Help with bike choice for old guy :-)

[Blaster Bates]

Hi
I am after a bit of advice from this group who will know a lot better than me. I am mid sixties and reasonably, but not tremendously, fit. I do cycle now but enjoy being outdoors longer and taking in different places, I have spoke to a couple of people with E bikes on my travels and they have convinced me to purchase one.
My typical ride would be 2-3 hours and around 20-25 miles, I try to stay off road as much as possible but most of the cycle paths I use tend to be asphalted anyway, the roughest terrain I encounter will be canal tow path or a bit of gravel,
I am 5-8in (175cm) and 12st. Should frame and wheel size be an important factor ?

I have done some digging around and have found I can probably get something to suit my needs for around £1000 as it does not have to be anything special.
Most of the kit seems pretty standard but I am unsure of the finer points to make a decision, I want something reasonably comfortable, able to use without the assist and reliable elecs/battery.
I have got it down to a choice of 3 but am very open to suggestion for something more suitable :-

Woosh MTB
Focus Whistler from Sprockets cycles
S2 from Emovement

Thanks in advance for any help at all.

Blaster

 

[sjpt]

Woosh are good.

It looks as if the Whistler has a very small battery. Sprocket don't seem to mention battery size at all on their site, but an old (sold out long ago) advert from Evans says just 7ah. You might be pushed to get 25 miles unless its very flat and you use minimal assist.

Can't see anything about the S2, you might add a link.

 

[Blaster Bates]

Hi
I am after a bit of advice from this group who will know a lot better than me. I am mid sixties and reasonably, but not tremendously, fit. I do cycle now but enjoy being outdoors longer and taking in different places, I have spoke to a couple of people with E bikes on my travels and they have convinced me to purchase one.
My typical ride would be 2-3 hours and around 20-25 miles, I try to stay off road as much as possible but most of the cycle paths I use tend to be asphalted anyway, the roughest terrain I encounter will be canal tow path or a bit of gravel,
I am 5-8in (175cm) and 12st. Should frame and wheel size be an important factor ?

I have done some digging around and have found I can probably get something to suit my needs for around £1000 as it does not have to be anything special.
Most of the kit seems pretty standard but I am unsure of the finer points to make a decision, I want something reasonably comfortable, able to use without the assist and reliable elecs/battery.
I have got it down to a choice of 3 but am very open to suggestion for something more suitable :-

Woosh MTB
Focus Whistler from Sprockets cycles
S2 from Emovement

Thanks in advance for any help at all.

Blasterhttps://www.emovement.co.uk/product/hybrid-e-bike-s3-electric-mountain-bike-hard-tail/

The Woosh Rio MTB | Massive power and advanced components

The new Woowsh Rio MTB is a high performance, high specs e-bike, 100mm magnesium suspension fork, GXP crankset, hydraulic brakes front and rear, semi-hidden battery, hi-speed hub motor, 22kgs.

wooshbikes.co.uk

 

[Blaster Bates]

Woosh are good.

It looks as if the Whistler has a very small battery. Sprocket don't seem to mention battery size at all on their site, but an old (sold out long ago) advert from Evans says just 7ah. You might be pushed to get 25 miles unless its very flat and you use minimal assist.

Can't see anything about the S2, you might add a link.

Mountain E-Bike S-2 | E Movement

The E-Bike S-2 from E movement is a beautiful example of how electric bikes can have great style. Available in two great finishes. Black and yellow or black and green. The matt finishes not only gives its great sheen but a beautiful feel to touch. This model our S-2 electric bike offers a...

www.emovement.co.uk

 

[Nealh]

10ah/360wh battery capacity is the minimum you should be looking at.

MTB I feel is so yesterday, I'm mid 50's and go with 700c CX type bike set up.

 

[georgehenry]

Old but not dead!

 

[Chainring]

The link to the S2 seems to be a load of old flannel and bad spelling. 10ah is the minimum you would want, as suggested. Do you want crossbar or low step? Mid-sixties is not old. (As I keep telling myself, as I struggle up the ladder to paint the windows). Keep looking - do not rush.

 

[sjpt]

Mountain E-Bike S-2 | E Movement

The E-Bike S-2 from E movement is a beautiful example of how electric bikes can have great style. Available in two great finishes. Black and yellow or black and green. The matt finishes not only gives its great sheen but a beautiful feel to touch. This model our S-2 electric bike offers a...

www.emovement.co.uk

The S2 is technically illegal, with 350w motor. Specs are self-contradictory, says 25kph max in one place and 18.4mph elsewhere (also illegal if it means assisted speed), and disagrees about rider weight =100kg or 150kg. Also only claims range of 35km, and that's probably an 'up to', and doesn't mention battery capacity that I can see. It is 48v, which is a plus.

Only a little bit illegal, you'd probably get away with it.

 

[Nealh]

The link to the S2 seems to be a load of old flannel and bad spelling. 10ah is the minimum you would want, as suggested. Do you want crossbar or low step? Mid-sixties is not old. (As I keep telling myself, as I struggle up the ladder to paint the windows). Keep looking - do not rush.

