April 1, 20206 yr With two young children, I feel it is important to get them outside for the allowed exercise. Cycling is perfect, as it naturally keeps them apart from people. So we went for a family cycle ride and I am choosing hilly routes to get the kid's hearts pumping. They are loving it, but my wife not so much. I finally pursuaded her to try my Motus GT whilst I rode on her crappy 25 year old Halfords bike. Well that's torn it.... So without telling her, I have ordered her a Cube Elly Ride at what I think is an exceptional £1,495 for a Bosch Activline Plus powered bike. I would have considered others, but she is very fussy about looks (crappy Halfords bike notwithstanding) and she really needs a step through. The reaction she gives when it turns up will be an interesting one....! The Halfords bike (which in fairness has given exceptional service) will now be a pub bike!
April 1, 20206 yr With two young children, I feel it is important to get them outside for the allowed exercise. Cycling is perfect, as it naturally keeps them apart from people. So we went for a family cycle ride and I am choosing hilly routes to get the kid's hearts pumping. They are loving it, but my wife not so much. I finally pursuaded her to try my Motus GT whilst I rode on her crappy 25 year old Halfords bike. Well that's torn it.... So without telling her, I have ordered her a Cube Elly Ride at what I think is an exceptional £1,495 for a Bosch Activline Plus powered bike. I would have considered others, but she is very fussy about looks (crappy Halfords bike notwithstanding) and she really needs a step through. The reaction she gives when it turns up will be an interesting one....! The Halfords bike (which in fairness has given exceptional service) will now be a pub bike! You have really surprised me by buying anything to do with Bosch....After all the conversations about their awful products on Pedelec. I live in Germany, and ever since I have been riding e-bikes here, I have heard from many who find them totally overpriced, badly made and difficult to get repaired, as apparently the BS are only allowed to replace, not repair. The German websites on about e-bikes are really upset by Bosch.... Plus the fact that apparently, the electrical units "talk" to each other, and if any part is replaced by a non Bosch bit, everything stops talking. Then there is the part (not my area of expertise!) that Bosch are not following EU laws... Also, IMHO they are very over priced for theoir poor quality and support . I myself have almost accidentally avoided Bosch rubbish when I started, almost by accident! Apparently some people expect to replace expensive components once the guarantee has run out, I don't. I ride cheap e-bikes, but most repairs I can do myself after over 60 years riding bikes. I look at the money I originally saved, as being a guarantee in perpetuity... My current bike cost a little over 900 UK Pounds, has two batteries, and that includes the bike, the import duties, and the delivery costs from China. Other than a wrong type headset bearing installed, no problems. Bought almost 3 years ago. On my previous bike, just wear and tear over a 6 year period, the bike, which was given away with the same battery and charger, after buying it secondhand for less than 200 UK pounds. It was a cheap Lidl/Tesco/Aldi type e-bike....no frills, other that it was totally reliable.... I am ranting a bit here, but I hope you still got the message. The infos you need are all here somewhere, you just need to do some research on Pedelec. Regards Andy
April 1, 20206 yr Author You have really surprised me by buying anything to do with Bosch....After all the conversations about their awful products on Pedelec. I live in Germany, and ever since I have been riding e-bikes here, I have heard from many who find them totally overpriced, badly made and difficult to get repaired, as apparently the BS are only allowed to replace, not repair. The German websites on about e-bikes are really upset by Bosch.... Plus the fact that apparently, the electrical units "talk" to each other, and if any part is replaced by a non Bosch bit, everything stops talking. Then there is the part (not my area of expertise!) that Bosch are not following EU laws... Also, IMHO they are very over priced for theoir poor quality and support . I myself have almost accidentally avoided Bosch rubbish when I started, almost by accident! Apparently some people expect to replace expensive components once the guarantee has run out, I don't. I ride cheap e-bikes, but most repairs I can do myself after over 60 years riding bikes. I look at the money I originally saved, as being a guarantee in perpetuity... My current bike cost a little over 900 UK Pounds, has two batteries, and that includes the bike, the import duties, and the delivery costs from China. Other than a wrong type headset bearing installed, no problems. Bought almost 3 years ago. On my previous bike, just wear and tear over a 6 year period, the bike, which was given away with the same battery and charger, after buying it secondhand for less than 200 UK pounds. It was a cheap Lidl/Tesco/Aldi type e-bike....no frills, other that it was totally reliable.... I am ranting a bit here, but I hope you still got the message. The infos you need are all here somewhere, you just need to do some research on Pedelec. Regards Andy I love my current bike with a Bosch ALP, so far over 3000 miles with no motor problems. So based on my own experience, I was happy to take the plunge again. Time will tell if I have chosen poorly.
