4.3.1 Requirements EPAC can be equipped with a start up assistance mode up to 6 km/h designed speed or lower values as specified by the manufacturer. Unauthorized use shall be prevented. This mode shall be activated by the voluntary and maintained action of the user either when riding without pedalling or when the user is pushing the cycle.

https://www.flecc.co.uk/m/EN15194%20document.pdf

 

[matthewslack]

EN 15194:2009 (E) 13 4.2.4.3 Start up assistance mode 4.2.4.3.1 Requirements EPAC can be equipped with a start up assistance mode up to 6 km/h designed speed or lower values as specified by the manufacturer. Unauthorized use shall be prevented. This mode shall be activated by the voluntary and maintained action of the user either when riding without pedalling or when the user is pushing the cycle.

https://www.flecc.co.uk/m/EN15194%20document.pdf

4.2.4.1(d) 'The assistance shall be progressively and smoothly managed'

would seem to outlaw many low end speed control bikes.

 

[saneagle]

4.2.4.1(d) 'The assistance shall be progressively and smoothly managed'

would seem to outlaw many low end speed control bikes.

All the established brands, like Wisper, Juicy, Freego, Oxygen, Battribyke, etc had/have such systems and have/had full certification to EN15194, so something must be wrong with your understanding.

 

[Nealh]

Motor cycle fed don't know the law .
DVLA allow legal twist and go for bikes that comply with EAPC ruling if they have a V5 test certificate.
Although EAPC ruling state no twist and go allowed as this does mean a moped in use from a standing start there is no ruling to state one can't have a pedal first option throttle.

 

[saneagle]

Hi everyone
Again on the News BBC this morning a member of Motor Cycle Federation stating any pedelec with a throttle is illegal.

I have seen the threads on here stating a throttle that is limited to 4MPH without using pedals is legal.

Does any one have any legal documentation to prove this from someone like DVLA or is there government link we can access to prove this if stopped whilst using a throttle that is limited.
I suffer from Arthritis in my back Knees and hips at 60 years of age I like the little push off a throttle gives me but do not really use it after that.

plus I am now selling pedelec’s and do not want to give any customer the wrong advise.

I think it’s time for some one with a lot more experience than me to try straighten this out correctly on national news programs.

Cheers

Baz

Guys that go on the TV and stupid journalists that write in newspapers don't have a clue about the regulations. They're the last people you should listen to.

You can use any device you want to control the power and speed of your bike as long as the motor doesn't give power when the speed is over 15.5 mph, and the motor's power must stop when you stop pedalling.

There is no such thing as a throttle on an ebike. A throttle controls air into an internal combustion engine. Ebikes don't use air. Instead, they use electricity. The electricity is throttled by the controller. Every ebike of every type has a controller. The thing you call a throttle is just a sensor. It sends a signal to the controller in the range 1v to 4v. It doesn't itself control power in any way. Changing your assist level on an LED display also sends a voltage to the controller in the range 1v to 4v. Nobody cares about that!

 

[Nealh]

The sub class category for legal ebikes with twist and go start power is 250lpm which one can find on the DVLA website.

 

[Baz the balloon man]

Ok so if a bike say with a YOSE or KT controller that has the function to limit any throttle thumb , twist and or push button . Has a marked 250 w motor from say YOSE .

Has no certificate of any kind has not been inspected by any one.

Gets stoped by the police and possibly DVLA they regually have a big inspection probably 20 plus officers just up the road from me on the A5 in Cricklewood just near where Banksy drew the cat recently. ( sadly gone now ).

so I get stoped in this trap as I think they will soon be told to stop e bikes soon because of the national news .

So I ride into this checkpoint with my classic old Giant bike 250 w YOSE kit correctly restricted via the LCD screen ie speed and thumb throttle 6KPH and 25kph respectively.

I then get confronted by an officer who has been told any type of e bike with a throttle is illegal.

once I prove the bike and throttle is in fact legal is there a specific part of DVLA website I can click onto with my phone and prove them wrong before I end up with no bike and having to prove them wrong in court.