Just when I thought it was getting safer on the road..

[Gubbins]

I know you should give bikes plenty of room, but.....

 

[Nealh]

Nice safe over take shame I tried to knock off the other cyclist I didn't notice .

 

[flecc]

The problem arose because the van obscured that car driver's view of the approaching cyclist until he was already wide in the overtake. That in turn was due to the mistake of following through, instead of waiting until he had his own view ahead. The last car driver who did this to me some while ago actually had the nerve to slow and yell abuse at me for being in the way!
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[Gubbins]

The problem arose because the van obscured that car driver's view of the approaching cyclist until he was already wide in the overtake. That in turn was due to the mistake of following through, instead of waiting until he had his own view ahead. The last car driver who did this to me some while ago actually had the nerve to slow and yell abuse at me for being in the way!
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And quite right too!! How dare you impede the traffic flow? I find that there are far too many instances of being overtaken whilst passing parked cars. In fact further up the road I was overtaken with prejudice whist I was overtaking a bus at the bus stop. Unfortunately cam had run out of memory...

 

[mike killay]

Being a grumpy old sod like me helps.
There is a keep left sign near my house and I always take a centre line through it. The sign is on a bad bend, the often repaired walls of nearby houses testify to this.
But many idiot drivers would squeeze past me and the sign given the chance.

 

[Gubbins]

My son says I should report this driver.... I think I will give it a try and see what response I get

 

[mfj197]

My son says I should report this driver.... I think I will give it a try and see what response I get

Not sure about that. It was a genuine mistake from his (or her) point of view and he/she obviously was aware of cyclists and giving them space. I was knocked off myself a week ago last Thursday and even though it was purely the van driver's fault (he pulled out on me whilst I was going round a roundabout - low sun blinded him to my presence) we shook on it, exchanged numbers in case and I haven't taken any further action. He was as shaken up as I was!

Michael

 

[Gubbins]

I don't agree in this case.. blind overtaking a cyclist who is overtaking parked cars by going to the wrong side of the road where there is also a parked car is hardly a simple mistake. What if I was a tractor or other vehicle for that matter.

 

[flecc]

I don't agree in this case.. blind overtaking a cyclist who is overtaking parked cars by going to the wrong side of the road where there is also a parked car is hardly a simple mistake. What if I was a tractor or other vehicle for that matter.

Nonetheless that driver meant well in giving wide clearance to the first cyclist. They were mistaken in that circumstance of course, but all drivers can learn from their mistakes and that driver will certainly have been aware at that last moment of the one they made.

So I think the benefit of tolerance should be given in this instance, given the clear initial good intentions towards cyclists. Pursuing the matter to a prosecution could well destroy that goodwill.
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[jonathan75]

Nonetheless that driver meant well in giving wide clearance to the first cyclist.
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I suppose so, that's true - although my god the incompetence.

The problem arose because the van obscured that car driver's view of the approaching cyclist until he was already wide in the overtake.
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Haha you mean in essence the problem arose because the driver didn't drive so as he could stop within the distance he could see to be clear, and furthermore gave no mind to what was in front of him. I know the stopping distance thing is in the Highway Code, but the "look in front and don't drive at people, especially not on the wrong side of the road" is all missing, I'm going to ask them to put that in the next edition ;-)

Sorry I couldn't resist the dig.

 

[Gubbins]

Just as an aside. . Did anyone see top gear regarding stopping distances? It would appear that modern cars can stop in half of the distance than what's detailed in the highway code.

 

[D8ve]

In the dry they can stop well but.
In the wet
When doing ones makeup
When concentrating on the radio
Etc all reduce stopping distance

 

[Alan Quay]

Have the Highway Code stopping distances ever been adjusted? They were nonsense when I took my test 25 years ago.

 

[Gubbins]

They were measured using an Anglia with dodgy brakes. .

 

[flecc]

Haha you mean in essence the problem arose because the driver didn't drive so as he could stop within the distance he could see to be clear, and furthermore gave no mind to what was in front of him. I know the stopping distance thing is in the Highway Code, but the "look in front and don't drive at people, especially not on the wrong side of the road" is all missing, I'm going to ask them to put that in the next edition ;-)

Naughty, that's very selective! I did post this as well:

"That in turn was due to the mistake of following through, instead of waiting until he had his own view ahead."

The driver wasn't "driving at people", since he couldn't even see the second cyclist until it was too late. And overtaking on the wrong side of the road is often a necessity and permissible.

