Is it Smarta to Wisper or Twist? I need Oxygen

[gonyosoma]

OK...so I have about 1250 for a new bike

I could get the Smarta GT from ETS for 999 plus the 100 they'll charge to cover the cycletowork scheme commission. Looks like a good package, Synergie Mistral (which i believe from this forum is its ancestor) got pretty solid reviews and seems reliable.

I could get the Giant Twist Express, or maybe the Freedom if I can find an 09 model at a dealer - for around 1250 - good brand, reliable, but they said in the shop the batter only lasts 300 cycles which doesn't sound great.

I could get the Wisper Eco, or maybe a 8Ah City - for 1250 - but thinking I might as well go for the Oxygen or the Smarta rather than this one.

Or I could take a punt on the new Oxygen Emate City - for 1250

Need it to commute 4miles each way, lots of hills, lots of pot holes so keen on comfort - do the suspension forks/seats on any of these bikes stand out to anyone? Anyone got any opinions on the comfort rating?

Appreciate the Twist doesn't have a throttle - which is fine - but does it have enough oomph for a big long hill (none near the Bristol Giant shop!). Don't seem to be able to find out the V/Ah rating - and sounds like a short battery life.

Tried the Oxygen at 50cycles (thanks Tim!) - seems similar frame to the Smarta, nice bike (though not as smooth a ride as the too expensive Kalkhoffs), is having a Lithium Polymer battery really that much better than Lithium ion?

Erring on the side of the Twist Freedom if I can get an 09 model, otherwise tempted most by Oxygen and Smarta - but can only get local support for the latter.

Help me - I'm going round in circles! All good bikes, and very little review of any of 'em!

 

[gonyosoma]

Forgot to add - also keen on the Twist as can get it in a 55cm frame - as I'm 6'2 - all the others are around 49cm.

And no idea how many cycles you get out of the Oxygen's lith poly battery.

 

[HittheroadJ]

Or consider a freego Eagle.

 

[Old Timer]

OK...so I have about 1250 for a new bike

I could get the Smarta GT from ETS for 999 plus the 100 they'll charge to cover the cycletowork scheme commission. Looks like a good package, Synergie Mistral (which i believe from this forum is its ancestor) got pretty solid reviews and seems reliable.

I could get the Giant Twist Express, or maybe the Freedom if I can find an 09 model at a dealer - for around 1250 - good brand, reliable, but they said in the shop the batter only lasts 300 cycles which doesn't sound great.

I could get the Wisper Eco, or maybe a 8Ah City - for 1250 - but thinking I might as well go for the Oxygen or the Smarta rather than this one.

Or I could take a punt on the new Oxygen Emate City - for 1250

Need it to commute 4miles each way, lots of hills, lots of pot holes so keen on comfort - do the suspension forks/seats on any of these bikes stand out to anyone? Anyone got any opinions on the comfort rating?

Appreciate the Twist doesn't have a throttle - which is fine - but does it have enough oomph for a big long hill (none near the Bristol Giant shop!). Don't seem to be able to find out the V/Ah rating - and sounds like a short battery life.

Tried the Oxygen at 50cycles (thanks Tim!) - seems similar frame to the Smarta, nice bike (though not as smooth a ride as the too expensive Kalkhoffs), is having a Lithium Polymer battery really that much better than Lithium ion?

Erring on the side of the Twist Freedom if I can get an 09 model, otherwise tempted most by Oxygen and Smarta - but can only get local support for the latter.

Help me - I'm going round in circles! All good bikes, and very little review of any of 'em!

The new Oxygen bikes are a further development of the older models and one of my bikes is a rebadged first generation Oxygen which has turned out to be a superb bike. Looking at the spec of the new Oxygens I don`t think you can go wrong.

 

[simonbarnett]

The new Oxygen bikes are a further development of the older models and one of my bikes is a rebadged first generation Oxygen which has turned out to be a superb bike. Looking at the spec of the new Oxygens I don`t think you can go wrong.

