hydrogen fuel-cell kit

[lectureral]

I have always thought that a hydrogen fuel-cell would be the long-term future - here is one in the Times today - bit pricey though and the range is not as good as I imagined it would be.

Cycling is a gas - Times Online

 

[eTim]

£2.5k is not bad for 60 mile range though, when CD/DVD players, flat screen TV's etc first came out they were £2.5K plus, within 2 years they were below £1000 now you can buy them for £100.

I predict 3-5 years before this is mainstream, so as long as your batteries can last until then you'll be OK.

Supply of Hydrogen might be a problem though. My future ebike is dubbed:

2H2 + O2 => 2H2O bike

 

[eddieo]

just read the brief article in the Sunday times myself...... the generator is £2.500, you fill it with water, and it costs 45p for a tank of fuel presumably enough for the 60 miles. looks hopeful imo


Acta - Our Products

 

[flecc]

The tank storage method is identical to the way hydrogen from charging is stored in NiMh batteries, so not quite as radical as it might seem at first. The tank is basically an NiMh battery, charged with hydrogen instead of electricity, but the chemistry is the same. Actually it's just a more cumbersome way of doing things, one might just as well use an NiMh battery.

This is Italian again, back in 2001 Aprilia demonstrated a hydrogen fuel cell version of their "Enjoy" e-bike, but nothing came of it, despite a Times Magazine Innovation Award of the Year.
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[Oxygen Bicycles]

fuel cells not to good, not yet

Yes, fuel cells it's indeed a very interesting solution. I used to think it could really work very well on our tricycles and future electric bikes. I even went to Germany to visit one of the leaders in fuel cells and electric drives for work bikes. The company called Clean Mobile really had to offer a lot of interesting solutions and indeed they had excellent base of engineers in Munich. There was however a lot of drawbacks in that solutions such as weight and size of the fuel cells generator itself.

Also on the price wise side it was hell a lot too much as the system (fuel cell + motor) was 3.5K. So lets be honest not too good for a potential customer plus the system required special frames to fit etc and was too heavy.

Maybe in the future when the technoogy moves forward more Oxygen will reconsider this new innovative option of extending the range.

best regards

Andrew

 

[flecc]

This one from Ata isn't a fuel cell as we understand them though, it's a two part NiMh battery.

A fuel cell uses hydrogen or methane together with a catalyst in the presence of oxygen to produce water, releasing ions in the process which power the motor.

An NiMh battery cell in principle contains electrodes in water which is hydrolysed by charging. The oxygen produced remains free in the cell while the hydrogen produced is absorbed by a rare earths hydrate. Connecting a load like a motor results in the hydrogen leaving the hydrate, recombining with the oxygen to return them to water, while the released ions power the motor.

What Ata have done is break that NiMh battery into two parts, the water and electrodes combined into the charger as one part, the cell casing containing the rare earths hydride called the "tank" being the other part.

This potentially has the advantage that the part the bike carries is lighter than carrying a one piece NiMh battery, enabling it to compete with lighter Lithium-polymer batteries. The disadvantage is short life, NiMh hydrides usually lasting around 400 charge cycles.

Therefore I don't see this method as a way forward, we need a true catalyst based fuel cell.
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[Oxygen Bicycles]

This one from Ata isn't a fuel cell as we understand them though, it's a two part NiMh battery.

A fuel cell uses hydrogen or methane together with a catalyst in the presence of oxygen to produce water, releasing ions in the process which power the motor.

An NiMh battery cell in principle contains electrodes in water which is hydrolysed by charging. The oxygen produced remains free in the cell while the hydrogen produced is absorbed by a rare earths hydrate. Connecting a load like a motor results in the hydrogen leaving the hydrate, recombining with the oxygen to return them to water, while the released ions power the motor.

What Ata have done is break that NiMh battery into two parts, the water and electrodes combined into the charger as one part, the cell casing containing the rare earths hydride called the "tank" being the other part.

This potentially has the advantage that the part the bike carries is lighter than carrying a one piece NiMh battery, enabling it to compete with lighter Lithium-polymer batteries. The disadvantage is short life, NiMh hydrides usually lasting around 400 charge cycles.

Therefore I don't see this method as a way forward, we need a true catalyst based fuel cell.
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well yes Flecc you are right. the real fuel cell does use the mathanol or hydrogen, it is however very costly solution and still a lot has to be done to implement it to real world mass production. The solution I saw in Germany was using the methanol and oxygen being used to produce electricity stored in the battery pack. BTW you can see the picture attached or see the link Clean Mobile to learn bit more about it. Maybe one day when the technology moves forward we will be able to use this solution on our electric bikes, who knows

 

[flecc]

Yes, we can but hope Andrew. One thing's certain, waiting for battery and fuel cell advances does teach patience!
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