April 1, 20206 yr I love my current bike with a Bosch ALP, so far over 3000 miles with no motor problems. So based on my own experience, I was happy to take the plunge again. Time will tell if I have chosen poorly. I hope you are lucky, and of course its a personal choice. I was just seeking to give you a heads up from people here and in the UK, who have not been lucky with Bosch. After WW2, when I was born in the UK, if something was rubbish, it was called "a load of old Bosch", though due to British Tommys not speaking German when they returned to the UK in the late 40's, they spelled Bosch, Bosh when writing! But when speaking, it of course sounds the same! It has fallen out of use in this way apparently.... regards Andy
April 1, 20206 yr I love my current bike with a Bosch ALP, so far over 3000 miles with no motor problems. So based on my own experience, I was happy to take the plunge again. I agree i have had a Bosch alp for a year now and it has been excellent, I have also had a Wisper 905 for 30 months and that too has been excellent. Edited April 1, 20206 yr by Amoto65
April 1, 20206 yr I don'tI ride cheap e-bikes, but most repairs I can do myself after over 60 years riding bikes. I look at the money I originally saved, as being a guarantee in perpetuity... My current bike cost a little over 900 UK Pounds, my wheels cost more than £900 and my 2014 motor is still going as new even with a dongle. bosch motors can be fixed but you are right that if out of warranty you can not buy a bms or motor controller and the only option is a new replacement in that case. bosch/apple the batts are a fkn rip off!
April 1, 20206 yr my wheels cost more than £900 and my 2014 motor is still going as new even with a dongle. bosch motors can be fixed but you are right that if out of warranty you can not buy a bms or motor controller and the only option is a new replacement in that case. bosch/apple the batts are a fkn rip off! I do about 3,500 KMs per year on average, but never had a motor or a battery problem. Only occasional chain replacements about every 2 years, as they are not as stressed with a rear hub, as with a mid motor. Brake pads need yearly replacement, which I generally buy on ebay. My current bike has still the original nobbly tyres, but they will need replacing in the next 12 months or so. I have added a brake light, and I am thinking about indicators, but undecided as of now. I had to get a new headset bearing sent, and as they sent a set, I replaced both. It was wrongly installed in China, they used two bottom bearings. The top bearing is 1mm thicker....I replaced them myself in about 1 hours work, never having had to do that before, easy peasy! The mudguards have gone from white to cream colour, but that does not bother me, and the front disk caliper adjuster, which was plastic, crumbled, as UV light attacked it. I repaired it with stainless steel parts that I adapted (dead simple!) and it is back on the bike working perfectly. To the best of my memory, nothing else has gone wrong! I have not measured my mileage as carefully as I did with my previous bike, but I must be approaching almost 10,000 KMs, or 6,000 miles, or even a tad more...best guess. regards Andy
April 1, 20206 yr my bike has about 6k on it wanna race if you win you get my bike if you loose you pay me 10 grand in gold bullion https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=onAUrtwA_Ks:142
April 2, 20206 yr I’m just shy of covering 2000 trouble free miles on my cube acid one with its Bosch ALP motor. This is my second Bosch/Cube bike and when it’s time for a change I’ll be looking at the Bosch again. i know a few owners of Bosch powered bikes and they are all happy with their choice.