Smarta looks good value in terms of performance per pound, but the Oxygen has a 250 motor over Sparta's 200. I suspect 50C thought long and hard before adding their first hub bike since Ezee, so it should be good.

That said the Freego Eagle's had a couple of good mentions here for value.

 

[Mike63]

Hi...i tried the Oxygen at Presteign and quite liked it but as I re-call I couldn't switch the power off at the handlebar.

Presently I have a Wisper...getting past it's sell-by date I think but I like being able to instantly turn off the power when approaching junction or potentially hazardous situation.

.....Mike

 

[Old Timer]

Hi...i tried the Oxygen at Presteign and quite liked it but as I re-call I couldn't switch the power off at the handlebar.

Presently I have a Wisper...getting past it's sell-by date I think but I like being able to instantly turn off the power when approaching junction or potentially hazardous situation.

.....Mike

You can switch between pedelec and throttle on the Oxygen so if you switch to throttle only and don`t twist then you are powerless.

Dave

 

[Oxygen Bicycles]

Forgot to add - also keen on the Twist as can get it in a 55cm frame - as I'm 6'2 - all the others are around 49cm.

And no idea how many cycles you get out of the Oxygen's lith poly battery.

Hi Gonyosoma,

Our Safty Li-Po pack is estimated to get approx 500-700 recharge cycles and the life time of approx 2-3 years. The reason why we say 500-700 is because there is no golden rule to say how the battery is going to last. That is very dependent on the user itself and the way the battery is being used. I.e if you discharge the battery at the average discharge rate of 1C (13A in case of our Safty pack) then you are more likely to get less life of it if you were to dicharge it with 0.5C (6.5A).

In simple words that will depend on the number of various factors such as weight of luggage on the bike, your weight, how many hils you are having on your way etc etc. We give a 2 year warranty on our battery pack and give allowance to loose approx 30% of it original capacity. In fact all batterries loose memory but we try to be honest and explain what battery ageing is about. Our Li-Po is based on the compound cathodes and that's the way to go in the li-ion world.

best regards

Andrew

 

[Oxygen Bicycles]

Hi...i tried the Oxygen at Presteign and quite liked it but as I re-call I couldn't switch the power off at the handlebar.

Presently I have a Wisper...getting past it's sell-by date I think but I like being able to instantly turn off the power when approaching junction or potentially hazardous situation.

.....Mike

Hi Mike,

... and many thanks Dave for explaining the whole thing. You see Mike I had (still have) exactly the same concerns as you when approching junction or cars in front of me. I hate when I have a pedelec mixed up with throttle mode because I continously cycle and move cranks. Then the motor kicks in and I need to pull brake levers while I want to slowly approch the junction.

That is why we run all the electrics in the totally different way to other brands. You either have throttle or pedelec mode and the pedelec is not mixed up with throttle mode. Both modes work independently from each other so when you approach traffic you are on the throttle mode and just don't twist it and you can slowly approach the junction. When you need power just twist and go and there is no need of pressing the power button. It's just a different set up which I find quite handy and its based on my own experience.

I also tried bikes with button on/off on the handlebar but incidentally I managed to switch the power off on few occasions during the gear changing when I didn't want to do it. I wonder if you experienced that as well?.

You should perhaps try the new Oxygen Emate one more time if you have occasion. In London anyone can try one at the new shop of 50 Cycles in Richmond. You can take a bike for a spin to Richmond park and try it in every terrain.

The benefit of the lap in Richmond park is that you have a flat, moderate hills and even really killer hills that you are unlikely to do on the push bike but Emate just runs through them.

Best regards

Andrew

 

[eddieo]

I like a power button on handlebars it makes absolute sense to me. It is all about control and safety. and yes I have hit the power button now and again by accident going along, it is no big deal and hardly a justification for not having one......

So with this bike the throttle is always "live" is that right?

If it is I don't think this is very good, as I lost count early on with the times I forgot to hit the off button and accidentally leaned on the throttle and bike ran away particularly getting on and off the bike....... It took my wife ages to get used to this, and after a similar incident would not go near her bike for a while.......