I only use the ladder now to climb on to the tower platform, so nice to be standing up right on a flat base.

 

[Blaster Bates]

The S2 is technically illegal, with 350w motor. Specs are self-contradictory, says 25kph max in one place and 18.4mph elsewhere (also illegal if it means assisted speed), and disagrees about rider weight =100kg or 150kg. Also only claims range of 35km, and that's probably an 'up to', and doesn't mention battery capacity that I can see. It is 48v, which is a plus.

Only a little bit illegal, you'd probably get away with it.

isnt one quote miles and the other kilometre ?

 

[sjpt]

isnt one quote miles and the other kilometre ?

Yes, but 25kph is 15.5mph (legal), not 18.4 mph.

I notice the 21 mile range is on the throttle, so that isn't so bad.

But The twist throttle being positioned in front of the right handle grip to ensure this bike sits within the UK legislation looks very doubtful; I don't think there is anything in the regs that allows a twist throttle because of where it is placed. They are basically not allowed except to assist up to a few mph; but there are complications in the regs that may mean its ok if your have to pedal first before the throttle works.

(I'd be put off by the animated icons on the website, but maybe that's not how to judge the bike.)

 

[Amoto65]

Woosh, Wisper and Juicy are all good bikes that are worth considering.

 

[Chris M]

On an ebike your average speed will be higher so either your typical ride will take less time or your typical ride will cover more miles. I ride mostly along trails and am in my mid sixties and I found myself going further on an ebike simply because I could. I had eaten up the miles I normal did in a lot less time than I was used to. You could probably do with a range of circa 50 miles to support your type of cycling. If you don't have a decent battery you may well start to get "range anxiety". I have a bike with a Bosch Active Line Plus motor and a 500 watt battery. I could have got away with the 400 watt battery for my rides but it is good to know you always have plenty in reserve; its not nice to get down to 1 blob of battery. Also the bigger battery means that there is usually plenty in reserve if you decide to go out on the spur of the moment and haven't re-charged the battery since your last ride.

I would recommend a bike with a torque sensor as this provides a natural feel to pedalling. You don't feel that you have a motor pushing you along, its just that your legs feel so much stronger than they used to!

 

[Blaster Bates]

Good morning
Thanks for all the replies so far, I am a little further on but still undecided. Of the 3 bikes I mentioned in the opening post I have dismissed the Focus due to what I understand as probably being under powered for what I need at 7ah.
I have now considered another bike Basis Kite Z205A which has 13ah and 250w £949.

To be fair to Emovement and the S2, which I am strongly considering at price £999, the guy I spoke to there was the most helpful and approachable I have encountered so far, both my local bike shops pretty much didn't really seem interested when I visited,both trying to push me to buy something around 2k, which to honest seemed to be more bike than I need.

I have some grasp of elecs but there appears to be some conflicting advice around regarding power. I had the idea that the important number I should consider is the "ah", and most advice was to avoid single figures.
The Basis Kite is 13ah with 36v and 250w which seems reasonable.
The S2 is 48v and 350w however cannot see an ah number quoted.

I am a little confused as one poster mentioned 350w being illegal ( not worried about being 3mh over limit) and another poster (post was helpful) recommending going higher than 400w for what require.

Is there an outstanding difference between the two bikes that I should consider ?
Or do you have another recommendation ? (I would politely add some of the bikes suggested have been out of the range that I want to pay) I have been using a Specialized Stumpjumper for 15 years which cost my kids around 3k, it is in virtually showroom condition and never been used to its full potential so I feel £1000 this time will suit me

Thanks to everyone for the help so far.

 

[sjpt]

I am a little confused as one poster mentioned 350w being illegal ( not worried about being 3mh over limit) and another poster (post was helpful) recommending going higher than 400w for what require.

A pedalec must have (a) a motor rated and marked at 250w or under and (b) be limited to a mac of 15.5mph assisted speed to be legal to ride on road without registration,insurance etc, or on bridleways at all. As I mentioned, you'll probably get away with something slightly over, or even significantly over.

That 250w is continuous power. Most 250w motors have peak power of 400w or so to over 700w.

The Basis Kite Z205A looks a sensible basic bike. You get a bit more with the Woosh Rio such as suspension fork and hydraulic brakes which may (or may not) be an advantage for your riding. Possibly a better quality battery, can't tell from the Basis specs. Almost certainly better customer service with the Woosh as well. But an extra £200.

 

[Chris M]

Just for clarity. When I recommended a 500 w battery or at least a 400 I meant watt hours. Nothing to do with the motor power. Unfortunately there seems to be two ways of stating battery strength - amp hours and watt hours. 13ah at 36v is 468wh which is going to be good. 7ah at 36v would only be 252 wh which wouldn't get most of us very far at all. Everyone's usage of power is different but I reckon on typical undulating trails with a good surface I get 60 to 80 miles out of a 500wh or 13.9ah battery ( about 4.25 to 5.75 miles per ah). I would therefore expect a range of circa 30 to 40 miles from a 7ah battery. On the other hand if I hit my local hills which are quite steep I use turbo all the time and I can use 100wh or 2.8ah in just 4 or 5 miles (or about 1.5 miles per ah) . Along a canal towpath I use the lowest assist level and battery usage is negligible, I would reckon the same 100wh or 2.8ah would take me over 25 miles (over 10 miles per ah) . This is my experience but everyone will using their motor assist differently and riding on different trails so power used will vary greatly. I would expect fitter cyclists will be doing better than this.