April 2, 20206 yr my bike has about 6k on it wanna race if you win you get my bike if you loose you pay me 10 grand in gold bullion that's what puts me off making crank drive bikes. They bring out too many boy racers. When a hub bike is derestricted, they can't go much more than 20mph-21mph on the flat. When a crank drive bike is derestricted, they can hit s-pedelecs speed quite easily.
April 2, 20206 yr You have really surprised me by buying anything to do with Bosch....After all the conversations about their awful products on Pedelec. I live in Germany, and ever since I have been riding e-bikes here, I have heard from many who find them totally overpriced, badly made and difficult to get repaired, as apparently the BS are only allowed to replace, not repair. The German websites on about e-bikes are really upset by Bosch.... Plus the fact that apparently, the electrical units "talk" to each other, and if any part is replaced by a non Bosch bit, everything stops talking. Then there is the part (not my area of expertise!) that Bosch are not following EU laws... Also, IMHO they are very over priced for theoir poor quality and support . I myself have almost accidentally avoided Bosch rubbish when I started, almost by accident! Apparently some people expect to replace expensive components once the guarantee has run out, I don't. I ride cheap e-bikes, but most repairs I can do myself after over 60 years riding bikes. I look at the money I originally saved, as being a guarantee in perpetuity... My current bike cost a little over 900 UK Pounds, has two batteries, and that includes the bike, the import duties, and the delivery costs from China. Other than a wrong type headset bearing installed, no problems. Bought almost 3 years ago. On my previous bike, just wear and tear over a 6 year period, the bike, which was given away with the same battery and charger, after buying it secondhand for less than 200 UK pounds. It was a cheap Lidl/Tesco/Aldi type e-bike....no frills, other that it was totally reliable.... I am ranting a bit here, but I hope you still got the message. The infos you need are all here somewhere, you just need to do some research on Pedelec. Regards Andy What is it with you and your hatred of anything Bosch? You express surprise that the OP "has anything to do with Bosch.... After all the conversations about their awful products here on Pedelec". The only people I see complaining about Bosch products, is you, and one or two others. For every one person that has had a problem, there are thousands that haven't, and are very pleased/satisfied with their Bosch motors and batteries. You need to take a more balanced view, and not slate the entire brand, because a few people are not happy.
April 2, 20206 yr that's what puts me off making crank drive bikes. They bring out too many boy racers. When a hub bike is derestricted, they can't go much more than 20mph-21mph on the flat. When a crank drive bike is derestricted, they can hit s-pedelecs speed quite easily. you on crack lol
April 2, 20206 yr What is it with you and your hatred of anything Bosch? You express surprise that the OP "has anything to do with Bosch.... After all the conversations about their awful products here on Pedelec". The only people I see complaining about Bosch products, is you, and one or two others. For every one person that has had a problem, there are thousands that haven't, and are very pleased/satisfied with their Bosch motors and batteries. You need to take a more balanced view, and not slate the entire brand, because a few people are not happy. If you haven't checked out the German e-bike web sites, or even properly checked out Pedelec, its probably not worth my time explaining it all again just for you. Nobody is even thinking that its every Bosch unit that fails in some way, but it appears to be far greater percentage than hub bikes, and once the guarantee is gone, repairs, or a battery replacement, are KNOWN to be expensive. The units are so programmed/designed, that parts from other manufacturers, simply are not compatible. You are STUCK with Bosch! I like companies that "put their money where their mouth is", Bosch does not do that... Have a great day Andy
April 2, 20206 yr If you haven't checked out the German e-bike web sites, or even properly checked out Pedelec, its probably not worth my time explaining it all again just for you. Nobody is even thinking that its every Bosch unit that fails in some way, but it appears to be far greater percentage than hub bikes, and once the guarantee is gone, repairs, or a battery replacement, are KNOWN to be expensive. The units are so programmed/designed, that parts from other manufacturers, simply are not compatible. You are STUCK with Bosch! I like companies that "put their money where their mouth is", Bosch does not do that... Have a great day Andy Where do you get the idea that the percentage of Bosch failures is "far greater" than hub bikes? Any evidence?