 

[Scatty]

Hi i have the Giant Twist & the battery says 600 cylces not 300 that would of been the old ni-mh battery on the older models. Iam loving the bike still after many months i use it everyday only about 10 miles a day for work but i find im in eco all the time. Not that hilly where i live so i couldnt tell about the power up them big hills but i can say that at junctions it is like having a throttle the torque system is excellent. .

 

[Mike63]

You can switch between pedelec and throttle on the Oxygen so if you switch to throttle only and don`t twist then you are powerless.

This is not the same and I think that while the Oxygen is high on my list, the lack of an ON/OFF switch...like the Wisper will stop me buying this bike.
I would be quite happy without a throttle but I must have the switch.

....Mike

 

[Oxygen Bicycles]

So with this bike the throttle is always "live" is that right?

If it is I don't think this is very good, as I lost count early on with the times I forgot to hit the off button and accidentally leaned on the throttle and bike ran away particularly getting on and off the bike....... It took my wife ages to get used to this, and after a similar incident would not go near her bike for a while.......

Hi Eddie,

With this bike the throttle is only "live" in the throttle mode. There is no throttle on the pedelec mode so simply you can have either one or another mode.

I do value your feedback very much and it's certainly good to know what others thoughts are. I do ride the bike regularly and honestly I find it so useful especially when riding through busy streets in London such as the Strand. Then I can decide how much power do i need and pedelec does not kick in in while I'm between two busses. Twisting the throttle accidentally personally has never happened to me. I actually need to do quite a twist to have a throtte running but again it's good to know your feedback here, that's much appreciated.

If you are Eddie from Croydon (not that far) then please feel free to come down to Richmond and try the Emate in the Richmond Park. If you are not in the position of buying new bike I'm still very keen to go with you for a spin and just know your feedback.

And this invitation is to anyone who would like to try one out. Just let me know and we arrange a ride for you. There is also lovely 50 Cycles shop with lovely kalkhoffs here so perhaps you can try the real German pedelecs here as well.

best regards

Andrew

 

[Oxygen Bicycles]

This is not the same and I think that while the Oxygen is high on my list, the lack of an ON/OFF switch...like the Wisper will stop me buying this bike.
I would be quite happy without a throttle but I must have the switch.

....Mike

Hi Mike,

Same as with Eddie. I would be delighted if I could give you the opportunity to try one out and see how it's like. as for now feedback from the users is most important for us. If you let me know where are you based perhaps we could try to arrange a spin for you.

best regards

Andrew

 

[eddieo]

OK I still don't get this either or......you switch between modes from where?

In pedelec mode is 100% power available? as with the wisper the last 20% is on the throttle. so while out exercising I hardly use a throttle except on some hills. when away in my motorhome I may use throttle more to get back if a bit knackered.

I may well come down and have a look as I want to try a Kalhoff anyway, but unlikely to change from a wisper purely because of the support. had a problem with new bikes battery within a few days a new battery exchanged on the doorstep via a courier.....

Batteries: this is the elephant standing in the corner of the room IMO. Both Wisper and recently ezee use Advance batteries? They are expensive but have a good reputation. Oxygen bikes use a totally new (to e bikes) manufacturer? The battery is nearly half the price of a bike, so if I was parting with my hard earned cash on a new bike, would I risk my money on a new bike with unknown battery, or similarly priced establish make......The incentive would have to be based on price and there is not enough difference from established makes to me

 

[Mike63]

I have gone off the Wisper somewhat, mine is only 18 months old and there is very little power, I think it is caused by loose wires at the handlebar and the joint box.
I've looked at the wires but they don't lend themselves to being easily tightened up.

What's also happened ...and this suits me...when I switch on it goes straight into pedalec mode and I find that I'm happy not useing the throttle which sometimes works and sometimes doesn't.

I'm thinking to buy my next bike without a throttle and high on my list is the Urbanmover UM44S...hopefully available shortly.
It also has front fork suspension which is a must for me, when I hit a pothole and there are plenty, it almost breaks my wrist on the Wisper.