Mistakes and poor road behaviour are not only the province of drivers, many of the cyclists I see in London are far from blameless, but I suppose that's ok with this forum.
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[jonathan75]

Yes that's fair enough, I worried about my point about 'driving at', although if one's driving on the wrong side of the road, it ought to be slower than normal in many instances (rather than faster) just so as to be able to come to a total halt before one hits an oncomer. Overtaking at speed is really just for non-'blind ' situations and one has to take account of the hypothetical speed of oncomers (so doubling the clear forward distance for stopping, I suppose).

I defer to what you're saying generally on these points, but did feel you were being slightly too generous to the driver in that instance. God really having a hairsplitting day today :-/

 

[Gubbins]

Perhaps a point is being missed here.. It seems to me its a case of "I am in a hurry and I am coming through no matter what" I see a lot of this type of behaviour these days be it a car, van or bike and on this stretch of road which is 30MPH in my car I am regularly overtaken.

This was a deliberate choice not just a bad or accidental one and the only thing that makes the bicycle relevant is the camera.

This still image shows that there is ample room for the bike to get through unscathed, but if the camera were in a car this thread, if discussed, would be substantially different.

I am aware that cyclists are often just as bad, jumping lights, riding on the footpath and more.. But they, we, are essentially anonymous on the road so difficult to take to task..

 

[flecc]

Perhaps a point is being missed here.. It seems to me its a case of "I am in a hurry and I am coming through no matter what"

I'm not missing that but take a different view of it. The motor traffic is usually running at higher speeds than cyclists and the latter at those lower speeds frequently pull out, often without looking or any warning.

Is it reasonable for the driver to slam on brakes on every occasion of it happening when they are far too close to slow more gently? Cyclists have responsibilities too, and one of those is not to suddenly change road position without due care. Every road users primary responsibility is their own conduct.
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[Gubbins]

I'm not missing that but take a different view of it. The motor traffic is usually running at higher speeds than cyclists and the latter at those lower speeds frequently pull out, often without looking or any warning.

Is it reasonable for the driver to slam on brakes on every occasion of it happening when they are far too close to slow more gently? Cyclists have responsibilities too, and one of those is not to suddenly change road position without due care. Every road users primary responsibility is their own conduct.
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Flecc, I think we are actually on the same page here and its often just seeing the other persons point of view and in this case the cyclist was making good progress, not weaving about but had to pull out to pass parked cars so.. pull out, mount the kerb and stop are the only options .. Option chosen was to pull out.
Putting myself in the drivers position.. a little bit "tongue in cheek"..
Here I am driving along in a 30 zone, bike up ahead approaching parked cars, so if I put my foot down I can pass him before he pulls out! Oh sh*t he is pulling out anyway, what is he thinking?... Options were speed up and overtake or slow down.. The road bears left and I cant see the road because there a small truck in front.. option chosen .. overtake anyway..
Put your foot down and pass before he pulls out.. How many times as this happened to you? and as a driver, how many times have you done this? Honestly!
From en electric biker point of view this is more of a worry as particularly on hills we are riding faster than normal making it harder for drivers to estimate our progress..

 

[flecc]

Put your foot down and pass before he pulls out.. How many times as this happened to you? and as a driver, how many times have you done this? Honestly!

I can honestly say I don't, since as a very long term cyclist I can see the danger in trying this, but yes, I have seen many drivers doing this and worse in these circumstances.

My attitude that I share road space, don't fight for it or demand it, influences my road behaviour, so I do what i can to help all other road users. That it delays me by microseconds each time doesn't bother me. Examples:

Cycling I use a mirror, yes, really use, so I time my parked car pass to not coincide with faster passing motor traffic. Alternatively where there are plenty of pavement cutaways and no pedestrians on a stretch of pavement, I pass a parked car on the nearside. On the narrow twisting lanes around here when drivers are stuck behind me, I wave them through the moment I see the way ahead for an overtake to minimise their delay.

Driving I always give way to public transport since that serves the whole community, not like me serving only me in my car. Cyclists get especial help to a degree some might feel extreme. For example recently, approaching a large roundabout I was aware of a cyclist's body language showing uncertainty, clear to me that he really wanted to go right through that dangerous roundabout but was uncertain hearing my approach. I slowed right down to his pace and gave him a gentle beep on the horn. As he looked around I leant right forward to the screen so he could clearly see me and with a smile waved him across in front of me. Momentarily surprised but then smiling, he passed across the front fully protected by the bulk of my car. That took far longer to explain than the second or so to do.

All this might give the impression of a very slow driver, but nothing could be further from the truth as my journey times show, I'm just slow where it's needed. However, I don't expect the same of other drivers. Many of them are relatively new and still gaining experience, many are under pressure of time for valid reasons, and some are simply incapable of performing to the same standards. Since the roads are for all of us I expect these and accordingly are tolerant. It's that tolerance that I do expect from everyone, if only because it precludes the all too common and dangerous road rage.
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