April 2, 20206 yr If you haven't checked out the German e-bike web sites, or even properly checked out Pedelec, its probably not worth my time explaining it all again just for you. There appears to be more people satisfied than not.
April 2, 20206 yr There appears to be more people satisfied than not. Yes, and I'm one of them for now. However, I'll see in 10 years time, 'more people satisfied than not' is not a very good measure. I am very shy of buying products with >10% 1 star Amazon reviews, even if they have 70% 5 star. If you do need spares, it's good to know the Intuvia display is Unisex, so at least that's one compatibility issue you don't have to worry about, https://www.amazon.co.uk/Bosch-Intuvia-1270020909-charcoal-standard/dp/B00ZOTRF7S/ref=sr_1_2?dchild=1&keywords=bosch+ebike&qid=1585829872&sr=8-2
April 2, 20206 yr Where do you get the idea that the percentage of Bosch failures is "far greater" than hub bikes? Any evidence? Primarily German e-bike websites. Do you read and understand German, if yes, search around on the wen using something like "Bosch e-bike probleme". Here is what I found, in bothe English and German:- https://www.google.com/search?client=firefox-b-d&q=Bosch+e-bike+probleme Have a good read, and also checkout Pedelec. I once likened the Bosch problems to owning a Laptop, and the normal type standard Hub e-bikes that one finds everywhere as to owning a Tower PC. The Bosch bike / Laptop, as long as its running good is great, small and powerful. But if it goes wrong, and you are not trained as to how to fault find on a laptop, most people, once the guarantee is gone, simply sell it as broken on ebay and buy a new one! Even opening up some laptops can bring more grief.... But a Tower PC, is easily opened, and parts can be cheaply bought and tried out, at worst, a new mainboard can be fitted for extreme problems, and many younger people today are either clever enough to do that, or have a good friend who is. I have long lost count of how many laptops I have owned, and if any of them went wrong, some were very difficult to fault find and repair. Parts far more expensive than a PC, and far less "powerful" than a PC of a similar cost! My last two laptops new, were almost 1700 UK pounds each, and when the last one went tits up, I gave it to a friend of mine who repairs them as a hobby. He used it for parts, as the mainboard had a short, due to a screen hinge breaking and it would have cost more than it was worth secondhand. I now have a great Fujuítsu tower, where I can see all the parts just by removing the side panel, and it is many times faster than my old i7 Laptop! That is basically the difference between Bosch mid motors and hub bikes.....I have had two hub bikes, never had a battery problem or a motor problem on either. Plus they cost FAR less than Bosch offerings. My present bike new, cost just over 900 UK pounds, bike delivered, two batteries, import taxes, and I could buy in all, 2 more for the price of a single Bosch, if something really radical happened, that I could not repair......some Bosch bikes cost at least 3 times that price!! Some (if not all) Bosch motors have plastic gears in them, OK for the dry Sunday in summer rider, but excepting when there is ice or snow underfoot, I ride up to 5 times a day, anything up to 20 kms each time.... Plus, all the power goes through the chain on Bosch bikes, and if it breaks, you have to either carry a spare, or push the bike home. I just use my throttle after removing the chain, and ride home on electric only!! Plus due to only muscle power going through the chain on hub bikes, the chains break and wear far less often on any hub bike! I see no need to waste money, and I am not someone who needs to have the latest fad make either. I want reliability and easy DIY repair procedures. I have managed to achieve that on 2 out of 2 e-bikes..... But everyone must make his own choice in such things, I was just drawing some here to the possible problems......that is not a crime as some here apparently seem to think in the way they react!!!! The truth is always best, whatever its about! Tell the truth and shame the devil, my mother always said. After being almost 74 years on this planet, no one has ever said a truer word than that. And Its people like Trump who cannot stand the truth, and due to that process, he is killing Americans......and a lot more will die soon because of that attitude..... regards Andy
April 2, 20206 yr Author With due respect, I started this thread just to have a little fun, to say how much my wife enjoyed riding an ebike for the first time and that I have chosen to surprise her with an ebike of her own. If Bosch is the source of true evil in the cycling universe, perhaps it might be worth setting up an individual thread, rather than derail what I hoped would be a light hearted topic.