 

[Woosh]

Or do you have another recommendation ? (I would politely add some of the bikes suggested have been out of the range that I want to pay) I have been using a Specialized Stumpjumper for 15 years which cost my kids around 3k, it is in virtually showroom condition and never been used to its full potential so I feel £1000 this time will suit me

Your 15 year old Stumpjumper is in a different league to my bikes, leave alone bikes like the Emovement S2 or the Basis Kite.
You have at the moment Fox fork, hydraulic brakes, XT gears.
It would be terrible to change your ride to no name Chinese fork, cable operated brakes, Tourney derailleur and Chinese no name crankset.
I have sold out the Woosh Camino, otherwise I would have recommended it to you.

Take a look at the Woosh Faro.

The Faro | Very Lightweight Electric Bikes from Woosh

The Faro: very lightweight road electric bike from Woosh with hydraulic brakes and in-frame 36V 8AH battery or 20AH external battery.

wooshbikes.co.uk

If you don't have bolt through maxles on your Stumpjumper, I would suggest a conversion. The new Stumpjumper is very difficult to convert.

 

[Hightechpete]

If you don't have bolt through maxles on your Stumpjumper, I would suggest a conversion.

Agreed.

 

[Blaster Bates]

Good morning
Thanks for the help so far.
Chris M for the clarity regarding power which initially was confusing me.
Woosh bikes I will give you a call on Monday to ask a couple of things, I only really considered your Rio at first.
What is the main differences between the Faro and Camino ?
Would the wheels and tyres on them cope with basic off road conditions like towpaths and a bit of gravel, nothing too rough ?

My Specialized is the M4 model from many years ago and in showroom condition simply because it was bought for me and is way over spec for what I require and not the most comfortable road bike so I would be reluctant to add to the weight and convert. At my age a new bike will take me into early 70s and the elecs will allow me to do the distances I prefer as I am not a serious biker, 2/3 hours twice a week and the odd 45 mins 80/20 path/road.

I realise at £1000 I am at the lower end of the spec so I don't want to get this dreadfully wrong and regret it in a couple of months.
Emovement also do an S4 listed at discounted to half price ? at £799 and again it looks reasonable for my needs.

I don't intend to search further and now it is a straight choice between :-
Emovement S2 or S4
Basis Kite
Woosh Faro or Camino

I will then attempt sell the Stumpjumper and hopefully recoup some of my outlay

Again thanks for your advice and patience.

 

[Woosh]

Emovement S2 or S4

Battery accounts for about one third of the cost of the bike.
you do pay for battery capacity, a 10AH battery like the one on the S4 is worth about £200, a 48V 10AH battery like the one on the S2 worth about £300, a 36V 17AH on my bikes is worth about £400.
The S2 has better LCD and it has mudguards.
On cost, the S2 is still better value for money than the S4.

I think for your need, the woosh Rio MTB is a bit overkill. It is made for every day commuting in comfort. The RST Omega fork on the Rio MTB alone costs about £100 on ebay. The sensored hydraulic brakes on it costs another £100 on the net, the GXP crank set about £75.

The crank drive Krieger with 13AH may be a good compromise but I only have very few left in stock.

What is the main differences between the Faro and Camino ?

the Faro is designed as a lightweight (16kgs) road bike. You can ride it comfortably without power. It have rigid fork, aero-wheels, 28mm wide smooth tyres, hydraulic brakes, 8-speed rapid shifter, in-frame 8AH battery, and stealthy, very quiet motor.
The Camino is designed for commuting in all weather. It has the ubiquitous Suntour NEX suspension fork against the lighter rigid fork on the Faro, wide 42mm 700C hybrid tyres, same hydraulic brakes, same 8-speed with rapid shfter, but a bigger 15AH/17AH downtube battery and a stronger motor and consequently 4kgs-5kgs heavier.
I ride my Faro more than a year now, often without power. Still very happy with its lightness.

Would the wheels and tyres on them cope with basic off road

Not the Faro. You can ride it on canal paths but unpleasant on forrestry tracks which are much bumpier.
The Camino having both suspension and wider tyres swallows both with ease.

 

[E-Pashley]

The wonderful thing about advice on a bikes is that there as many opinions as there are bikes.

There are 2 very important considerations - you need the range for your journeys and most importantly, you have to feel comfortable with the bike.
Obviously these are unusual times and trying to arrange a test ride is more of a problem, however shops should still be able to offer this service. (I know my local eBike shop is operating an appointment system with pre-booking for test rides.)
With different bikes applying the power in different ways, as well as the obvious consideration of ergonomics, I would highly recommend trying any bike before committing to a purchace.