I was assured that the whole bike..the UM, with the exception of consumables is guaranteed for a minimum of 2 years,
If i'm spending over a grand I don't think it unreasonable to expect it to be problem free for 2 years.

We don't have a decent dealer in my corner of West Yorkshire but I can buy the UM from Halfords which must give me a certain level of protection....certainly not the same level as Wisper bikes or 50 cycles but they're not near me.

In view of the long distance to 50 cycles, the lack of an ON/OFF switch on the oxygen and thelikelyhood of loose wires on the Wisper, I'm thinking Urbanmover may be the way to go.

.....Mike

 

[simonbarnett]

I have gone off the Wisper somewhat, mine is only 18 months old and there is very little power, I think it is caused by loose wires at the handlebar and the joint box.
I've looked at the wires but they don't lend themselves to being easily tightened up.

What's also happened ...and this suits me...when I switch on it goes straight into pedalec mode and I find that I'm happy not useing the throttle which sometimes works and sometimes doesn't.

I'm thinking to buy my next bike without a throttle and high on my list is the Urbanmover UM44S...hopefully available shortly.
It also has front fork suspension which is a must for me, when I hit a pothole and there are plenty, it almost breaks my wrist on the Wisper.

I was assured that the whole bike..the UM, with the exception of consumables is guaranteed for a minimum of 2 years,
If i'm spending over a grand I don't think it unreasonable to expect it to be problem free for 2 years.

We don't have a decent dealer in my corner of West Yorkshire but I can buy the UM from Halfords which must give me a certain level of protection....certainly not the same level as Wisper bikes or 50 cycles but they're not near me.

In view of the long distance to 50 cycles, the lack of an ON/OFF switch on the oxygen and thelikelyhood of loose wires on the Wisper, I'm thinking Urbanmover may be the way to go.

.....Mike

Not by me, but it's probably a cinch to add a kill switch after purchase to any throttle set-up.

 

[Old Timer]

To fit a kill switch would be easy but of course you might not want to do any work on a new bike and that`s understandable.( you should see the add ons on my bikes

For me it`s all about what drives and feels right and is comfortable because there is just no substitute for that, full stop. Adding a few customisations is what it`s all about

Do yourself a favour before making the choice! get a ride on an Oxygen.

 

[eddieo]

I have gone off the Wisper somewhat, mine is only 18 months old and there is very little power, I think it is caused by loose wires at the handlebar and the joint box. I've looked at the wires but they don't lend themselves to being easily tightened up.
.....Mike

Have you called Wisper service? Normans number on wisper link above. They are normally very helpful. Surely you need to get it sorted whatever you decide to do.....

 

[garrence]

This is not the same and I think that while the Oxygen is high on my list, the lack of an ON/OFF switch...like the Wisper will stop me buying this bike.
I would be quite happy without a throttle but I must have the switch.

Hi Mike

I've been the very proud owner of an Oxygen e-mate for the last week and think it's amazing. I've given a few expert cyclists some rides and they've raved about how well balanced it is and how well it rides.

You wrote that Richmond is a long way for you to travel from West Yorkshire to take a test ride, so if you'd like to visit me in Sheffield you're welcome to take mine for a spin. (Send me a private message on here with your phone number and I'll call to arrange).

Things controlling the power are:

1. Toggle button to switch between pedelec mode and throttle mode.

2. Throttle twist on the left part of the right handle bar. (Not the whole grip).

3. You must pedal for the motor to work when in pedelec mode. (Throttle mode works without).

4. Both brake levers are wired to stop the motor if pulled.

Personally I treat pedelec like a car "cruise control" - its handy when you want constant speed over some distance so you don't wear out your throttle hand (accelerator pedal) but I prefer not to use it around town. I use throttle mode around town because

• I can quickly accelerate from a standing start because it will respond without having to pedal.
• I can use however much I want, without it simply trying to keep me at 15 mph
• I can use short bursts or just pedal
• It seems safer than using pedelec.

If you prefer pedelec and want to turn it off then simply push the button to turn the pedelec off. You don't need to turn the throttle, but having the throttle there if you need it could be a lifesaver!

Gary