April 2, 20206 yr Primarily German e-bike websites. Do you read and understand German, if yes, search around on the wen using something like "Bosch e-bike probleme". Here is what I found, in bothe English and German:- Bosch e-bike probleme - Google Search Interestingly about the same number of results as if you google "electric hub ebike problems"
April 2, 20206 yr If Bosch is the source of true evil in the cycling universe, perhaps it might be worth setting up an individual thread I really look forward to this topic ...........
April 2, 20206 yr Searching in German 'ebike bosch probleme' 15.7 million hits 'ebike hub probleme' 26.7 million hits (though the German for hub is Nabe, most of the hits are English even searching in German) This is not the first thread to have been thus hijacked.
April 2, 20206 yr if you want to be specific on google.de search for 'bosch motoren e bike probleme' returns About 2,220,000 results search for 'nabenmotor e-bike probleme' returns About 95,000 results (search for 'nabenmotoren e-bike probleme' returns same results) There are very few specific issues with the hub motors in view of their simplicity. Before you should me down, I have absolutely no inclination to rubbish anyone.
April 2, 20206 yr Poolepete it looks as though your Wife will be appreciative of your nice Present . I did the same thing 10 years ago for my Wife`s 70th , she has always ridden Bicycles and Motor Scooters starting with a Honda 50 in 1964 . I bought her a Batribike Quartz SE Folder and had it delivered on the very day . A big mistake as I didn`t ask her first ! Well it was supposed to be a surprise . She refused to ever ride it and I have been riding it ever since and she still insists I bought it for myself . After 54 years I still don`t understand how the female mind works . Not wishing to be labelled a male chauvanist , perhaps she thinks the same about me !
April 2, 20206 yr Interestingly about the same number of results as if you google "electric hub ebike problems" IYou seem to think that is a problem, let me say, its not. You can open them up easily and repair most failues on hub motors. Tell me how you handle a Bosch mid motor that is defective and the guarantee has long run out, and a defective rear hub where the guarantee has long run out? big BUCKS is the answer..... The defective hub motor can be replaced, with or without a new wheel, from many different sources, from about about 140 UK pounds, including controller and LCD. See here:- https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/750W-1000W-Electric-Bicycle-E-Bike-Conversion-Kit-Rear-Front-Wheel-PAS-LCD-Meter/273593943156?hash=item3fb3784474:m:mLsAzeSyxZ82iq-APIho8sQ Just the wheel and motor come even cheaper.... For Bosch I could not find a complete unit, which is apparently required due to the number of different parts that may be worn or already broken. The complete unit needs to be shipped to Bosch for replacement, apparently. I could not find a price for that. The hub wheel could usually be replaced by a reasonably competent biker, with a reasonable tool kit. Using a tester (under 10 UK Pounds) on a defective hub motor, a biker should be able to identify broken Hall effect sensors, easily replaced, damaged wiring, easily repaired, open coil/field, usually where the wiring connects internally, test outputs of the controller to make sure that is not at fault too! None of that is possible with Bosch units. Even the LBS that sells them is not allowed to fix the motors!! I noticed that new bafang mid motor units cost upwards of 450 UK pounds, I bet Bosch are even more expensive.....450 Pounds would easily buy 3 complete new replacement hub rear wheels and include a pre mounted motor, controller and wiring harness, but not the battery. That you can buy where you wish to buy!!! It's more than a sight difference in cost!! I hope this explains the difference! Andy Edited April 2, 20206 yr by Andy-Mat
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